P065E code coming up again.

[PaulR]

Yesterday the CEL came on again and when I had it read it came up as P065E, the "intake manifold tuning valve performance bank 1". This time I will try cleaning out the MAF sensor, that has never been done, and while I am at it, the spark plugs which have 30,000 miles on them. That is, if the ever weather ever warms up. Any thoughts on that?

[AstraFasta]

Typical Astra fixes for this code are:

- Clean throttlebody (all around and behind plate). Easy to do and there are tutorials here to help prevent knocking out throttle calibration. Be VERY careful with fingers as this can spring back and take a few off.

- Clean MAF. Only use MAF cleaner (NO other cleaners). Do NOT touch the wires.

On occasion, that code could be from a vacuum leak but I don't see many complain about that with the Astra (yet).

While you are working, a clean air filter will help keep the MAF and throttle body clean. So clean airbox and replace airfilter (use normal paper airfilter as the fancy oil ones cause a lot of problems with the Astra).

Make sure to gap plugs properly; there are posts here with gaps and plugs that others have used. Look at plugs for unusual wear or color; there are on-line guides to help.

Run a few tanks of premium fuel (from a Major supplier) as this will help clean injectors etal. The cleaners are very advanced from the big companies.

[fdryer]

PaulR, there are several previous posts about P065E, intake manifold tuning valve performance. From a simple search, (two posts) one mentions under warranty to replace the entire intake manifold while the other had GM try replacing the valve part with the error returning. No resolution to both threads - its unfortunate for many asking for help here and never replying with a resolution to close out their thread. Based on limited info and almost a total lack of finding the exact part in one GM parts site, this may mean buying an intake manifold ($$$). I do not believe GM/Saturn exhausted all their inventory yet but finding a single part that may be part of the entire intake manifold assembly may be the only way to search for both items then searching for just the valve. I'm presuming the valve is replaceable unless its a permanent part of the intake manifold. It might help if an Astra member that knows what part of the intake manifold is the tuning valve takes a picture and attaches the image here as a thumbnail.

Posted 4/6/11 - http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=165703

Posted 5/8/12 - http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=180323

From a reputable site describing P065E; https://www.obd-codes.com/p065e

Two replies from justanswer.com;

https://www.justanswer.com/saturn/59...ode-p065e.html

https://www.justanswer.com/saturn/7n...auto-code.html

One GM parts site lists the entire intake manifold for $476(!? ); https://www.gmpartsclub.com/oem-part...bC1sNC1nYXM%3D. You might have to search overseas Astra sites for more info and how Europeans deal with this error code, possibly replacing just the valve (if it can be replaced) or if the intake manifold is removed for cleaning and maintenance to make the existing valve operate again. From my brief searches, this valve is electrically commanded to control vacuum to open/close a door. My guess is the manifold uses two sets of internal runners, one for normal driving, the other for performance to take advantage of tuned intake ports. Please correct me if I'm mistaken. As a side note, my L300 V6 engine uses a similar setup and describes the same tuned ports for daily or performance driving with the intake manifold runner control solenoid as the equivalent of your intake manifold tuning valve.

[AstraFasta]

Thanks fdryer. Very few people here needed to replace the intake manifold on the Astra fortunately.

PaulR - The popular fixes I noted above have a good probability of working and are cheap & easy. They address popular failure modes of the Astra. I would try them before spending big dollars.

[fdryer]

I found this error code very di$turbing as I've followed these odd issues. If this were my car, I'd certainly follow your advice first to see if the error code can go away on the lowest cost repair. If not, I'd probably figure out which part on the intake manifold is causing the error and either remove it for examination and bench testing or remove the manifold and examine it for anything unusual. I'm not a money tree and it comes natural for me to learn as much as I can before tearing things apart as opposed to paying GM to replace something I can do. Hopefully, your advice is the exact remedy for possibly an expensive repair.

[AstraFasta]

Originally Posted by fdryer

I found this error code very di$turbing as I've followed these odd issues.

Me too.

This is an odd one. A few of these types of Astra faults require big dollar repairs as the sensors or controllers are not sold individually. Fortunately, most of the popular Astra "bugs" are cheap to fix.

[izdalion]

Just my 2 cents-
I had this exact code and it drove me crazy trying to find the cause. I usually do my own work on most of my cars and this had me stumped so I brought it to a local shop. They found a leak of some sort in my brake booster housing oddly enough. I would have never made that connection on my own thats for sure but I ultimately swapped the booster and haven't encountered the code since. I hope this helps.

P.S. This wasn't a cheap fix but I went with a used part and that cut the cost dramatically.

[PaulR]

Originally Posted by fdryer

PaulR, there are several previous posts about P065E, intake manifold tuning valve performance. From a simple search, (two posts) one mentions under warranty to replace the entire intake manifold while the other had GM try replacing the valve part with the error returning. No resolution to both threads - its unfortunate for many asking for help here and never replying with a resolution to close out their thread. Based on limited info and almost a total lack of finding the exact part in one GM parts site, this may mean buying an intake manifold ($$$). I do not believe GM/Saturn exhausted all their inventory yet but finding a single part that may be part of the entire intake manifold assembly may be the only way to search for both items then searching for just the valve. I'm presuming the valve is replaceable unless its a permanent part of the intake manifold. It might help if an Astra member that knows what part of the intake manifold is the tuning valve takes a picture and attaches the image here as a thumbnail.

Posted 4/6/11 - http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=165703

Posted 5/8/12 - http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=180323

From a reputable site describing P065E; https://www.obd-codes.com/p065e

Two replies from justanswer.com;

https://www.justanswer.com/saturn/59...ode-p065e.html

https://www.justanswer.com/saturn/7n...auto-code.html

One GM parts site lists the entire intake manifold for $476(!? ); https://www.gmpartsclub.com/oem-part...bC1sNC1nYXM%3D. You might have to search overseas Astra sites for more info and how Europeans deal with this error code, possibly replacing just the valve (if it can be replaced) or if the intake manifold is removed for cleaning and maintenance to make the existing valve operate again. From my brief searches, this valve is electrically commanded to control vacuum to open/close a door. My guess is the manifold uses two sets of internal runners, one for normal driving, the other for performance to take advantage of tuned intake ports. Please correct me if I'm mistaken. As a side note, my L300 V6 engine uses a similar setup and describes the same tuned ports for daily or performance driving with the intake manifold runner control solenoid as the equivalent of your intake manifold tuning valve.

Just finished cleaning out the top and bottom air box, all of the tubing, replacing the air filter and disconnecting the MAF sensor from the associated tubing. Upon inspection, the inside of the MAF sensor was as clean as a whistle, I mean like new clean. The air filter element that I took out at 35,000 miles looked good too. Assembled it all back together and the CEL remains on. Now I am supposed to go farther down the chain and clean the throttle body? Oh yes, I ran some Seafoam through fuel tank last week.

[AstraFasta]

I still would spray the MAF with MAF cleaner. Then clean the throttle body. Make sure to use the correct cleaners, respectively!

The Astra is very sensitive to those being uber clean. Runs much better also. I need to clean them every 20k miles to clear codes.

[PaulR]

Originally Posted by AstraFasta

I still would spray the MAF with MAF cleaner. Then clean the throttle body. Make sure to use the correct cleaners, respectively!

The Astra is very sensitive to those being uber clean. Runs much better also. I need to clean them every 20k miles to clear codes.

I have the MAF sensor safe cleaner. What about for the throttle body? Will the standard carburetor and choke cleaner do, or will it again have to be specific? Do I spray it right down the hole or try to wipe it clean with some on a rag? I want to do this before I replace my spark plugs. And before I junk the POS. Hah.

Did I break off the wire connector that goes to the MAF? I don't know because it came off in two pieces. I will never figure out how they come apart without damaging them. Thanks

[PaulR]

Originally Posted by fdryer

PaulR, there are several previous posts about P065E, intake manifold tuning valve performance. From a simple search, (two posts) one mentions under warranty to replace the entire intake manifold while the other had GM try replacing the valve part with the error returning. No resolution to both threads - its unfortunate for many asking for help here and never replying with a resolution to close out their thread. Based on limited info and almost a total lack of finding the exact part in one GM parts site, this may mean buying an intake manifold ($$$). I do not believe GM/Saturn exhausted all their inventory yet but finding a single part that may be part of the entire intake manifold assembly may be the only way to search for both items then searching for just the valve. I'm presuming the valve is replaceable unless its a permanent part of the intake manifold. It might help if an Astra member that knows what part of the intake manifold is the tuning valve takes a picture and attaches the image here as a thumbnail.

Posted 4/6/11 - http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=165703

Posted 5/8/12 - http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=180323

From a reputable site describing P065E; https://www.obd-codes.com/p065e

Two replies from justanswer.com;

https://www.justanswer.com/saturn/59...ode-p065e.html

https://www.justanswer.com/saturn/7n...auto-code.html

One GM parts site lists the entire intake manifold for $476(!? ); https://www.gmpartsclub.com/oem-part...bC1sNC1nYXM%3D. You might have to search overseas Astra sites for more info and how Europeans deal with this error code, possibly replacing just the valve (if it can be replaced) or if the intake manifold is removed for cleaning and maintenance to make the existing valve operate again. From my brief searches, this valve is electrically commanded to control vacuum to open/close a door. My guess is the manifold uses two sets of internal runners, one for normal driving, the other for performance to take advantage of tuned intake ports. Please correct me if I'm mistaken. As a side note, my L300 V6 engine uses a similar setup and describes the same tuned ports for daily or performance driving with the intake manifold runner control solenoid as the equivalent of your intake manifold tuning valve.

I almost cannot balk at the $476 to buy another manifold - if that would fix the problem... for good. If I do another search there are probably some out there that I can find for even a little less. I sort of like searching for, and finding the lowest price, it is like a game to me. The problem I have is that a repair facility may charge me another $800 to $1000 in labor just to replace it. This is where it gets costly.

Along with the other problems that I have encountered with this car, I have found that I do not like these cars.

[fdryer]

You're not alone with ownership likes or dislikes. We all choose what appeals to our interpretation of style, power, single or family use, transporting canoes/bikes/tricycles/skis/snowboards/couches/sheetrock/whatever. From your signature, you were proud enough to point out the pluses, presuming when the car was new. As cars age, problems eventually creeps in, no different from humans aging and eventually seeking more medical help to provide maintenance in hopes of prolonging life. Well, cars require the same attention to details when they age, some more than others and can vary according to base engine or high end power. With sophistication comes complexity and sometimes problems with complex EFI systems.

I have a dual runner setup (stock) for the 3.0L V6 engine using a long and short intake runner controlled by a vacuum valve on the exterior of the intake manifold. The vacuum operated valve moves a valve inside the intake manifold to select either normal or long intake runners according to pedal position. Sometimes when I floor the pedal I hear a throaty sound as power is applied while normal driving doesn't produce this sound. I presume the runner intake valve is called into action depending on how far I press the gas pedal to tell the ecm if I want power or not to enable or disable the intake runner valve. Since mine is located outside, its a replaceable part. Yours being internal may make it irreplaceable when a whole intake manifold is the standard practice to repair this fault. I don't know as I'm not familiar with this intake manifold and whether or not its repairable as a diyer. From a diyers point of view, I feel this problem, if it is the problem, may be worth disassembling to examine it in detail to determine if a repair can be made without resorting to buying the entire intake manifold. Your choice to decide which way to go as well as anyone else with this problem if other repairs doesn't correct the error code.

[AstraFasta]

Originally Posted by PaulR

I have the MAF sensor safe cleaner. What about for the throttle body? Will the standard carburetor and choke cleaner do, or will it again have to be specific? Do I spray it right down the hole or try to wipe it clean with some on a rag? I want to do this before I replace my spark plugs.

Do NOT use carburator cleaner on the throttlebody as it can destroy the coatings. I use throttlebody cleaner.

You need to clean the throttlebody and both sides of the butterfly valve. There are a few posts on how to do this. It is easy. You will need a rag. Be careful with the butterfly valve as it can snap back and cut your finger (off); also, if you do this correctly you will not knock the thing out of alignment.

Should take less than 20 minutes for whole job.

[PaulR]

Originally Posted by AstraFasta

Do NOT use carburator cleaner on the throttlebody as it can destroy the coatings. I use throttlebody cleaner.

You need to clean the throttlebody and both sides of the butterfly valve. There are a few posts on how to do this. It is easy. You will need a rag. Be careful with the butterfly valve as it can snap back and cut your finger (off); also, if you do this correctly you will not knock the thing out of alignment.

Should take less than 20 minutes for whole job.

Thanks, will use the MAF cleaner for that too..

[PaulR]

Originally Posted by fdryer

You're not alone with ownership likes or dislikes. We all choose what appeals to our interpretation of style, power, single or family use, transporting canoes/bikes/tricycles/skis/snowboards/couches/sheetrock/whatever. From your signature, you were proud enough to point out the pluses, presuming when the car was new. As cars age, problems eventually creeps in, no different from humans aging and eventually seeking more medical help to provide maintenance in hopes of prolonging life. Well, cars require the same attention to details when they age, some more than others and can vary according to base engine or high end power. With sophistication comes complexity and sometimes problems with complex EFI systems.

I have a dual runner setup (stock) for the 3.0L V6 engine using a long and short intake runner controlled by a vacuum valve on the exterior of the intake manifold. The vacuum operated valve moves a valve inside the intake manifold to select either normal or long intake runners according to pedal position. Sometimes when I floor the pedal I hear a throaty sound as power is applied while normal driving doesn't produce this sound. I presume the runner intake valve is called into action depending on how far I press the gas pedal to tell the ecm if I want power or not to enable or disable the intake runner valve. Since mine is located outside, its a replaceable part. Yours being internal may make it irreplaceable when a whole intake manifold is the standard practice to repair this fault. I don't know as I'm not familiar with this intake manifold and whether or not its repairable as a diyer. From a diyers point of view, I feel this problem, if it is the problem, may be worth disassembling to examine it in detail to determine if a repair can be made without resorting to buying the entire intake manifold. Your choice to decide which way to go as well as anyone else with this problem if other repairs doesn't correct the error code.

You are correct, I am only proud to point out in my signature the features on my car that actually still function. Like when it was new. When most of these break, probably sooner than later, I will not be so proud. My 2008 XE is a piece of junk. It seems that the check engine light has been on more than it has been off. It has cost me way more money than I had ever expected for a relatively low mileage vehicle. Come on, it is not like it has 2000,000 miles on it. For Pete's sake, the oil is changed every 2500 miles. It is always washed and garaged.

This car is a fragile, overly sensitive electronic nightmare. A coil pack here, a couple of camshaft actuator solenoids there, a complete clutch assembly here, and... a bunch of broken wiring so I can not even use my door locks or the rear windows or hatch on top of that. And on and on...

These cars were touted as a "premium sport compact". With hundreds of thousands of them driving around Europe since 2004 they were supposedly a "proven" vehicle. Oh, what might have been.

I might have been better off to buy a crappy Chevy Cobalt of the same vintage. At least when that broke, and I took it to the still in business dealer to get it fixed, the grease ball would not say, "Dah... what's a Saturn Astra?

[PaulR]

I am going to close this post out, as much as it can anyways. After doing the easy and cheap stuff myself, the CEL engine light is still on. Yup, changed the spark plugs, air filter and cleaned the MAF sensor and the throttle body... well,
as much as I could without disassembly. The MAF sensor looked as clean as a whistle before but I did wipe some, but not a lot, of black crud out of the throttle body. The car starts and runs slightly better now without the occasional hesitation but it really did not run all that bad before I did all of that. I did get 38 miles per gallon (or so the on board computer read) on a straight highway driving trip just before cleaning or replacing those parts. I say straight highway driving because, when I idled or started driving in town, the mileage went down considerably. I finished with a not bad 35.5 MPG when figured with a calculator. It will be interesting to check my fuel economy on another highway trip this weekend. As for the P065E code, I just don't know.

[Bruticus]

Has anyone got to the bottom of this issue?

Here is my history:
First I noticed car was low on power especially with the air conditioning on in the summer. Began noticing worse milage figures. I used to be in the low 9.1s/100km but now I'm 10.5 as recorded by the Astra board computer.

First I cleaned the maf using maf cleaner. I also changed the plugs and the coil pack (no reason other than hoping for more performance.) I used ngk iridium plugs (before I read that regular plugs are recommended.) They are still in the car.

Also took off the oil filters on the cam shaft solenoids (as per GM bulletin).

I've also completed another maf cleaning (maf cleaner) and throttle body cleaning (using throttle body cleaner).

I've also had the timing belt and accessories replaced. I've had an injector cleaning done. I've had the automatic transmission fluid changed.

All of the above was done over 2 or 3 years in search of lost performance.

More recently I have the p065e intake code and also a p0326 knock sensor code.

Car has 120k km.

I'd love to have your input. On my list of things to try is to replace the cam shaft position sensors, do a seafoam treatment (both gas and spray)

[PaulR]

Originally Posted by Bruticus

Has anyone got to the bottom of this issue?

Here is my history:
First I noticed car was low on power especially with the air conditioning on in the summer. Began noticing worse milage figures. I used to be in the low 9.1s/100km but now I'm 10.5 as recorded by the Astra board computer.

First I cleaned the maf using maf cleaner. I also changed the plugs and the coil pack (no reason other than hoping for more performance.) I used ngk iridium plugs (before I read that regular plugs are recommended.) They are still in the car.

Also took off the oil filters on the cam shaft solenoids (as per GM bulletin).

I've also completed another maf cleaning (maf cleaner) and throttle body cleaning (using throttle body cleaner).

I've also had the timing belt and accessories replaced. I've had an injector cleaning done. I've had the automatic transmission fluid changed.

All of the above was done over 2 or 3 years in search of lost performance.

More recently I have the p065e intake code and also a p0326 knock sensor code.

Car has 120k km.

I'd love to have your input. On my list of things to try is to replace the cam shaft position sensors, do a seafoam treatment (both gas and spray)

I did replace my camshaft position sensors on my XE in the summer of 2015, and it was in another post at that time. The cars engine dieseled, when hot and under acceleration or load, and it had slow acceleration. Replacing the sensors cured the problem, I noticed at lot better performance and it did not diesel. I think I bought both sensors for around $50. I semi-regularly use Seafoam gas treatment.

[Bruticus]

Thanks for your input. I think I'll do the cam sensors next. I've already bought the seafoam so I'll do that as well.

[David R]

Interesting to note. I've noticed a marginal decline in performance, mostly attribute it to Winter gas.

Can you say where you got the sensors, seem like a good price.