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Old 04-08-2010, 07:42 PM   #1
KingRex
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Default "Get your pin welded!"

Easier said than done sadly. Who else here has gone though this and now drives around on a welded pin?

After seeing more than one pointless pin failure, even sometimes because of the stupidest reason. There is no reason the pin should ever fail, but they do. I've seen so many of them fail, that I've had it with them and their failure rate, and always having to baby the car, never spin the tires, don't drive it too hard, or the pin may pop! No more! I'm going the WELDED PIN ROUTE. It'll be nice knowing the pin is welded, having that extra insurance inside the transmission, it'll basically take that ticking time bomb, and be rid of it!

I should note that this transmission came from a different car, and my pin is perfectly fine still, but I would rather have a welded pin. I scrapped the transmission in the picture, and kept the differential.

So it begins, the era that I won't have to worry about my pin popping anymore. Everything has gone good and smooth so far.

I took the differential to a local fabrication shop, where all the guy does is welding. I like the results, he followed though with all the details I gave him on welding the pin in, that it needs to be flush with the carrier, not to melt the bushings, and to tack weld the new roll pin I hammered in to the differential.

From start; (56K warning)



The Welding:





I think he did a damn good job with the welding, and keeping it flush to the carrier. Nothing was melted. I'm happy with his work, he'll see more of my business for sure.

Now, to get the car in the garage, get the transmission out, and get this differential installed in to it.

Stay tuned, more to come!
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Old 04-08-2010, 09:24 PM   #2
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

welded my pin before doing manual conversion on the sc2. SC1 still has un-welded pin. If it goes, I'll just pick up another trans & get the pin welded before installation. Not worth it to me to weld it as a preventative measure.
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Old 04-08-2010, 09:31 PM   #3
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

After hearing so much about this, I'll likely keep the trans from my '93 as a spare. It's odd though, the '93 took a LOT of abuse when I got it and I never had a problem. I suppose it's just one of those "luck of the draw" things...
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Old 04-09-2010, 09:27 AM   #4
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Great photos- thanks. I might have mine welded this summer, I will have time to pull it apart etc.

Couple of questions.
1. Does the heat that the welder will apply damage other components in the carrier?
2. Except for welding, what is the cost to R&R the differential, are there gaskets to buy? I thought RTV is used between surfaces.
3. What would the welding cost be? Assume a local racer/mechanic with a small shop.

Thanks!
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Old 04-09-2010, 10:37 AM   #5
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingRex View Post
Easier said than done sadly. Who else here has gone though this and now drives around on a welded pin?
On every S-Series either myself, my brother, family or friends have owned in the past 12 years.

We've got pretty go at it too. From the time the tranny it set on top of the work bench to tightening the last bolt after reassembly is about 40 minutes.
...
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Old 04-09-2010, 12:15 PM   #6
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeNW View Post
Great photos- thanks. I might have mine welded this summer, I will have time to pull it apart etc.

Couple of questions.
1. Does the heat that the welder will apply damage other components in the carrier?
2. Except for welding, what is the cost to R&R the differential, are there gaskets to buy? I thought RTV is used between surfaces.
3. What would the welding cost be? Assume a local racer/mechanic with a small shop.

Thanks!
1. there is a plastic bushing in the differential that you have to be careful not to melt (learned the hard way after taking to a shop to have a diff welded)
2. As long as all your seals, etc are good, a tube of RTV and some new trans fluid should be your only other costs. The trans uses an anaerobic sealant, but RTV works perfectly fine as well (I used RTV, has been perfect for about 4 yrs now.)
3. Totally depends on the shop. The shop I took it to charged $30, but then screwed up the bushing (as mentioned above). You might find some that are cheaper than that, you might not, totally depends on the shops in your area.
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Old 04-09-2010, 01:01 PM   #7
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

After i saw the photos, I have to wonder if the hole for the spilt pin could be drilled out and tapped to recieve the pinion shaft retainer bolt out of a 7.5" Ford rearend? Yes the retainer bolt may have to be shortened, but maybe? It word save alot of grief when welding.
Just thinking.............
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Old 04-09-2010, 01:48 PM   #8
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by laser3kw View Post
After i saw the photos, I have to wonder if the hole for the spilt pin could be drilled out and tapped to recieve the pinion shaft retainer bolt out of a 7.5" Ford rearend? Yes the retainer bolt may have to be shortened, but maybe? It word save alot of grief when welding.
Just thinking.............
The idea of using a threaded diff pin retainer has been tossed around before, but no one has done it yet. What has been done is a solid pin retainer welded in, as well as the more typical welding of the pin ends to the diff main body. I'm tempted to think the solid retainer pin welded in may be just as well, as the only reasons generally to service the differential are to weld it or because it's busted, so taking the time to thread the retainer may just be an extra unnecessary step in servicing something you're most likely never going to touch again unless it's flat out broken.
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Old 04-09-2010, 10:21 PM   #9
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Crap they make it looks easy on paper but once you actually get in to it, its far from easy.

I'm a bit more than half way complete on the entire job. But I have a welded differential pin installed in my Saturn now, sure feels good to know I won't have it pop on me anytime soon now.

I did cut some corners to save some time since I didn't feel like going though the whole process.

1. Didn't remove the hood
2. Didn't drop the sub frame all the way
3. Didn't even bother removing the right side tire.
4. Didn't remove the exhaust pipe.
5. Didn't remove the trans stiffener plate.

No corners were cut on the installation of the new differential in to the transmission.
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Old 04-09-2010, 10:27 PM   #10
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

People have managed to still pop welded differentials, so don't take it as an excuse to beat on the trans.
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Old 04-09-2010, 10:30 PM   #11
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Had a '99 SC2. About 18000 miles it spun the 2 & 3 rod bearings. When the dealership pulled it apart, they found the input shaft seal was leaking oil onto the clutch. They also discovered the pins were working their way out, so they replaced the diff, clutch and bottom end of the engine. Fortunately they covered it all under warranty!
So much for having fun with that car. When the lease ended, it was gone!

I'm glad to see that I wasn't the only one with any of those problems.
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Old 04-09-2010, 11:02 PM   #12
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaturnRaycer View Post
Had a '99 SC2. About 18000 miles it spun the 2 & 3 rod bearings. When the dealership pulled it apart, they found the input shaft seal was leaking oil onto the clutch. They also discovered the pins were working their way out, so they replaced the diff, clutch and bottom end of the engine. Fortunately they covered it all under warranty!
So much for having fun with that car. When the lease ended, it was gone!

I'm glad to see that I wasn't the only one with any of those problems.
That's the only time I've heard of it at such low miles, wow.
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Old 04-10-2010, 02:09 AM   #13
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by PurdueGuy View Post
People have managed to still pop welded differentials, so don't take it as an excuse to beat on the trans.
I've heard of that before. I made sure to replace the roll pin with a new solid roll pin, and had both ends welded. I don't go around spinning my wheels, I just want that extra insurance.

I finished it, took it out for a little beat on it ride, went home, checked the transmission, A-OK. Back to my normal driving routine.
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Old 04-10-2010, 11:05 AM   #14
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

"1. Didn't remove the hood
2. Didn't drop the sub frame all the way
3. Didn't even bother removing the right side tire.
4. Didn't remove the exhaust pipe.
5. Didn't remove the trans stiffener plate."

1-nope, don't need to
2-only need to drop the left side a few inches
3-don't have to touch any of the rt. side suspension nor axles
4-Seems you have to drop it (at the header), so the subframe can drop, the ex. pipe routes under the SF- Hmmmm
5-Nope

R&R of a tranny is not that bad. Fortunately. And a lot of shops don't know the easy way! Go figure.
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Old 04-10-2010, 06:48 PM   #15
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

well while yer in there cant ya put in a posi unit? i know in older rwd cers you can repace the spider gears with ones from a posi unit/limited slip(what ever ya wanna call it). is there a way to do that to our cars?
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Old 04-11-2010, 11:51 AM   #16
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Quote:
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well while yer in there cant ya put in a posi unit? i know in older rwd cers you can repace the spider gears with ones from a posi unit/limited slip(what ever ya wanna call it). is there a way to do that to our cars?
If you can hunt down an out of production quaife and want to pay $1,500 for it.
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Old 05-17-2010, 12:06 PM   #17
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Default Re: "Get your pin welded!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by PurdueGuy View Post
If you can hunt down an out of production quaife and want to pay $1,500 for it.
I barely got mina and for 1175 brand new from quiafe if you want to get one i can get you the person that ordered it for me now im just waitng to install
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