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Old 11-16-2021, 07:47 AM   #1
den812
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2004 VUE 3.0L
2005 VUE 2.2L
Dizzy VUE V6 3.0 troubles ... help pls.

Hi again, Please help me with this:

have a trouble with one of my VUE 3.0 2002 L61

have an engine problem in Ignition or Fuel system or else.

1. cold engine RUN ok
2. when become to hot(normal) engine condition I got error codes(see below report) and engine stopped with trying to manage air fuel mixture ..

TORQUE REPORT:

Fault log report generated by Torque for Android
=================================================

Vehicle VIN: 5GZCZ63B52S832202
Vehicle Manufacturer: Unknown
Vehicle Calibration ID: Not present

Current Fault Log
------------------
P0700: Transmission Control System (MIL Request)
P1779: [Chrysler] Engine Torque Delivered to TCM Signal
[Mitsubishi] Gear 1 incorrect ratio
[Dodge] Engine Torque Delivered to TCM Signal
[Jeep] Engine Torque Delivered to TCM Signal


Pending Fault Log
------------------
P0221: Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor/Switch "B" Circuit Range/Performance Problem

Historic Fault Log
------------------
ECU reports no historic faults
Other discovered fault codes
(possibly pending, current or manufacturer specific)
----------------------------------------------------
ECU reports no other fault codes logged

End of report.

FREEZE FRAME:

Freeze frame report generated by Torque for Android
================================================== =======

Vehicle VIN: 5GZCZ63B52S832202
Vehicle Manufacturer: Unknown
Vehicle Calibration ID: BOSCH 1037363774

Freeze frame information:
------------------
Fuel Status = 0 byte
Engine Load = 12,157 %
Engine Coolant Temperature = 69 C
Fuel Trim Bank 1 Short Term = -2,344 %
Fuel Trim Bank 1 Long Term = -0,781 %
Fuel Trim Bank 2 Short Term = -4,688 %
Fuel Trim Bank 2 Long Term = -0,781 %
Engine RPM = 1 720 rpm
Speed (OBD) = 47 km/h


End of report.
...
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Old 11-16-2021, 01:57 PM   #2
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2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: VUE V6 3.0 troubles ... help pls.

69C is 156F here is the USA. Just so you know, 90C or 195F is normal when the engine is warmed up. The error codes may appear as the engine was warming up to 69C and all the parameters were automatically recorded.

If coolant temps don't rise to 90C and stay well under, consider replacing the thermostat. This didn't contribute to the three error codes.

Here's some background info: https://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=206102. Your crank sensor may be creating these false errors while attempting to point to the crank sensor. It's next to the oil filter canister, mounted with one torx bolt. You can test for resistance as described in the link. When testing, be sure to perform both tests, banging it against a table edge (vibration failure) and boiling water (engine heat) to stress test it in semi real world conditions. Resistance should remain the same for both tests compared to initial measurements either on the engine or after removal.

The engine dying may be a clue as engine heat or vibration can contribute to intermittent or outright sensor failure. Intermittent failures can occur with the engine cooling down to show starting but as the engine warms up again, the sensor fails. This can be repeated to verify a faulty crank sensor. Whether intermittent or dead, the same symptoms occur; no fuel pump operation, no injector operation and no spark for ignition - the ecm cannot run the EFI system without an operating crank sensor.
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Old 11-16-2021, 07:20 PM   #3
den812
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2004 VUE 3.0L
2005 VUE 2.2L
Dizzy Re: VUE V6 3.0 troubles ... help pls.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdryer View Post
the ecm cannot run the EFI system without an operating crank sensor.
Thank You for replay , for sure it can be crank sensor, but not in this case. If it was c.sensor engine will be stop immediately ( couple of yrs ago I have this issue and change this sensor). Now eng. was not stops imediatelly but try to make correct a/f mixture (when shows errors) with reduce air by throttle % near the 2-1...% about minutes RPM was unstable and then e. stops. I have changed ECM , Throttle Pedal with new one and still have this issue , next will be a MAF sensor .... else ?

any other suggestions please...
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Old 11-16-2021, 08:56 PM   #4
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2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: VUE V6 3.0 troubles ... help pls.

There are circumstances where you would be incorrect. Mine failed intermittently. Driving home from work on the highway, the engine died with the tachometer dropping to zero with battery and oil light turning on as I coasted off the highway to the nearest exit for another mile. Calling for help and waiting, the car engine cooled off (approximately 25-30 minutes) I was able to restart the engine. I measured sensor resistance right after stopping, showing a higher resistance than expected. Engine running, I drove carefully on local streets anticipating another engine die off. Sure enough, crossing an overpass the engine died again where I was able to coast into a parking spot away from traffic. Went to buy a replacement, replaced the sensor and drove home. This was several years ago and has not returned.

If you can test for injector operation and/or spark, do so. Both tests are difficult on this 3.0L V6 engine because of the design of ignition system and difficult access to remove spark plugs to examine for fuel from failed starting when injectors are supposed to operate. Failure of both spark and fuel on spark plugs are hallmarks of a faulty crank sensor. Other issues may be masked and require advanced troubleshooting.

Passlock is GMs antitheft program of a flashing security indicator, disabling injector operation to prevent theft. The ignition switch has Passlock sensors to disable engine running if the sensors or lock cylinder is damaged from theft when attempting to turn the ignition switch. Is security OFF, not flashing?

If security is off then you can test for lack of spark or fuel injection by using starting fluid or squirting fuel into the throttle body. By physically supplying Starting fluid or raw fuel into the throttle body and starting, this presumes spark is operational and should start up, pointing to a fuel issue; blown fuel pump fuse, faulty fuel pump relay, fuel system leak or faulty fuel pump. When ignition is turned on (engine not started) the fuel pump runs for two seconds, enough to pressurize the fuel lines on the engine. Remove the black plastic cap covering the fuel rail test valve and cover it (loosely with a rag) while depressing the valve stem. Fuel under pressure (between 39-49 psi/2.7-3.4 bar/269-338 kpa) should result in a strong spray of fuel for a second or so. Injectors are more difficult to test but the absence of raw fuel on spark plugs after several starting attempts would indicate; blown injector fuse, wiring fault, ecm failure (not likely).

Manually turning on the fuel pump for testing ca be done by removing the fuel pump relay and noting pinouts. A small wire jumper across relay socket terminals 30 and 87 will send 12v immediately to power the fuel pump regardless of ignition switch position. There should be fuel pressure at the fuel test valve.

Testing for spark requires either removing one coil pack or using a spare coil pack plugged into the wiring harness. Attach three spark plugs to the coil pack and ground all three plug bases to the engine block. Have someone start while you observe for spark on all three plugs. I had one coil (one plug) fail while the engine ran poorly. All three coils failing on one coil pack is unusual.

Testing for spark and injectors can help determine where the problem lies.
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