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Old 09-17-2008, 10:40 PM   #1
AzBlondeRocket
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2006 VUE Red Line
Default I want a remote start

Just as the title says, I want a remote start system for my '06 Vue Red Line.
My Brother has a Viper remote starter on his '04 Sierra and loves it. He pretty much has me convinced that it's a great thing to have...now for the questions. BTW-I did a search, but didn't find anything applicable to my Vue.

*Is there any particular brand I should lean towards or away from?
*Will remote start interfere with the factory alarm?
*Will the remote start "clicker" replace the factory "clicker"?
*If I buy the $300 system, am I getting what I pay for? (ie cheap, not worth it, just all-around crappy)
*If so, what's a good price point?
*Any issues/problems/concerns I should know about?

Thanks for any and all wisdom...
...
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Old 09-18-2008, 11:12 PM   #2
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2006 VUE Red Line
Default Re: I want a remote start

36 views and no wisdom?
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Old 09-19-2008, 02:39 AM   #3
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Default Re: I want a remote start

You don't really want a remote start, you only think you want one. They're pretty much the worst thing ever from a security standpoint. I could steal any car with an aftermarket remote start in under 2 minutes I'd say. And that's while eating a sandwich.

But first, for your questions. And then for the reasons why.

* DEI owns pretty much all the reputable brands. They also own a few bargain crap brands. Viper and Cobra are their average ones, Cliffords are also not bad. As long as its DEI, you should be in "good shape" though. More on this later.
* Yes, it will interfere, and in the installation of an aftermarket alarm the Vue's factory alarm is completely disabled. If done by a good installer this should not pose a huge issue though.
* Most reputable systems can be programmed to work with your factory clicker, but at a reduced range. Typically, you will replace your factory clicker with the aftermarket one.
* $300 all depends on where you spend it, DEI requires its authorized resellers to include basic installation in the price, so you pay usually about $140 of the price for install, but it all comes bundled. That's only a basic installation, however, and there's only a very small (read: cheap) handful of newer cars that works for.
* It all depends what useless features you want. If you want 2-way remote, or an LCD screen remote, expect to pay more.
* Yes, and it's very important.

Now, on to the good stuff. You should NOT buy an aftermarket remote start for your Vue (or most any other GM) as it will make your car incredibly easy to steal. Firstly, it becomes much easier to hotwire, as that's basically what a remote starter does. Alarms are typically set so that if you pull the fuse from them, you can disarm the alarm so that if you have a problem with it you can drive your car. But the biggest reason is the immobilizer bypass. Most newer GM vehicles are equipped with the Passlock 2 system, which basically requires a specific "code" from your key to start the vehicle. The ECU requires this key, sometimes after about a minute or two (just long enough for a Valet to park your car or bring your car). To install a remote start you must bypass this module (the bypasses are about $100 and typically will require a programmed original key to the car to be placed inside them, some newer ones just "sniff" the key's code and wrap a ring around the ignition cylinder). The Passlock 2 system is thousands of times more effective than an aftermarket alarm at keeping your car from being stolen.

So, in conclusion, do not get a remote starter as it will make your car an extremely easy target to be stolen. I could literally steal your brother's truck in a minute or so if I worked fast. Just gotta cut the constant wire in the ignition harness and touch it to the remote start wire and she'd start right up. Break the steering column and away we go. If I was sloppy earlier I could also pull the fuse for the alarm to silence it. My buddy Nick had 2 of these trucks and was constantly working on them, I imagine he could do it it in half the time or less than me just from having memory of where everything was. I watched him do a radio in one in under 30 seconds, I lost a bet there.
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Old 09-19-2008, 10:29 AM   #4
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Default Re: I want a remote start

Here is my take. Living in central OH I really appreciate having one. It is a CoolStart brand installed by the local Ziebart shop. I think I paid about $300 parts and installation (about 4yrs ago).

I have to use the CoolStart fob.

It will not activate the vehicle security system.

I can be in my office about 150 yds away and start it up.

It has a time limit (30 min I think).

If you were able to get in the car, the car will shut down if you put your foot on the brake to move the shift lever.
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Old 09-19-2008, 01:46 PM   #5
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Default Re: I want a remote start

I have one and I love it. I live by myself now and its worth its weight in gold in the winter time. The Saturn dealer installed mine and I highly recommend them as they knew exactly how to do it without messing it up. The alarm works the same it just doesn't go "beep" when I set it. The alarm and remote start are tied in together now. If someone was to break into my Vue, as soon as they put their foot on the brake it disengages and the car turns off. When I put my key in after I have used the remote start I have to turn it to the start position and then touch the brake once in order to drive it. Hope that made sense, ha ha ha.

It's also nice during the hot summer to get into a nice cool car. Hope I've helped.
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Old 09-19-2008, 06:20 PM   #6
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Default Re: I want a remote start

I'm not talking about stealing the car when the car has been remote started. I'm talking about stealing it when you've got it parking in your driveway. The brake pedal's not going to make a world of difference in that situation, only if the remote start wire was triggered, however they wouldn't do that. They'd find the red wire in your remote start install (this is constant on most brands), and find what it's connected to. Then they'd touch that wire to the rest of the wires turning the car on and starting it.
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Old 09-19-2008, 07:52 PM   #7
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2006 VUE Red Line
Default Re: I want a remote start

Thank you FGCA_XRL for your insightful answer. That's exactly what I was looking for in terms of good/bad about remote starts. At work my car is right outside my door, so I see it and potentially could hear the alarm going off. You surely gave me food for thought - thank you.

Vuebird-I like the idea of having the dealer install it - was it big $$$?
...granted I don't get snow here, but getting into a cool car sure beats getting into a car that's at 130+ degrees.
...
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Old 09-25-2008, 03:13 PM   #8
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Default Re: I want a remote start

I live in central PA and I have a DEI Valet 561 with GM harness. The install was done by a local reputable tuning shop. I still use my factory GM key fob to start and shut off the car and alarm still works. As mentioned, pressing the brake prior to putting the key in the ignition kills the motor. I also have the kill switch under the hood to prevent the vehicle from starting if the hood is open.

As for making a car easy to steal, I don't know. I know the unit is shoved pretty far up to the left of my dash - I actually think they did a pretty good job making it hard to get to. My thought is that everything can be hacked/broken into/stolen if you have the knowledge and ability.

Now, my recommendation... I have used it, and it is a nice treat to have. I have never used it in the summertime to cool the car - I have only used it in the winter to warm it up or melt snow/ice. With the cost of fuel, I have been playing a game with myself to use as little fuel as possible.... With that said, while the car is idling, you will be getting ZERO miles per gallon. I will use my starter sparingly this winter.

Have fun.
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Old 09-27-2008, 04:51 PM   #9
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2006 VUE Red Line
Default Re: I want a remote start

I have a Viper 791xv Alarm/remote start system in my car. As far as I know it is one the higher end alarms from viper. It has an LCD screen key fob that allows me to view if the car is locked/unlocked and/or if the remote starter is running.

This unit has a reported range of 1-mile, but this is very debatable as it depends on what is between you and the car. However, I get a pretty decent range for what my needs are. I live and work in downtown Chicago, and do like knowing that if my car alarm is going off, I am usually within range that the key fob alarm goes off as well.

I had my unit installed at Best Buy, which included "basic" install. I had to get the passlock bypass module. I suggest buying it yourself online, and bringing it to the installer to save some money. Just pay attention to get the correct bypass as it is specific to each car. I think I paid an additional amount for other parts of the install. I guess i could go get the invoice to double-check the actual price.

I enjoy having the remote start to either cool or heat the car up. However I used this feature a lot more when I lived in a suburban location as opposed to the city.

Make sure you get a competent installer, as I had one issue where my battery was completely drained after leaving the car while on vacation.
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Old 09-27-2008, 04:59 PM   #10
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Default Re: I want a remote start

At my store, and all the surrounding stores, we would not install using parts from another location unless we had no way to get the parts. Outside of that, we would not warranty it sometimes if we felt nice. So if you do decide to purchase the module online, you're taking a risk on it.

I still recommend not getting a remote start for the previously mentioned reasons.
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Old 10-10-2008, 03:49 AM   #11
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Default Re: I want a remote start

Quote:
Originally Posted by FGCA_XRL View Post
I'm not talking about stealing the car when the car has been remote started. I'm talking about stealing it when you've got it parking in your driveway. The brake pedal's not going to make a world of difference in that situation, only if the remote start wire was triggered, however they wouldn't do that. They'd find the red wire in your remote start install (this is constant on most brands), and find what it's connected to. Then they'd touch that wire to the rest of the wires turning the car on and starting it.
Sorry, in the case of any GM car built since about 2002, that won't work. The PCM/BCM needs to see a signal from the PASSLOCK2 at the ignition switch, or the car won't start. Of course if you or your installer is stupid (or lazy) and disables the PASSLOCK system instead of using the proper electronic remote start only bypass module (that cannot be triggered by simply crossing wires)..well....

And how are they going to drive it with the steering wheel still locked even if they did get it started? That is a mechanical lock function of the ignition lock...you'll need the key...or maybe Arnold Swartzenegger.

The remote starter on my 2005 is literally BURIED inside the dash, with no wires any more accessable than the factory ones. You'd have to know in advance that the module was there, and where it was, and then disassemble the dashboard, including dropping the steering trim and column to get to it.
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Old 10-10-2008, 02:27 PM   #12
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Default Re: I want a remote start

If you energize the remote start module it will energize that passlock bypass.

The remote start in your car will be more or less behind the radio, it might be down a little farther, it might be over to the side a little more, but it wouldn't be hard to find. The Vue's BCM or whatever is there, and when installing an alarm/remote start you have to go there for the majority of your wires. It's not that hidden.

Alarms and the little LEDs are only a deterrent. If someone wants your car they'll take it. But why would you make it easier for them?
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Old 10-10-2008, 06:10 PM   #13
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Default Re: I want a remote start

Quote:
Originally Posted by FGCA_XRL View Post
If you energize the remote start module it will energize that passlock bypass.

The remote start in your car will be more or less behind the radio, it might be down a little farther, it might be over to the side a little more, but it wouldn't be hard to find. The Vue's BCM or whatever is there, and when installing an alarm/remote start you have to go there for the majority of your wires. It's not that hidden.

Alarms and the little LEDs are only a deterrent. If someone wants your car they'll take it. But why would you make it easier for them?
Mine is no where near the radio or BCM. The remote starter unit is always hot...otherwise it would not work. It has an internal relay that is tripped by the remote, crossing the wires (any of them) will NOT trip the bypass module. That is even if you take the 20 minutes or so to dig disassemble the dash and dig down to the module.

Still waiting for how they are going to drive the car with a locked steering wheel.
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:45 PM   #14
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Default Re: I want a remote start

Break the steering column or something like that. That's normal for all cars though.
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Old 10-13-2008, 09:03 AM   #15
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Default Re: I want a remote start

Quote:
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Break the steering column or something like that. That's normal for all cars though.
So then why would it having a remote starter matter? If you are going to bother to break the steering column lock, all the wires you need are right there plugged into the back of the ignition switch / lock. Except the Passlock bypass, which, if used and properly installed will not function once the power is killed to it, (such as if it is unplugged from the remote starter unit, or car's power...which, if properly wired, will happen as soon as the wires are unplugged from the ignition switch.) As a bypass unit has a learned memory of the passlock signal code, disconnect the power, and that memory goes bye-bye, requiring a relearn, which you need a functioning passlock system and ignition key (to turn in the intact lock) to do.

Or, you can just sit in the car you are trying to steal for 1/2 an hour with the key in "run" and the passlock will bypass itself...no remote starter or module needed.

Can it be done?

Sure.

Is somebody going to take the extreme amount of time it would take to do it on a car with a properly installed and wired system to steal a Saturn Vue?

Highly doubtful.
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Old 10-13-2008, 06:46 PM   #16
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Default Re: I want a remote start

We're looking at installing remote start on our VUE too so this is a great thread for information. I like the kill switch for the hood, that's something I'd be interested in having. I think wolfman's hit the nail on the head as far as theft goes - If someone wants to steal something, it doesn't matter what obstacles you do or don't throw in their way, because a determined, knowledgeable thief will find a way to get it, and I think his argument is stronger for why it doesn't work.

And if you get it installed, I do not recommend using one of the 'big box' installers. It's a roll of the dice whether you get someone who knows what they're doing and has correct training, or someone who is a complete idiot. I've had two alarms installed at Circuit City and the first one went off without a hitch and I had my car back in 2 hours. Never had a single problem out of it, it worked exactly like it was supposed to for the two years I had it. The second one, it took them 3 days to install it instead of the 2 hours it was supposed to. For the 3 years I used it before literally ripping the system out, I had nothing but problems out of it and their service. Between draining my battery several times, frying a key fob by 'fixing' it with solder instead of replacing it under warranty, and disabling the anti-theft and remote bypass mechanisms without my permission or knowledge. Just so you know, it is NOT any fun to be driving down the road (because they disconnected your starter kill) with your alarm going off at full volume (because they disabled the valet switch) to go get your alarm fixed.
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Old 10-13-2008, 07:57 PM   #17
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Default Re: I want a remote start

The bypass is still powered by the alarm even when its not in use. His argument is based off a false idea. The bypass gets power constantly, just like the alarm. The whole point is that you can easily activate the remote start, cut the foot brake wire and you're good. Why would you put in something that is designed to basically hotwire your car for a thief?

That said, I don't think very many people are in the business of stealing Saturns. Resale value is too low.
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Old 10-14-2008, 02:29 PM   #18
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Default Re: I want a remote start

I say if they want it that bad, take it! I have full coverage and gap insurance and will have no more payments!!! It's a win/win situation! Like has been said, if someone wants to steal something bad enough, they will take it. Ever heard of a flatbed????
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Old 10-14-2008, 03:48 PM   #19
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Default Re: I want a remote start

The only thing I'd want out of mine is my stereo stuff. And maybe my HIDs.

I think the fact that its just another SUV does play out to our favor making it less of a target.
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Old 10-15-2008, 01:29 AM   #20
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Default Re: I want a remote start

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Originally Posted by FGCA_XRL View Post
The bypass is still powered by the alarm even when its not in use. His argument is based off a false idea.
The MEMORY of the bypass is hot all the time, not the signal to supply it to the BCM circuit that will go looking for it when the Ignition is activated (by the OEM key, "hot wiring" the car, or the remote starter) If the bypass module loses power to the memory side of the unit for even a few seconds, such as if properly installed wiring is tampered with, the memory goes bye-bye and module will not work. Properly installed, a bypass module and remote start system takes nothing away from the OEM theft deterrent systems in place. If they do, the installer is a hack. Find somebody who knows what they are doing.
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