2001 Saturn L300 - v6 3.0 Liter - Timing Belt Kit + Camshaft + Crankshaft Seals

[BrandonKastning]

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[BrandonKastning]

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[Rj 2000 LS2]

The alignment marks on the old belt are irrelevant because with each turn of the engine the belt walks a tooth. The timing belt system is designed to walk one tooth causing the belt to not hit the very same teeth of each gear with every revolution. This allows the belt to last longer.

I learned this when I changed my timing belt and later verified it to be true. With every revolution of the engine, the belt marks moved farther and farther away from what I expected. So it is really important to only use the belt timing marks (on the belt) for the very first part of the installation of a new belt and then ONLY use the cam timing marks and the engine (plastic) marks from then on.

Brandon, the reason you can find the "mark" where both key cam locks fit is because you are spinning the engine counterclockwise. The tension on the belt between each idler/gear/sprocket is what keeps the engine in "time". You will learn this when you tweak the adjustments on the idlers and how a slight adjustment effects a specific cam timing. Furthermore, any adjustment will effect all others as well. It's a real catch22 to time these engine! A very small change in an idler adjustment can and will change the timing of one cam anywhere from a partial tooth +/- to even an entire tooth. And then the tensioner will clock back and forth controlling the belt tension, taking up slack during the compression cycle(s) of the cylinders. I ran my engine with the timing belt exposed and I could not believe just how "wildly" the belt tensioner moves even at an idle.

The idlers and belt tensioner are constantly and complicatedly working together to maintain perfect timing of all cylinders. When you spin the in the counterclockwise direction... all the timing is messed up and the key locks won't fit. The ONLY thing that is important is that you line up the timing belt marks perfectly upon initial installation of the new belt because this will "insert" the exact number of teeth between in point of contact so you can later "time" each cam i.e. timing mark perfectly. If you were to have too many timing belt teeth between any two points of contact... you will never be able to properly time the engine and you will need to start over.

Never spin the engine counterclockwise when installing a new belt and/or attempting to time the engine. As you spin the engine to a Mark (any mark), only rotate in the clockwise direction and stop exactly on the Mark you need and never rotate counterclockwise! Any counterclockwise rotation will fukup the timing!

Tip: I strongly suggest you complete your current repairs by putting everything back together and then run your engine and test drive the vehicle before attempting the timing belt. Performing too many repairs at once could lead you into chaos where nothing make sense. Diagnosing an engine after you have touched so many integral parts would be difficult to do. If you need to diagnose compounding issues... it might require a lot of time and headaches to resolve. Compounding errors can drive you crazy! Nothing you removed on the top of the engine is related to performing the timing belt job. So put the top end of the engine back together and test the engine before moving onto the timing belt repair. Start with a fully functioning engine, not a "newly" modified engine repaired by a first time garage monkey. Don't chew off more than you can handle!

[BrandonKastning]

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In case anyone wondered... I cranked it clockwise about 10 times total in those 2 hours of picture galleries I just posted.

[lrbraner]

From what I can tell from your photos, when the crankshaft is at TDC your cam sprocket timing marks are not aligned with the timing cover marks. They appear to be off a slight amount. If I am correct about this, then you need to adjust the cam sprocket position using the eccentric idler pulley(not the spring loaded tensioner pulley)
While doing this you must keep the crankshaft at TDC.
Again start at the pulley that is between the crankshaft and cam sprockets 3&4.
Do you understand how the eccentric pulleys can alter the position of the cam sprockets ?

[BrandonKastning]

lbraner,

Thank you for caring. Yes! I believe you are 100% correct that the crankshaft is off when the cams are TDC. (Or could it be the other way around; when the cams are lockable with both keys that the crankshaft is off -- since I did that stupid breaker bar push counter clockwise with the water pump attached.)

What is the eccentric pulleys?

Will this damage my engine further than I already did?

Also... I have been thinking; could using the Hub Torx Lock for the Crankshaft that I got on ebay (proprietary part) to change the crankshaft seal. Could this work or would the belt not be able to be removed around it? I have been trying to think of work arounds. Unless that is the wrong approach. *quite stumped*.

Thanks again!

Originally Posted by lrbraner

From what I can tell from your photos, when the crankshaft is at TDC your cam sprocket timing marks are not aligned with the timing cover marks. They appear to be off a slight amount. If I am correct about this, then you need to adjust the cam sprocket position using the eccentric idler pulley(not the spring loaded tensioner pulley)
While doing this you must keep the crankshaft at TDC.
Again start at the pulley that is between the crankshaft and cam sprockets 3&4.
Do you understand how the eccentric pulleys can alter the position of the cam sprockets ?

[lrbraner]

The eccentric pulleys are the idler pulleys that came with your timing belt kit.
The timing belt rides on these.
One is located between crankshaft and cam sprockets 3&4.
The other is located between cam sprockets 1/2 and 3/4.
First step is use the crankshaft holding tool to get the crank at TDC.
Lock the tool in place. The adjust the eccentric pulley between crank and Cam sprockets 3&4 to line up timing marks.
Moving the pulley by rotating on the eccentric toward the belt will move the sprockets CW. Moving it away from the belt will allow the sprockets to move CCW

[BrandonKastning]

lrbraner,

Okay! So the crankshaft holding tool (the one I got on ebay) ? Lock that in first? Then do I remove the RED AND GREEN keys or keep them locked also?

Adjusting the eccentric pulley; this requires the Hex Keys, right? I purchased a hex key set; so I should be able to do this if we're on the same page.

Is it the little notch on the metal piece on the center diameter of the eccentric pulley that will guide how much I have adjusted it or will I be focusing strictly on the camshafts 3 & 4 and the timing marks on those?

Is this basically going to force TDC back symmetrical from top (camshafts) to the crankshaft on the bottom with the crank lock; then adjusting the eccentric pulley until the camshafts are lined up with my original TDC marks? (This would answer my question that I would need to remove the RED & GREEN keys prior to adjusting the eccentric pulley AFTER locking the crankshaft with the hub torx crankshaft lock?

Thanks again man!

Best Regards,

~ Brandon Kastning

Originally Posted by lrbraner

The eccentric pulleys are the idler pulleys that came with your timing belt kit.
The timing belt rides on these.
One is located between crankshaft and cam sprockets 3&4.
The other is located between cam sprockets 1/2 and 3/4.
First step is use the crankshaft holding tool to get the crank at TDC.
Lock the tool in place. The adjust the eccentric pulley between crank and Cam sprockets 3&4 to line up timing marks.
Moving the pulley by rotating on the eccentric toward the belt will move the sprockets CW. Moving it away from the belt will allow the sprockets to move CCW