SaturnFans.com
saturnfans.com - classifieds - forums - webmail


Go Back   SaturnFans.com Forums > Models > Saturn L-Series > L-Series Tech

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-21-2012, 08:53 PM   #1
64waves
Member
64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Voorhees, NJ
Posts: 299
 

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Engine Rebuild?

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to my Saturn peeps. I have a 2000 LS2 V6 278K. Yesterday while pulling into my driveway I saw the oil pressure light blink a couple times. Today I see it needs 3 qts of oil. Give it the oil, only 3k since last change, and head out for the afternoon. I see the light go on briefly when I do on or off ramps, go around bends, or brake hard. I notice a burning smell a bit now. The Haines manual says this only comes on when pressure is dangerously low. I had the valve cover seals redone about 6 months ago. Otherwise the car seems fine. Sounds like major major surgery is needed.
64waves is offline   Reply With Quote
SaturnFans.com Sponsored Links
Old 12-21-2012, 10:45 PM   #2
Wayne G.
Member
Wayne G. is a name known to allWayne G. is a name known to allWayne G. is a name known to allWayne G. is a name known to allWayne G. is a name known to allWayne G. is a name known to all
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Gainesville, Ga.
Posts: 83

2001 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
1997 SL2
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

Wow, sorry to hear it. Thats aprox. 1 qt every thousand miles that is a lot. Its either leaking (driping) or is being burned one or the other. I have noticed there are whole L300 (L81) engines with low milage for sale on Ebay for around $900 to $1100 depending on year and miles. At last time I looked there were at least 4 avail. Good luck with your rebuild or replacment motor thats a bummer for Christmas.
Wayne G. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2012, 12:00 AM   #3
pierrot
Master Member
pierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud of
 
pierrot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Glendora, CA
Posts: 4,009
 

2000 L-Series 2.2L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

I agree with Wayne G, you're losing a lot of oil at present. I hate hearing about this kind of thing too. A few questions: 1) Do you see any signs of engine oil leaking after the car has been parked, esp. overnight? 2) Do you hear any odd or irregular noises coming from the engine now? 3) Do you see any extra smoke from the tail pipe and, if so, what color is it?

With the information you've provided, my first inclination is to think that the oil pump is failing. Obviously, you don't want to drive the car anymore to avoid further damage. What concerns me is that you said you've noticed "a burning smell." I hope things haven't gone too far.

By way of example, oil pressure can drop if the crankcase main bearings are failing. If so, you'll hear an unwanted noise-kind of like a scraping sound-and it will coincide with the rpm. This is why I'm curious about any unusual engine noises. If the main bearings were to be the source of trouble then the engine is either rebuilt or replaced.

I feel badly about this. I just blew three grand on bad drain pipes under my house, and a tankless water heater leaked and flooded my garage. This has been the December from heck for me. I hope it won't be that for you.
...
350K miles - Holy canolli!
Biden/Harris predictions, '21 -'25: weak economy; weakened military; increased terrorism; an emboldened RED CHINA. I fear that I will be correct. I'd rather be wrong.
pierrot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2012, 09:18 AM   #4
s3nfo
Senior Member
s3nfo is a jewel in the roughs3nfo is a jewel in the roughs3nfo is a jewel in the rough
 
s3nfo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Diego, Ca
Posts: 1,946

2001 L-Series 3.0L Wagon
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

You need to find out why you're losing oil, if you've just got a weeping gasket or seal, replacement is usually pretty easy and then you're good to go. If you're burning oil, the you can either just keep dumping oil in the top end until it gets so bad you can't stand it anymore, or rebuild the top end. If it's an oil pump going bad, pump can be replaced.........

Until you know why you're losing oil, not much more we can help you with.
...
Jerry N

"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it, misdiagnosing it and then misapplying the wrong remedies."

Groucho Marx
s3nfo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2012, 11:14 AM   #5
born again
Senior Member
born again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to all
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,529
 

2000 L-Series 2.2L Sedan
2000 L-Series 2.2L Wagon
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

That oil isn't disappearing completely. It is either leaking out from somewhere or being sucked into the combustion chamber and partially burned. If the latter, there will be smoke. The exhaust pipe will tell the story. Wipe the inside of the cooled exhaust pipe with a tissue or cotton swab. A healthy engine will have light to dark gray dark dry deposits. Oil in the exhaust will be a black oily deposit. Very bad oil burning will leave a dark oily ring around the pipe on the bumper cover.

With your high mileage on the engine it is likely that something has worn to the point of allowing high oil consumption. My bet would be one of the oil control piston rings. If so, the used engine route is the most economical fix.
born again is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2012, 12:53 PM   #6
64waves
Member
64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Voorhees, NJ
Posts: 299
 

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

Hi Guys, I noticed the next day after I put in the 3 quarts for the day, that I had a good stream of oil coming out from under the engine, while I waited to pull out of my driveway front first, a big spot accumulated and I can actually see the route I took on the street from the oil flow out of the car. It is safely back in my driveway, my mechanic will tow it in the next week and see what he finds, hopefully it is just a seal that has finally worn out. I need a new serpentine belt as well, so I may purchase the kit for that and give it to him so he can do it also. I hope it can be saved. I think the burning may be more from what the oil is hitting as it drips out. The smell was not excessive. The engine still sounds fine. We will see. Thanks for all the input!
64waves is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2012, 01:05 PM   #7
pierrot
Master Member
pierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud ofpierrot has much to be proud of
 
pierrot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Glendora, CA
Posts: 4,009
 

2000 L-Series 2.2L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

Thanks for the update. I think the situation is hopeful. The repair may be expensive, but based on your description, I don't perceive an engine replacement in your future.
...
350K miles - Holy canolli!
Biden/Harris predictions, '21 -'25: weak economy; weakened military; increased terrorism; an emboldened RED CHINA. I fear that I will be correct. I'd rather be wrong.
pierrot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2012, 05:27 PM   #8
born again
Senior Member
born again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to allborn again is a name known to all
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,529
 

2000 L-Series 2.2L Sedan
2000 L-Series 2.2L Wagon
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

One cause I have encountered before is from a cracked oil pan. This could come from a rock kicked up by a wheel, etc. You can't necessarily see this, but can locate by wiping the bottom of the pan and looking for seepage.
born again is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2012, 01:43 AM   #9
64waves
Member
64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Voorhees, NJ
Posts: 299
 

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

Hmmm, haven't looked underneath yet, but I know the pan was in good shape at the last change. Geez, if it's just that, I would consider that a Christmas miracle.
64waves is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 09:30 PM   #10
64waves
Member
64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Voorhees, NJ
Posts: 299
 

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

Well, jacked up the car on one side and crawled underneath to take a peek. Oil plug and filter are intact, area to the driver side of the filter heavily coated with oil. The left side of the car if looking from the back. Any ideas?
64waves is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2012, 02:15 AM   #11
mikewiss
Member
mikewiss has a spectacular aura aboutmikewiss has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 79

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

If you have a stream of oil coming out, it probably is a pressure leak. There are two oil cooler lines coming out of the block near the oil filter that go up over the top of the engine/transmission joint then under the intake. I would clean all the old oil off then look in this area with the engine running.
The seal rings are easy to change at the lower end, a bit harder at the cooler end as the intake system has to come off.

Mike
mikewiss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2012, 11:08 AM   #12
s3nfo
Senior Member
s3nfo is a jewel in the roughs3nfo is a jewel in the roughs3nfo is a jewel in the rough
 
s3nfo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Diego, Ca
Posts: 1,946

2001 L-Series 3.0L Wagon
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

Or the oil filter housing came loose. The oil filter canister is really 2 parts, the top part that comes off to replace the filter and the housing itself, and especially if you let quikie lube do your oil changes ,there's a chance the gorilla doing the filter worked the housing loose from the engine block. did this recent oil loss start right after an oil change by chance?

Housing is held on by a bolt and nug inside the housing - must remove the filter, hold the housing from turning with an oil filter band wrench and tighten the internal nut
...
Jerry N

"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it, misdiagnosing it and then misapplying the wrong remedies."

Groucho Marx
s3nfo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2012, 03:36 PM   #13
64waves
Member
64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Voorhees, NJ
Posts: 299
 

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

Hi there, I change the oil myself because a got burned by a monkey at Walmart of all places. They promptly gave me a check for the repair I needed at the dealer. Bonus points to them. I did notice the lines you refer to. I did a slight tug on the filter cap to see if it would move, and it did not. I could jack up the car and check that again, but I think the first thought you had may be correct. I will check the filter housing maybe tonight. I have 2 extra housings my mechanic got for me from a junk yard in case that is the culprit.

Last edited by 64waves; 12-28-2012 at 03:40 PM. Reason: More
64waves is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-2012, 01:04 PM   #14
64waves
Member
64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Voorhees, NJ
Posts: 299
 

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

Got the car up on ramps this morning, steady stream coming out from oil filter area. Not from the seams of the filter, but just above I think and running over the filter housing. Got some video to show my mechanic, but it sounds like the pressure leak mentioned before. I did get the oil cooling system fixed on the car before, had coolant leaking, so maybe it would just be the lower seals? Thanks again for all the input guys.
64waves is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-2012, 03:48 PM   #15
fdryer
Super Member
fdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond repute
 
fdryer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 44,903
 

2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

As mentioned before, the oil filter housing is bolted to the engine block with one (10mm?) bolt. If a leak is occurring around the perimeter of the housing in the engine block, you'll have to remove the cap and filter before the bolt holding the housing can be removed so the housing can come off. Then you can examine housing and engine block to see where the leak is coming from.
...
VCX NANO
fdryer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-2012, 08:24 PM   #16
GregS&L
Member
GregS&L is a jewel in the roughGregS&L is a jewel in the roughGregS&L is a jewel in the rough
 
GregS&L's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 220
 

2001 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
1995 SL2
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

If the oil leak is definitely coming from the oil filter area, it is probably (as previously mentioned above^^^).

- The oil cooler feed/return pipes fastened to the engine block. Not sure how these are sealed – 45 degree flare or o-ring? Either way these could be leaking. Tightening torque per FSM: 22ft/lbs.

- Most likely it is the oil filter housing which fastens to the engine block. On mine, it is bolted down with a 12mm female hex bolt – it needs a 12mm male hex bit to R/R. There is an o-ring between block & filter housing that provides the seal against pressurized oil. Remove and replace old o-ring (size unknown). Inspect the o-ring seating surfaces (block & filter housing) for nicks, gouges, foreign matter, etc. Tightening torque: 33ft/lbs. Oil filter cap tightening torque: 11ft/lbs (no more) – this is the one the gorillas love to abuse!!

My computer “arm chair” thoughts without really seeing anything – however these are the areas where there is pressurized oil. Hope it is one of these relatively easy fixes. Good Luck.
GregS&L is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-2013, 07:56 PM   #17
64waves
Member
64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Voorhees, NJ
Posts: 299
 

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

Happy New Year all. The oil is coming out as a steady stream, straight down running over the filter housing. Doesn't look like it is coming from the housing where it bolts to the engine or from the cap. I put a wrench on it and it didn't seem loose, thinking it is something just above it.
64waves is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-2013, 08:37 PM   #18
Jonnyferrari
Member
Jonnyferrari is on a distinguished road
 
Jonnyferrari's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Chicago, Il
Posts: 487

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

I noticed a sheen of oil on the underside of my LS2 today...it drips maybe one or two drops a night but that is enough for me to be annoyed. I think it is something tiny like the oil drain plug which I will reinstall (I don't have the star key, though). If I have to go into trouble shooting mode does anyone have a quick tutorial on how to find the source of an oil leak? Thanks!
...
[Sold] 2000 Saturn LS2 premium package; 120k
Jonnyferrari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2013, 09:30 AM   #19
64waves
Member
64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Voorhees, NJ
Posts: 299
 

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild?

I got a torx bit for a ratchet from Sears for that. I don't know the size off the top of my head, but the number 10 is coming to mind. Get a spare plug from a dealer and take it to the store with you so you know you got the right one. They do have a small o-ring in there, it could be wearing out.
64waves is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2013, 03:19 PM   #20
64waves
Member
64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about64waves has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Voorhees, NJ
Posts: 299
 

2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
2000 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Engine Rebuild? - Resolved

Well, it ended up being a cracked oil filter housing. My mechanic took it off and nothing was happening above it so he held his finger on the housing as the car ran, and could feel the oil coming through a crack. I tightened the cap too much, and didn't oil the O ring enough either when I put it back in. I had 2 housings with the car so he just switched it out. Took the car to work today and aside from the slight burning off of oil on the engine smell, it seems fine. Luckily on my newer Saturn the belt started to come apart and make a good hitting noise and you could feel it when you put your hand on the outer cover. Parts are already at the shop for car #1, now they will be put on car #2. 278,700K on car #1. Lucked out on the belt. Ordered a second set of parts today. Gotta take it easy next time I change the oil.
64waves is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Engine Rebuild 96-Sc2 S-Series Tech 17 01-16-2012 09:20 PM
Engine Rebuild MrSL2 S-Series General 5 12-08-2009 12:43 AM
Should I pay for a rebuild of the engine? almies S-Series General 11 04-10-2008 09:09 PM
Seeking advice on engine rebuild (Subaru.. and rebuild done) Scyan Miscellaneous Tech 8 06-13-2003 09:38 AM
Rebuild Engine? bp92sc Miscellaneous Tech 1 11-25-2000 09:06 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:02 AM.

Advanced Forum Search | Advanced Photo Search


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
SaturnFans.com. The Saturn Enthusiasts Site.