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Old 08-15-2011, 11:51 PM   #61
Crapshoot
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2001 L-Series 2.2L Sedan
1991 SC
Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sackdz View Post
did anyone also replace the balancer chain/guides?
I replaced the balancer chain/guides on my engine at the same time as I did the cam chain job. You can get the kits from rockauto.com

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Old 08-24-2011, 01:42 PM   #62
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Hello fourms My father -in-law has a 2000 ls1 2.2, auto, 90200 miles. The power steering pump went out and I noticed how loud the engine was in the timing chain area. I kept the car for a week and have been driving it on a few short trips around town . The engine lacks power ands wants to bog down. I removed the tensioner cover and there is slack in the chain. I'm new to this car and i'm looking for a guide to walk me through and photos are great to. I haven't located the walk through , and i can't seem to view these photos . Any help please thanks

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Old 08-24-2011, 03:03 PM   #63
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Quote:
Originally Posted by raffter View Post
I haven't located the walk through , and i can't seem to view these photos . Any help please thanks
This is the best how-to I have seen: http://www.courtenaysport.co.uk/down...SECamchain.pdf
No need for the special tool the Brits used, two drill bits worked for me. No need for two people to break loose the cam nuts, I used two long wrenches. The instructions in the Haynes manual are also good to have.
Bit of advice: The kit you buy should have the new type of chain tensioner, no need to pre-load it, just screw it into the head. TRIPLE check of all the colored links and marks when the chain tensioner is tightened and before you test rotate the engine. After the engine is rotated one time the marks and links will not be in alignment. It is good to have two people to help verify the alignment marks, no second chances if you mess up with this engine.
I used all new gaskets and seals, no leaks. Not a hard job but it does take some time, just a lot of parts to remove and install. Give it at least two days if you have not done the job before.

Last edited by Crapshoot; 08-24-2011 at 03:10 PM..

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Old 02-27-2012, 05:02 PM   #64
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Question Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Is there any way to determine if this problem is related to mine? I backed into my driveway a couple of nights ago, and when I went to leave yesterday, the engine just spins, but won't fire... Not even the u-uh-uh -- just whirrrrrr! The Belts are turning, so the starter is fine, but maybe there is no timing chain?

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Old 02-27-2012, 06:11 PM   #65
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Repost again in a new thread. Your descriptions don't seem to be timing chain related at all if you had someone turning the ignition key to START while you observed the drive belt moving (and crankshaft turning(?).

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Old 02-28-2012, 09:44 AM   #66
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

I have a 2001 L200 and i had a chain failure at 160K got a local saturn guy to provide and install a motor for $900 not bad. Now i got a 2003 motor and my car has 209K the saturn guy said motor had 90K when he done the install. I wasn' t convinced but anyway lately the car has been idling rough intermittently and that was what happened prior to the previous chain failure. Plugs are recent. Someone posted 2003 motors don't have chain failures. The water pump has a very slow leak currently. Awesome mechanic priced chain and water pump replacement at $730 roughly. I really don't want to discard the car. Seeking advice from people that are in the know.

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Old 02-28-2012, 11:08 AM   #67
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

tbsmith, When Saturn issued the timing chain recall I called about my 2001 L200. Saturn said the defects that caused the chain to fail early was limited and didn't apply to all 2001 engines. I did replace my chains and found the timing chain was a little loose.
On your 2003 engine with only 90K miles it should be good for more miles with no problems. If the water pump only has a small amount of leakage at the weep hole I would hold off on the replacement for now, but keep an eye on it. My pump has a drop of moisture sometimes at the weep hole, no big deal.
Other things can be the cause of a rough idle. Post some other place on the forum for help on that.
It all comes down to, do you trust the guy that said your engine only has 90K miles on it and came from a 2003 car. If the oil was changed on a regular schedule by the former owners, one could expect the chain to be ok. But I feel much better knowing my chain has been replaced.
BTW the quoted price of $730 for the chain and pump job is not a bad price, if that includes all the parts.

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Old 03-12-2012, 09:40 AM   #68
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbsmith View Post
...Someone posted 2003 motors don't have chain failures. The water pump has a very slow leak currently...
While the recall for the chain was with the early models...GM did not put the oiling modification for the timing chain into serial production until early to mid 2003 (***It would be nice if we could get serial number range***). So the failure can still occur through mid-2003 and high-mileage vehicles that don't have the chain replaced as preventative maintenance.

When I purchased my used 2003 L200 with 90k, the first thing I did was send it to the mechanic to replace the chain, and verify the oiling modification. My car did NOT have the modification, and I paid to have it done.

Because the water pump is in the same area as the chain, I elected to have the water pump done at the same time, as a preventative repair.

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Old 03-15-2012, 08:57 PM   #69
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

So I've reset my timing chain w/eng @TDC (mark at 5 o'clock, made sure that the chain was tight from crank to int cam, then int cam to exh cam, and any slack is taken out by the tensioner. The new tensioner wont fit if I pound it in.
My old one had the slotted part that you turn to preload, snap in two.
So i just set the new spring and slotted part into the old tensioner body/piston assy. The pistons are different diameters and not interchangeable.
Anyways, I go to hand crank b4 engaging starter, and the chain jumps, tried again, jumped again.Took a close @ the upper guide between cams and.....the chain was ride'n on bare metal, according to the pics I've seen, there's supposed to be a plastic guide clipped onto there. Guess the motor ate that for luch one day. Replaced this chain 4 1/2 yrs ago, so far i believe it only jumped a tooth or two. When i first noticed this chain had jumped i think it was 3 teeth off?
Any one doing this on an economy budget, DO NOT do this job w/o replacing this upper guide. Originally I just repl chain and tensioner(& oiler nozzle).
I was going to put chain back on only to comp. test for valve damage.
b4 I buy anything more, I'm going to remove cams and use compressed air to test if the valves are bent. Our local parts haus can get this upper guide for 12.99. What a shame i did not replace originally. I'm curious to know if the slack in chain from broken tensioner destroyed the plastic on this upper guide, or the guide plastic degraded, the thing fell off while eng. running, then that slack caused tensioner tip piece to bind/break

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Old 03-22-2012, 11:08 PM   #70
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

new tensioner guides and chain worked great, the first new tensioner was junk, just like the original, the one that came with the guides is self contained and cannot come apart. Make sure to push tensioner guide to release it's full tension/length b4 turning over by hand, or I assure you it will skip a tooth or two....

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Old 05-18-2012, 04:55 PM   #71
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Quote:
Originally Posted by elocinx671 View Post
For those of you that have replaced the Timing chain package.
Have you filed a complaint with the NHTSA? This will hopefully get a recall for other years using the same engine.
That means everyone will get their timing chain replaced before any more unfortunate accidents occur on our highways.

A recall would also get everyone reimbursed, if they have had the work done prior to the recall passing.

Here is more info....
I recently bought an 01 L200, timing chain broke immediately and when I started researching parts and time found out about the recall you're talking about. My VIN isn't covered and they wouldn't budge at corporate, but as it broke at exactly 90,000 miles, it's obviously part of the same problem, so I'm repairing it myself and plan on filing a small claims against the local GM dealer. Sorry for the resurrection, just wondering if anyone else has gone that route (small claims, I mean).

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Old 05-19-2012, 10:08 AM   #72
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Rhodes, good luck on the small claims action. Too bad about your engine, let us know the cost of repairs and what parts you replaced.
My chain didn't break but I did call Saturn HQ at the time of the recall. They said no problem with my chain, glad I changed it because it was a little loose. Now I have two new chains with all the new guides and tensioner.
This year I replaced the water pump. If you replace the pump get this seal set, it has everything you need for the job. When you get the set do a part count, they shorted me one of the 96263 Radiator Outlet Pipe O-Rings. They are the O-Rings that go on each end of the steel pipe between the thermostat housing and the pump. If you replace the water pump at the same time the chains are installed no need for the special tool to hold the chain sprocket.
Best of luck.

Fel-Pro - Water Pump Mounting Set
134 (2.2L) Eng., DOHC VIN, D, F 2001 - 08
Part # ES71282
$12.99 Each
http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/de...1381&ppt=C0331

http://www.rockauto.com/dbphp/x,cata...o_ES71282.html

1- 35346 Water Outlet
1- 35721 Water Pump
1- 35725 Water Pump Cover
1- 91570 Oil Cooler O Ring
2- 96263 Radiator Outlet Pipe O-Ring
1- 96349 Water Inlet
1- 96350 Water Pump Acsy Hole Cover

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Old 11-23-2013, 12:12 PM   #73
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

I am sorry to come "late to the party" on this question, but am considering a 2003 L200 4-cyl as a used car buy. It has 32k miles & seems well-kept. Is this chain oiler problem an issue with 2003s as well, or just '00-01's? I thought that compared with the oil-burning problems with the S-Series, the L-series 4-cyl engines were essentially "problem free."

...
1996 SW2

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Old 11-24-2013, 12:10 AM   #74
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

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Originally Posted by RadioRon View Post
I am sorry to come "late to the party" on this question, but am considering a 2003 L200 4-cyl as a used car buy. It has 32k miles & seems well-kept. Is this chain oiler problem an issue with 2003s as well, or just '00-01's? I thought that compared with the oil-burning problems with the S-Series, the L-series 4-cyl engines were essentially "problem free."
I drove the car today and it seems well-kept. It had a Dec. 2002 build date, so would that be on the "tipping point" of having or not having the chain/oil issue corrected?

...
1996 SW2

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Old 11-24-2013, 02:41 AM   #75
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

The production date of the car you're considering should put it outside of the timing chain/oiler recall issue. My car has a production date of 05/2000 and was already outside of the recall. You may contact GM with the VIN via the link below. Go to an online chat and you'll be told of any recalls the vehicle was subject to and, if so, whether or not they have a record of correction.

http://www.gm.com/toolbar/contactUs.html

My car has been remarkably trouble free. All work under the hood has been maintenance related. I couldn't be more pleased with how this car has run from the beginning.

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Old 11-24-2013, 02:21 PM   #76
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Pierrot: Thanks for the info, but what you say about the production dates seems to contradict what "Lippy" said in his 3-12-12 post:

"While the chain recall was with the early models...GM did not put the timing chain oiling modification into production until early to mid-2003 (it would be nice to get a serial number range). So, the failure can still occur through mid-2003 & high-mileage vehicles that don't have the chain replaced as preventative maintenance.

When I bought my used 2003 L200 with 90k, the first thing I did was send it to the mechanic to replace the chain & verify the oiling modification. My car did NOT have the modification."


So I guess I am still puzzled.

...
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Old 11-24-2013, 03:20 PM   #77
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

Well, for the sake of argument, I will accept Lippy's remarks as correct relative to the oiler issue. However, I stand by my remark regarding the recall. My car was not part of it and I verified that with GM. The oiler may not have been updated until some point in 2003, but that should not automatically be taken to mean all vehicles with a first design oiler will be significantly more prone to failure. Further, who knows why GM went with a new oiler? It could be that they were looking for a better deal on timing components and part of that included changes in the oiler and the timing chain guide/s.

I've considered replacing my timing chain and related components after I hit 200K miles - not very long from now - but that's an elective procedure for me when the time comes. My car isn't special and I'm not particularly special either. I've done the simple things to support the life of the car. I'm certain that my regular oil changes with quality filters are a significant reason for the engine's longevity. Abuse of any product via poor maintenance will shorten its life.

I update my mileage here with every "thousand" which goes by. I have no worries about the timing chain system. Could it fail? Yes, it could fail at any time. However, that is true of almost anything on an automobile and yet the vast majority of a car's mechanical parts work well and thrive with basic maintenance taken care of regularly. Having said all of this, please remember that what is written here by Lippy and me is anecdotal. They speak to our experiences.

If you have any doubts about the '03 L200 purchase you're considering then you should let it go. If it were me, I'd wouldn't hesitate to buy it. My view of any sizable purchase is that I must have confidence in it and not feel hesitant.

...
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Old 11-16-2014, 11:29 AM   #78
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

I have a question for you gents...my 2001 L200 2.2 DOHC has about 40k of "my miles" on it. Always ran good and pretty quiet. Ive had for three years but I think its a replaced motor as it has the "2002 2.2 DOHC" marked on the cam gear cover with white paint. So I think it came form a Junkyard. In any event that a little background.

So it became noisy in the chain area a while back and I researched here in this thread and it led me to check the tensioner. I changed it and it got considerably quieter. Yea! but then a few weeks later it got noisy and "clappy" started to bog and stall so I decided to change the chain.

Got all the parts, tore it apart according to the PDF DIY in the thread and began reassembling. The short story is that after replacing the balancer chain and timing chain and full complement of guides, tensioners, oilers int he Cloyes Kits with all marks lined up and on pulleys and chains it turned over fine by hand and when started it makes the same clapping tap sound and after running around the block began to stall/labor in idle.

So I think there is something out of time...

I will confess that when disassembling I lined up the cam lobes on #4 to "10 to 2" like it said and although I didn't lock them I marked the tops of the shafts. Then removed the pulleys. When reassembling I noticed that the marks on the pulleys were not in a position where you could line up the chain marks. Not even close. So realizing that the Cam shafts are keyed to the pulleys and the chain aligns with the marks it seems unnecessary to lock the cams in place.

Also, it seemed strange to me at the time but I had to rotate the exhaust cam (with chain in position) to get the intake cam to line up with marks on sprocket. There was a spring tension to the final positioning of the two cam sprockets. Is that normal?

Once the marks are aligned from crank to cam pulley gears and slack is out of chain whats the difference where the cam lobes are? everything should be timed up right?

So...obviously my question is what could be giving me the same results with a new chain? (assuming its installed correctly)

BTW, the old chain had plenty of slack, the right (black) guide was shattered and lying in the case. So it definitely needed replaced.

Lets hear from ya.

Last edited by SatinPA; 11-16-2014 at 11:35 AM..

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Old 04-30-2016, 10:57 AM   #79
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

I already posted this in a new thread but thought I should post here to get more people to read it, and if you like, you can reply there in Need Help -- divergent opinions:

Hello:

First time post. I'm not a technician so I need some advice from experts like yourself.

My timing chain broke while backing out of a parking space, or at least the car stalled and I couldn't start it and was towed to a garage.

They said the tensioner broke and that caused the timing chain to jump and snap. They did the leak down test and said there was no valve damage. They gave me a total cost to fix the chain and replace the valve cover gaskets at approx $1,500. However, the next day they called and said they wanted to also drop the oil pan to ensure no pieces of metal from the broken tensioner got in there and also to do a preventive repair by replacing the old tensioner balance shaft chain which was still okay. The service lady was pushy about this but I didn't want to fix something that wasn't broke and the question about the oil pan was pure speculation -- they had no idea that metal had gotten in there.

So, I called another garage and had the car towed there. The other garage assured me that they wouldn't fix anything that wasn't broken. When he got it, he said that it didn't need new valve covers, didn't need a balance shaft chain and that the timing chain tensioner had broken in two and didn't see how any pieces could have gotten into the oil pan.

However, the new garage insisted that they do another leak down test, despite my objection. In fact, he already had prepared estimates on the engine rebuild or engine replacement, which I found a little bit suspicious. Of course, when he did the leak down test, it failed and showed valve damage.

Now I need your advice. Who's telling the truth? The garage that did the original test is Honest-1, a national chain; the garage that did the second test is a Mom & Pop, local outfit. The second guy is very confident that this is the best option and that the $3,000 rebuild is the way to go.

What do you think?

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Old 04-30-2016, 11:45 AM   #80
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Default Re: Upgraded L-Series 2.2L Timing Chain Tensioner & Oiler (Pictures and Part Numbers)

I think you'll get no guarantee from the 2nd garage if they can't do a leakdown test.

It would be very lucky if your engine didn't sustain valve damage from a TC chain fail. As it's an interference engine, it's almost a given that it did sustain damage.

Get a quote for a guaranteed JY engine replacement.

YOur mechanics could end up chasing a can of worms around your engine if you try and nickle and dime troubleshooting and part choices/replacement on this rebuild.

...
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