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View Poll Results: Would You Buy A Big SUV Like The Outlook With Current Price Trends?
Yes. 16 30.19%
No. 27 50.94%
Maybe. 4 7.55%
Depends On Market Conditions At That Time. 6 11.32%
Voters: 53. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-02-2005, 09:59 AM   #1
Bertillion
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Question Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

I know this is a temporary crisis, but don't you think the big SUV has seen its day? There was a good article in the local paper about the introduction of the new Jeep Commander. Jeep Article. I'm sure the Outlook is going to be a nice vehicle and probably will sell decently. I just think GM isn't going to make any profit on it. Anyone wanna flame me or post any other comments on this

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Old 09-02-2005, 11:03 AM   #2
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

The outlook is a unibody FWD minivan wannabe as far a fuel milage is concerned. The Jeep commander on the other hand is a real truck and will suck down fuel in comparison.

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Old 09-02-2005, 04:50 PM   #3
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

The Outlook (and GMC/Buick crossovers) is expected to be mentioned in the same breaths as the Pacifica and Freestyle. Even if they flop (which I doubt) the architecture won't go to waste, it's being used on the new GM minivans that come out near the end of the decade.

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Old 09-03-2005, 12:32 AM   #4
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

There might be a market because there are always people with a lot of passengers to haul around who don't like the look of vans.
I answered no to the question because I'd buy a Suburban. I don't trust the longevity of large vehicles with FWD based drivetrains.

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Old 09-03-2005, 06:38 AM   #5
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

GM can build whatever it wants,but IMO the market will belong to the most fuel efficent vehicles. There will always be some buyer who can afford 300 Horsepower rides and mamoth SUVs and some who will even pay thousands in gas guzzler taxes just to have them.But the average American car owner just cant afford these toys and the company that gives the public what it needs in time of crisis will have the most success with its products.The corporation to be hit hardest IMO will be Chrysler who is bent on building Hemi V8s in many of its products and large trucks leaving itself little room for the current market demands.Many at Chrysler/Benz still think its the 1960s.If Saturn can make a fuel efficent Outlook(upper 20smpg highway wont be concitered fuel efficent much longer) they will sell a bunch of them.

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Old 09-03-2005, 09:48 AM   #6
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

Until Saturn's image changes from bland family car to stylish car that the masses actually say wow that's a nice car. All Saturn's will fail. Image matters. You make a car people want and people will buy it. You make a bland car that inspires nobody then almost nobody will buy it. L-series was a nice car that was very bland. ION was a nicer car than 10+ year old s-series, but still bland with the exceptions of classy accent rail and center dash (those were great ideas . VUE was a decent offering, but CVT doomed it to be known a unreliable. Relay should have been viewed as what it is...a van. You don't call a horse a dog just because somebody might not like horses. The outlook will do fine if it is a style that people go...WOW. Like the SKY, otherwise it will fail like the others have.

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Old 09-03-2005, 09:58 AM   #7
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Idea Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

Folks with larger families are going to need some type of vehicle to transport themselves around in. I think we'll see large SUVs like the Tahoe, Yukon, Sequoia, and Expedition fall as those families move to more fuel efficient midsize SUVs like the the Outlook, Pilot, and Highlander.

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Old 09-03-2005, 12:27 PM   #8
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

I agree with Charlie. I think we'll see the segment for the "bigger than a minivan, smaller than your TANK" suv's expand rapidly, and put the big gas guzzlers out of their commission for good.

Lol, I always hated Excursions anyway, and now Ford's replacing even it with a larger one called the Everest. Morons. Have they SEEN gas prices? They must be nuts.

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Old 09-03-2005, 03:43 PM   #9
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

I think the Outlook's target market will be fine. It's in that "just right" size category for an SUV/crossover, and I'm sure it will get better gas mileage than your typical Explorer/Expedition/Yukon/Suburban.

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Old 09-03-2005, 07:37 PM   #10
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

Uhh...

If the average American car buyer can afford the $35k Sienna XLE Ltd's and +30k other Siennas and Highlanders and Honda Ody's and Pilots that I see running around here, without rebates...I don't think the SUV's that are going for $28k on Employee discounts are a huge affordability problem.

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Old 09-03-2005, 09:14 PM   #11
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

Quote:
Originally Posted by walt
GM can build whatever it wants,but IMO the market will belong to the most fuel efficent vehicles. There will always be some buyer who can afford 300 Horsepower rides and mamoth SUVs and some who will even pay thousands in gas guzzler taxes just to have them.But the average American car owner just cant afford these toys and the company that gives the public what it needs in time of crisis will have the most success with its products.The corporation to be hit hardest IMO will be Chrysler who is bent on building Hemi V8s in many of its products and large trucks leaving itself little room for the current market demands.Many at Chrysler/Benz still think its the 1960s.If Saturn can make a fuel efficent Outlook(upper 20smpg highway wont be concitered fuel efficent much longer) they will sell a bunch of them.
VERY perceptive.Chrysler once again with the wrong cars at the wrong time. And apparently there will be a several month gap between the last Neon and the Caliber, the Neon replacement [and as ugly as it gets from the pictures I have seen ]. $3.50 a gallon gas and nothing economical to sell ? [I don't classify the Jeep Liberty Diesel as economical; at least not in the way a Neon is] Smooth move. Advantage Chrysler.... NOT.
The full size SUV market peaked a couple of years ago and has been trending downward ever since, according to The Car Connection. August alone was down 33 %.
It was only a matter of time. Fads come and go : compacts, hatchbacks, pony cars, mini vans, station wagons, personal luxury coupes..... then the cycle repeats. There will always be a market for a certain # of each of these types of cars, but, yes, Bertillion, I think the traditional SUV market has peaked. But lets drop our other plans and pull the full size SUVs and trucks forward, eh GM ? A little more massaging of the corporate vision to squeeze some short term gains out of the SUV market share, I guess. Just in time for Honda to bring out the new Civic..... go figure.

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Old 09-04-2005, 01:05 AM   #12
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JADEDSL2
Lol, I always hated Excursions anyway, and now Ford's replacing even it with a larger one called the Everest. Morons. Have they SEEN gas prices? They must be nuts.
The Excursion is awesome. People complain too much about it. What other vehicles can haul 7 people in comfort, a bunch of stuff and tow a 10000lb trailer? The Suburban is an awesome vehicle also. There will always be a market for ultimate capability vehicles. It might not be 200K units per year, but it will be enough to make producing the vehicles worth it.

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Old 09-04-2005, 08:03 AM   #13
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

That's true. The mini van market peaked, but there is no denying the importance of having one available. Saturn won't be selling 100,000 SKYs, but does anyone think it doesn't have an important place in the line up?
I am not interested in a large SUV, but there are thousands out there who are. And a lot of those may just LOVE the way Saturn serves it up.

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Old 09-08-2005, 07:37 AM   #14
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

I agree that the days of the big SUV are numbered. Fuel efficient cars will be the wave of the future for most Americans. However, I see one trend emerging in the small van market. The Mazda5 and the new Subaru van will be fuel efficient people haulers. Have you noticed all of the first generation Toyota vans still on the road? The current crop of minivans have, IMO gotten too big, too bloated, too expensive and not fuel efficient. I hope that GM gives us something in this small van category.

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Old 09-08-2005, 08:52 AM   #15
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
I agree that the days of the big SUV are numbered. Fuel efficient cars will be the wave of the future for most Americans. However, I see one trend emerging in the small van market. The Mazda5 and the new Subaru van will be fuel efficient people haulers. Have you noticed all of the first generation Toyota vans still on the road? The current crop of minivans have, IMO gotten too big, too bloated, too expensive and not fuel efficient. I hope that GM gives us something in this small van category.
AMEN. Time to revisit the original Voyager/Caravan concept. All the new products are ridiculously over sized for what they're called on to do.
I LIKED the new Mustang till I saw one up close and realized what a bloated pig it is. Same with the Mitsubishi Eclipse. 3500 lb "sports car" ???? WTF.
A minivan the size of the VUE would be very close to the original mini van concept. But that will be yet another market that GM will hand over to the Koreans and the Japanese. A "portfolio" so heavily weighted towards gas hogs is going to cause GM's market share to implode.Even the compact pick ups were replaced by even larger "mid size" trucks.
It's a shame, but they've had 20 or more years to be prepared for another gas crisis and have taken steps in the OPPOSITE direction while Toyota was hedging it's bets with fuel efficient vehicles being sold right alongside it's largest models.
Nothing was learned from the 70s or the 80s it seems.

Last edited by Citation84; 09-08-2005 at 08:59 AM..

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Old 09-08-2005, 09:30 AM   #16
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidsky
The Excursion is awesome. People complain too much about it. What other vehicles can haul 7 people in comfort, a bunch of stuff and tow a 10000lb trailer? The Suburban is an awesome vehicle also. There will always be a market for ultimate capability vehicles. It might not be 200K units per year, but it will be enough to make producing the vehicles worth it.

Ay ay! I rode in a V10 Limited Edition Excursion for a 19 hour trip! I didn't ever really get uncomfortable. I think there was 6 of us in there. 13 mpg going 85 mph at ~1600 rpm.

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Old 09-08-2005, 05:41 PM   #17
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JADEDSL2
Lol, I always hated Excursions anyway, and now Ford's replacing even it with a larger one called the Everest. Morons. Have they SEEN gas prices? They must be nuts.
They're not nuts, just poor planners. The Everest, though due as a 2007 model, was conceived well in advance of $3/gal gasoline prices. GM had no way of knowing that a Category 4 hurricane would wreak havoc on the Gulf Coast refineries within a half-year before the GMT900s were due to enter the marketplace, are they dumb*, too? (just a rhetorical question) Please don't think that I am defending them. Poor planning is just that -poor planning. Ill-timed launch is another euphemism that comes to mind.

Anyway, car-based crossovers are the future as far as I'm concerned. DaimlerChrysler and the Japanese Big 3 are well along paving this road. Ford will have the Lincoln Aviator, Fairlane and Mercury Freestyle (some "M" name, perhaps Montclair or Monarch?) as car-based alternatives to the ginormous Everest. At least with the Saturn Outlook and its Buick/GMC variants, GM won't be as late to this party as they have been in the past.


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Old 09-08-2005, 10:09 PM   #18
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

I wouldn't buy a big SUV no matter what fuel costs.

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Old 09-09-2005, 08:35 AM   #19
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Default Re: Is There Going To Be A Market For The Outlook?

All true Gr898SL2.
Can't believe though that there wasn't one long term planner in the organization that could see another gas "crisis" coming and a market change brewing. It was only a matter of time for either. Short term profits over long term profitability rules, I guess.
Let's hope the Outlook is sensational and not just an "offering" or "prescence" in the market like the Relay or GM's other mini vans. They can at LEAST make it as attractive as Saab's version of the corporate small SUV.

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