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Old 05-11-2005, 11:57 PM   #1
plainzwalker
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Dizzy My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

Yet another problem to conquer... I'm begining to think my saturn REALLY hates me. Yesterday I get in my car to drive home from work, and when I start the car its running REAL rough. I've never seen this problem before in any of my cars. So I get out and check to make sure all the wires were secure and they were. I turned the car off and replaced the oem wires with my old SPS wires and it still does it. I hooked up my laptop and I got a P0301 code.

Now I've read it can be either plugs, valve cover gasket (I think that was one) or intake manifold gasket.. It's a 99 DOHC engine with around 40k miles on it. I'm going to go buy plugs at lunch time, sadly only ones I've EVER seen in Germany are bosch so those will have to do till I can order some ngk plugs. Any other suggestions on what I can check?

Thank You

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Old 05-12-2005, 12:04 AM   #2
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

bosch will be fine IF you buy the regulars, not the platiums.

remove the spark plug wires from the valve cover, if you find oil in the holes, the valve cover gasket is bad.

if you spray carb cleaner around the #1 intake runner and the RPMs drop, then the intake manifold gasket is bad.

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Old 05-12-2005, 12:52 AM   #3
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

Intake Runner is the deal with the TB on it right?

I believe the autoparts store on post sales regular bosches, I know they have platinum. If I have to, I have an early day today and I can find the part number here, and then go to a german auto parts store and see what they have, but the only place that I know of off post only sales bosch.


Man oh man I hope its not a gasket problem. Last time I tried replacing the valve cover gasket they sent me wrong one. Now that I think of it, when I first changed the plugs I remember seeing oil on one of the plugs (can't remember which). But the problem went away after I removed the valve cover, clean it real good, tried to install the new gasket (and found out it was WAY too big) cleaned the old gasket, applied RTV and reinstalled the old gasket. But that was almost 9-10 months ago... Its been a while, and for it to suddenly come up like this when it was fine earlier in the day is baffling me.

Thank You Again, and I'll post here what my results are after lunch.

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Old 05-12-2005, 05:02 AM   #4
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

If there is substancial oil in the plug wells, that can cause spark to short through the oil. If you are going to replace the plugs anyway, (and I agree, if possible, and I know in your situation, selection may be limited, do not get the platinum Bosch plugs), be sure to clean the plug wires thoroughly inside and out to remove all oil. If you are not going to change the plugs, try to remove as much oil from the wells as possible. You can use paper towels stuffed down around the plugs and again clean the wires. Better yet just remove the plugs and clean the porcilin.

As for the valve cover gasket, where did you order it from? If it is leaking it would be best to replace it. Again I don't know your parts availability and you gotta do what you gotta do as they say.

I would also try the check for an intake leak suggested by sierrap615.
Good luck

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Old 05-12-2005, 06:59 AM   #5
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

Well, when I put the SPS wires back on yesterday I did look for oil on the wire boots and I didn't see any.

As for the gasket, I actually ordered it from one of the SaturnParts.xxx (can't remember which, but its the one based out of PA if I remember right). I think I'll look else where for the gasket. I'll have to wait a lil longer to get the plugs, work is killing me with a deadline that needs to be met by end of the day essentially.


Thanks

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Old 05-12-2005, 11:39 AM   #6
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

K this is what the plugs look like...they are all looking pretty bad in my opinion...They only had platinums at the store, so I'm ordering some NGK plugs tonight.


However, the problem still exists with the new plugs. Any suggestions? I'm still not sure how to check for an intake leak...


Thank you


-edit-

pics didnt work right...so im adding attachments
Attached Images
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File Type: jpg 4.jpg (96.4 KB, 44 views)
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File Type: jpg 3.jpg (88.1 KB, 37 views)

Last edited by plainzwalker; 05-12-2005 at 11:44 AM..

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Old 05-13-2005, 12:03 AM   #7
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

the runner is the single tube leading from the distributing area of the manifold to one cylinder in the head.(hence you have four runners, the one on the cylinder closest to the top engine mount is the number one runner) spray carb cleaner mainly where the intake runner mets the head(intake gasket area).

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Old 05-13-2005, 01:04 AM   #8
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

K thats what I thought, but wasn't sure.. I sprayed carb cleaner all around the valve cover seal, and I think around the intake manifold as well, but I didn't see any changes, I'll do it again today to double check.

If it doesn't change the idle at all, what should I check next? I'm almost tempted to take into the shop, but I doubt they will be able to do anything since they mainly do oil changes, brakes and tires. I know on my geo I had they werent "allowed" to install the exhaust manifold. I hate being outside the US when it comes to american cars, I either have to pay a huge amount to get my car worked on or I have to do it myself. I don't mind doing it myself, but I'm not that experienced at it.

Thank You for the help.

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Old 05-13-2005, 02:10 AM   #9
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

The pics of the plugs are pretty dark but they still look pretty carbon fouled with the ground electrode fairly erroded away. The first thought that came to mind when I saw them was looks like it is running rich. There have been many threads here that attribute this somewhat to the ECT sensor among other things. I presume you have a clean air filter and PCV valve also checking that the EGR valve is working right. Even though the platinum plugs are not the first choice, when newly installed, they should work fine. It is just that they have a tendency to foul quickly in these engines.

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Old 05-13-2005, 02:39 AM   #10
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

The air filter is fairly clean, it almost looks new (Actually I believe I replaced it within the last 3000-4000 miles). The ECTS is a new brass one replaced roughly 9-10 months ago. As for the EGR, I removed/cleaned it approximatly 1-2 months ago (when I replaced the ignition coils, I've been trouble shooting a P0341 error code).

I asked my wife to take the car over to the German Opel/Daewoo/Some other Foriegn Company dealership this afternoon. I know they used to be a chevy dealer as well, so hopefully they will be able to look at it. Hopefully they can tell me fairly quickly what the problem is, since they seem to be pretty good over there, just pricey as all hell.

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Old 05-13-2005, 05:10 AM   #11
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

K...update....

My wife took the car to the dealership, and after about an hour of examining the car (for free ) he narrowed it down to one problem. I'm guessing its the ignition module (or in my wife's words "the black thingy next to the coils"). So, I'm going to look into replacing this, since I always already debating replacing this in search for my P0341 problem it seems like the thing to do.


Should I go OEM on this part or is there a aftermarket model thats good?


Thank You

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Old 05-13-2005, 07:32 AM   #12
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

K... after searching at various stores I've found a couple different ones. SatunParts.com/.net show two different prices for thier "oem" one.

Discountautoparts has 2 types, AC Delco and "Standard MotorProducts" (the Standard Motor Prodcuts show it with coils in the picture, but I'm not sure if they are included), and autozone as a "Wells" brand one. All of them, except for the Standard one, are within a $20 price difference, the Standard one is cheaper at $130ish. I emailed 6th Planet for a qoute.

Should I try to go for a used one or should I go for a new/oem one?

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Old 05-13-2005, 09:48 AM   #13
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Mad Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

Quote:
Originally posted by Sierrap615
bosch will be fine IF you buy the regulars, not the platiums.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sky King
If you are going to replace the plugs anyway, (and I agree, if possible, and I know in your situation, selection may be limited, do not get the platinum Bosch plugs)....
I've used Bosch Platinum in my cars since I did the first tune up. What's wrong with them? Also, what spark plugs are recommended?

I am going to do a major tune-up in July/August. I just ordered new MSD wires (my current are OEM with 100,000 miles on them) and an O2 sensor (original one with 180,000 miles currently on it). Is Bosch a good brand of O2 sensors?

...
"Congratulations on your brand new 2007 Acura" - Tenisha, the On*Star rep that handled my call during the Aura's delivery

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Old 05-13-2005, 12:24 PM   #14
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgates2b
I've used Bosch Platinum in my cars since I did the first tune up. What's wrong with them? Also, what spark plugs are recommended?

IIs Bosch a good brand of O2 sensors?
I had the Bosch platinum in my 99 SC-2. My brother had put the Bosch Platinum +4's in the 95 SL-2 that I bought from him for my wife. Both cars were not running real great. No real problems in particular but just had no pep. I removed the Bosch Platinums after reading on this board about how many people had experienced poor performance with them. They had said that for some reason they seem to foul quicker. After removing them from my cars with not a lot of miles on the plugs, I noted that mine were fouled also. I replaced them with the Saturn reccomended plugs. They are the NGK plugs. Don't have the number handy but they made a real differance in both cars.

As for the O2 sensor. The consensus among the accepted experts on this board, do not use aftermarket O2 sensors. Go with the Saturn OEM part. It really isn't that expensive.

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Old 05-13-2005, 02:32 PM   #15
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Default Re: My saturn hates me (Misfire -P0301-)

And on mine, I've been using Autolite and I'm very happy. Cost = 49 cents each, when on sale. I pick up 16 at a clip. No, I would not change.

...
> 95 SL 2 = 649,619 Miles 40.4 MPG, as of 4/19/11. My manual Radiator Fan Switch, courtesy of Wolfman's patient installation guidance, continues to be.......invaluable <

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