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Old 02-23-2004, 06:48 AM   #1
walt
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Mad offical vti production stopped

Why do I get this sinking feeling in my stomach,now that its offical and it apears all vti production has ended. They are telling us no recalls yet and that only a small percent of vtis are effected. Whos part of that small percent? If its so small why stop production?Is this tempoary or are we getting a snow job? What about us owners who may wish to sell in a year or so? Will our retailer give us the same on a trade and a 5 speed or regular auto trans VUE. Will we be told we cant sell these vehicles because the units are to expensive to replace and prone to failure. Are us vti owners in deep dodo?What will be left of our vehicles resale value when consumers and the regular auto press gets done with our vehicles?Am I being paranoid?

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Old 02-23-2004, 08:06 AM   #2
boone
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1997 SL2
Question

Did you hear something we haven't? Last I heard they were abandoning the VTi in the ION Quad Coupes, but that the VUE would be available with the VTi again in April.

I'm very curious as to why they've temporarily stopped. As a VTi owner, I would hope that Saturn takes care of us.

My VTi has been running well since last May...hope it stays that way. I really enjoy driving a CVT when it's running properly.

I do have concerns about how the poor perception of the VTi will affect my resale value.

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Old 02-23-2004, 09:05 AM   #3
Laurence
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We're assuming facts not in evidence here! These rumors seem to be flying around but that's what they are so far: rumors. So far there's nothing definitive from Saturn about the discontinuation of the VTi in the VUE--at least I've not seen anything other than the postings on this forum. First, someone says the VTi is discontinued in the VUE and then we hear that's incorrect and the VTi is only discontinued in the ION, now here we are again with another rumor to the effect that the VTi is discontinued, Period.

And don't count on Saturn "taking care of us" because as someone else has already said car companies look after themselves.

But before we get too concerened perhaps we should await some official notification or some publicity. Yes, I'm concerned because after what I've been reading on this great website there are apparently flaws and problems with the VTi but no one knows as to what percentage fail or have to be repaired. The 2002 VTi's will be putting some serious mileage on by now so we should soon know just how well the VTi is holding up.

As for me, I don't trust the VTi over the long term but I could be wrong and my VTi might be trouble-free for 100,000 miles. But recently the infamous "Saturn Shudder and Vibration" showed up so I have to get the VUE to my dealer pronto. I like innovation and from what I read the VTi had been ten years in testing and developing so I thought that it would be a trouble-free component when it got into a production vehicle. Looks like I was wrong. But I don't have peace of mind and will probably get rid of the VUE anyway by the end of the year. R.I.P.

Laurence

2003 White VUE FWD VTi
Tan leather interior

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Old 02-23-2004, 09:18 AM   #4
boone
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Idea

This article just popped up on Google news. From it:

Quote:
A GM Europe spokesman put total CVT production at about 100,000 units. He says the problem is related to assembly, not design or engineering.
Quote:
Frakes says GM engineers are working with suppliers to fix two problems with the CVT. She would not elaborate.
SaturnFans' Charlie is quoted too!

It says 37% of VUEs have the VTi. That's a large community...more than we see on this site.

We'll see how it plays out.

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Old 02-23-2004, 10:32 AM   #5
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I guess my "crystal ball" was working when I said this back in Sept. '03:

Quote:
I don't have a VTi, but what I've seen on the VUE forum makes me think that the design is OK, but poor manufacturing in some cases has caused some problems.
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...021#post256021

Once the manufacturing problems are corrected, the VTi will probably be a fine piece of machinery. Maybe GM should have Honda build them instead of Opel?

...
Hobbes

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2003 VUE 5sp, Hitch, DIY CC
1996 SL2 5sp

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Old 02-23-2004, 11:32 AM   #6
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I read the article from AutoWeek and why do I feel that we're not being given all the facts?

There's a degree of ambiguity in the article in that at one point a "GM spokesman claims the problem with the VTi is related to assembly, and not design or engineering." Then another quote in the same article states that "GM engineers are working with suppliers to fix two problems with the CVT." So which is it? Are the "two problems" related to incorrect assembly or what?

The VUE is now in its third model year and GM has had plenty of time to get it right and solve the problems--either assembly or otherwise. Sad to say I no longer trust the VTi long term and wish that I'd gone with something more conventional and when word gets out that the VTi is a problem tranny and that GM has ceased production (even temporarily) you can expect the value of the VUE with VTi's to plummet.

Laurence

2003 White VUE FWD VTi
Tan leather interior

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Old 02-23-2004, 11:43 AM   #7
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About 20 complaints have been filed with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration by Saturn owners who say the transmission hesitates at low speeds, causes the engine to rev wildly and makes grinding noises. Some drivers with transmission problems are worried that their vehicles will leave them stranded in traffic and cause an accident. No accidents or injuries have been reported.



I am sure there are more than 20 VTi's with the famous low speed grinding sound!! I bet you 99% of them have it. They changed an entire kit on mine to get rid of the grinding sound and it came back 5 months later!

I just hope they treat us VTi owners right!!

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Old 02-23-2004, 11:52 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by tominsky
...I bet you 99% of them have it. ...
Seventy-five percent of all statistics are made up on the spot.

I have confidence that Saturn will stand behind their product like they have always done regardless of their redefined alignment within the GM fold. BTW, my ION VTi is performing flawlessly. So I guess I'm in that one percent.

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Old 02-23-2004, 12:09 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gerry Proctor
Seventy-five percent of all statistics are made up on the spot.

In this case, 100%

So I guess I'm in that one percent.
I guess so!


It seems like the "grind" is only in the VUE VTi's.

This is a VUE forum, right?

I just hope you are right and that they will stand behind their product!

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Old 02-23-2004, 12:13 PM   #10
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Same trans (M75) in the ION and FWD VUE.

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Old 02-23-2004, 02:02 PM   #11
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Vue is too heavy for the VTI. JMHO

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Old 02-23-2004, 04:53 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by tominsky
I guess so!


It seems like the "grind" is only in the VUE VTi's.

Actually, I just took my wife's 2004 Ion Quad 3 (just over 2000 miles on it) in for the low speed grinding noise. The service advisor is currently contacting the Saturn Engineers to find out what the next step is. He said something about replacing part of the external case.

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Old 02-23-2004, 04:56 PM   #13
The Math God
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what are the chances of GM/Saturn replacing our VTIs with a traditional automatic?

...
2007 Vue -- AWD 3.5 Honda
2005 Vue -- AWD 3.5 Honda
2007 Ion 2 -- 2.2
2005 L300 -- 6 cyl

Gone but not forgotten
2003 Vue -- 105K-traded in
2000 LS 2 --140 K-totaled
1994 SL-- 100K-sold

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Old 02-23-2004, 05:02 PM   #14
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Shudder and vibration is my complaint on the vti.Even after software reprogram it is still there to a lesser extent.Also at -10 c it screeches and whines for a few seconds when I put it in drive and take off.Also road salt and sand is starting to damage the rear door paint(get mud flaps and cladding this week!!!)I guess this vehicle is designed for so.cal. only!!!!

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Old 02-23-2004, 09:48 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by The Math God
what are the chances of GM/Saturn replacing our VTIs with a traditional automatic?
The percentage chance is 100%. The VTI is dead.

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Old 02-23-2004, 10:28 PM   #16
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I would like to see Saturn replace the VTi with the 4 speed auto from the L series, and leave the 5 speed automatic on the ION. I can't stand the 5 speed auto/2.2 combination..
No offense to VTi owners, but I am glad.. I have seen too many come through the doors with problems at work.
~D.J.~

...
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Old 02-23-2004, 10:37 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by OhioVueBoy
I would like to see Saturn replace the VTi with the 4 speed auto from the L series, and leave the 5 speed automatic on the ION. I can't stand the 5 speed auto/2.2 combination..
No offense to VTi owners, but I am glad.. I have seen too many come through the doors with problems at work.
~D.J.~
I personally prefer the 4 speed auto over the 5 speed auto with the ecotec, I don't know why, but the 5 speed auto just doesn't seem right, the 4 speed auto feels like almost a perfect gear combo. But thats just me.

...
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Old 02-23-2004, 11:15 PM   #18
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They can have my VTi back if they deliver a 2004 V6 VUE to my driveway.

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Old 02-24-2004, 10:03 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by boone
They can have my VTi back if they deliver a 2004 V6 VUE to my driveway.
No problem, just show them the money!

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Old 02-25-2004, 11:30 PM   #20
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the design of the vti is rather risky. it contains two sheeves(cones )which the steel belt rides on and in order for it to work flawlessly the two sheeves need to work in exact oppisite of each other in exact timing if either sheeve miss times these movements the belt will slip (hense vti noise and bucking) the steel belt relies totally on this sheeve pressure or tightness to hold it in place and retain it's tention.if you asked me i'd say a tentioner add on is in the vti's future.which would eliminate this belt slipping problem .i'll leave the design up to the enigeneers.

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