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Old 10-17-2018, 10:40 PM   #1
sc2 saturn
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Default sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

so i got pair of 120w lights shine nice into ditch but i hate having to use two switch's one for the aftermarket light and other for high beams

i can't figure out how to wiring it on a backwards system like saturns where everything is power then drops to ground i know 5pin relay the middle would be trigger wire but when i tried to attempt to wire it the aftermarket lights stayed off and quad beams would be on i tested relay and its not even getting triggered to activate 12v to the lights so my question is how do i wire it so it triggers to allow current to flow through it too my aftermarket lights?

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Old 10-18-2018, 12:09 AM   #2
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

Middle terminal is the trigger one? What kind of relay are you using?

Standard relay layout attached.
85 Trigger + (low amp fused battery power)
86 Trigger - (ground switched source ie: high beam ground)
30 Source power (high amp, 30-40, battery power)
87 Load 1 (lights you want turned on when activated)
87a Load 2 (unused or lights you want turned off when activated)

Pins 85/86 are used to activate the relay. By default it allows power from pin 30 to pin 87a, once activated it switch's to pin 87. A 4 pin relay does effectively the same thing, only it can only be used for a single load as it only has 87.
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Old 10-19-2018, 03:09 AM   #3
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

bosch 5pin relay -----> BOS 0332019150

u lost me on the low amp power and the high amp power when u said there both battery powered

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Old 10-19-2018, 08:38 AM   #4
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

The activation circuit (pin 85 & 86) only needs low amps (lowest rated fuse you can find) while the load circuit (pin 30 & 87/87a) needs higher amps to run whatever you wish it to (your relay says max of 30amp).

You can use a higher rated fuse for the activation circuit if that's all you can find, there's just no reason for that circuit to be using more than 1amp, if even that much so if it blows a 3 amp fuse you know there's an issue with the wiring. Using a higher rated fuse than the circuit needs to or even can handle defeat's the main purpose of the fuse (20amp fuse won't protect devices that can only handle 10amp of power...).

You've got a standard GM style relay with the diagram on how to wire it molded into the side of it and the pins marked on the bottom...the middle pin is 87a which has no effect on the activation circuit.

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Old 12-13-2018, 03:17 AM   #5
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

finally got time to do the wiring for relay wanna just double check make sure everything is right



since 85 is low amp's, could it be possible to hooked up too 12v orange wire on highbeam which is also connected from factory to 10amp fuse under hood junction box

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Old 12-13-2018, 10:13 AM   #6
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

The circuit won't notice the extra load from the relay contacts, but depending on how you make the spice could cause issues. Soldering & heat shrink is best but I find soldering impossible so I strip a bit extra wire and use crimp connectors with HQ heat shrink (the extra wire is over the recommendation so the wires touch directly inside the connector).

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Old 12-15-2018, 04:34 PM   #7
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

so kinda wired it but ran into issue the ground for the lights, if i ground it to frame or to highbeam wire it just stays on when lights are active they dont go off when highbeams are disengaged so basically they stay on all the time with lows or highbeams how do i change that so lightbar/square lights have full brightness and come on with highbeams only?

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Old 12-15-2018, 10:09 PM   #8
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

Go back & look at your relay diagram and see how it differ's from how you now say you wired it

Headlights (all the lights too) are ground switched, they have power when the key is in "run" and the headlight switch provides the ground. It's backward from how people normally think of things wired.

pin 85 should goto one high-beam wire, pin 86 to the other (same connector). or you can run either pin to battery power and the other to the pink wire.

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Old 12-16-2018, 02:48 AM   #9
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

sc2 saturn, are you wiring the 120 watt lights to turn on with high beams? What isn't well known is GMs use of daytime running lights with high beams. This presents a possible wiring issue if adapting signals from factory wiring to control aftermarket lighting. If you choose to wire your aftermarket lighting separately, this may be wiser. Interfering with factory wiring may create problems and prevent daytime running lights from operating and generate an error code. Familiarity with factory wiring with DRLs is a key to determining which way to proceed. Below is your low and high beam wiring as used with DRLs. An explanation of DRLs may confuse many unfamiliar with daytime running light wiring configurations.

A brief explanation of GMs daytime running lights;

Exterior Lighting Systems Description and Operation

Headlamps/Daytime Running Lamps (DRL)

Daytime Running Lamps

Daytime running lamps are standard on all Saturn models. The DRL relay is located in the underhood fuse block (UHFB). The coil side of the DRL relay receives battery voltage. Current flows through the DRL relay coil to the body control module through circuit 592. The BCM will ground circuit 592 when DRL is required. The BCM uses ignition, park lamp, headlamp, high beam and park brake inputs to control DRL. The DRL will be enabled anytime the ignition is in the RUN position, the headlamp switch is Off, the park brake switch is Off (park brake not engaged and the gear selector is in any position but Park).

Battery voltage is supplied through the left headlamp fuse to circuit 40 to the left high beam lamp. Voltage flows through the left high beam lamp to the UHFB through circuit 1200. Current flows to the right high beam lamp from the UHFB through circuit 1200. Current flows through the right high beam lamp to the DRL relay located in the UHFB through circuit 593. The BCM provides ground to circuit 592 to energize the relay. Current flows through the closed contacts of the DRL relay to ground through circuit 150 to the forward lamp splice pack. This circuit results in both high beam lamps being connected in series, which allows the high beam lights to operate at half brightness.

The BCM will turn Off the DRL relay when it sees any of the following inputs:

*Headlamps On
*Parking brake On
*Ignition not in the RUN position
*Gear selector in Park

The BCM uses the high beam input to determine if the DRL functions are working. If the DRL functions are not operating properly a diagnostic trouble code may be set. Refer to Diagnosis in this section for further information.

Headlamps

Battery power is applied to the low and high beam elements of the left headlamp assembly by the 10A left headlamp fuse through circuit 40. Battery power is applied to the low beam element of the right headlamp assembly by the 10A right headlamp fuse through circuit 140. Battery power is applied to the right high beam element by the right headlamp fuse normally closed (DRL relay NOT energized) contacts of the DRL relay and circuit 593.

When the headlamp switch is turned to On, and the high beam switch is Off, a ground path is provided to circuit 1201 through the headlamp switch to circuit 350. Circuit 350 is grounded at I/P splice pack #2. When the high beam switch is in the ON position, a ground path is provided to circuit 1200 through the headlamp switch to circuit 350. Circuit 350 is connected to the instrument panel fuse block (IPFB) and is grounded I/P splice pack #2. This same operation is also true when the flash-to-pass feature is used. To operate the flash-to-pass feature, the headlamp switch lever is pulled toward the driver.


If you understand how complicated daytime running light wiring from regular low/high beam wiring, you can decide which way to wire up your aftermarket lights - finding where to tap into existing wiring or making a separate wiring system.
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Old 12-16-2018, 03:56 PM   #10
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdryer View Post
sc2 saturn, are you wiring the 120 watt lights to turn on with high beams? What isn't well known is GMs use of daytime running lights with high beams. This presents a possible wiring issue if adapting signals from factory wiring to control aftermarket lighting. If you choose to wire your aftermarket lighting separately, this may be wiser. Interfering with factory wiring may create problems and prevent daytime running lights from operating and generate an error code. Familiarity with factory wiring with DRLs is a key to determining which way to proceed. Below is your low and high beam wiring as used with DRLs. An explanation of DRLs may confuse many unfamiliar with daytime running light wiring configurations.

A brief explanation of GMs daytime running lights;

Exterior Lighting Systems Description and Operation

Headlamps/Daytime Running Lamps (DRL)

Daytime Running Lamps

Daytime running lamps are standard on all Saturn models. The DRL relay is located in the underhood fuse block (UHFB). The coil side of the DRL relay receives battery voltage. Current flows through the DRL relay coil to the body control module through circuit 592. The BCM will ground circuit 592 when DRL is required. The BCM uses ignition, park lamp, headlamp, high beam and park brake inputs to control DRL. The DRL will be enabled anytime the ignition is in the RUN position, the headlamp switch is Off, the park brake switch is Off (park brake not engaged and the gear selector is in any position but Park).

Battery voltage is supplied through the left headlamp fuse to circuit 40 to the left high beam lamp. Voltage flows through the left high beam lamp to the UHFB through circuit 1200. Current flows to the right high beam lamp from the UHFB through circuit 1200. Current flows through the right high beam lamp to the DRL relay located in the UHFB through circuit 593. The BCM provides ground to circuit 592 to energize the relay. Current flows through the closed contacts of the DRL relay to ground through circuit 150 to the forward lamp splice pack. This circuit results in both high beam lamps being connected in series, which allows the high beam lights to operate at half brightness.

The BCM will turn Off the DRL relay when it sees any of the following inputs:

*Headlamps On
*Parking brake On
*Ignition not in the RUN position
*Gear selector in Park

The BCM uses the high beam input to determine if the DRL functions are working. If the DRL functions are not operating properly a diagnostic trouble code may be set. Refer to Diagnosis in this section for further information.

Headlamps

Battery power is applied to the low and high beam elements of the left headlamp assembly by the 10A left headlamp fuse through circuit 40. Battery power is applied to the low beam element of the right headlamp assembly by the 10A right headlamp fuse through circuit 140. Battery power is applied to the right high beam element by the right headlamp fuse normally closed (DRL relay NOT energized) contacts of the DRL relay and circuit 593.

When the headlamp switch is turned to On, and the high beam switch is Off, a ground path is provided to circuit 1201 through the headlamp switch to circuit 350. Circuit 350 is grounded at I/P splice pack #2. When the high beam switch is in the ON position, a ground path is provided to circuit 1200 through the headlamp switch to circuit 350. Circuit 350 is connected to the instrument panel fuse block (IPFB) and is grounded I/P splice pack #2. This same operation is also true when the flash-to-pass feature is used. To operate the flash-to-pass feature, the headlamp switch lever is pulled toward the driver.


If you understand how complicated daytime running light wiring from regular low/high beam wiring, you can decide which way to wire up your aftermarket lights - finding where to tap into existing wiring or making a separate wiring system.
dont have DRL cause of my hid the stupid factory 6 volt DRL it supplys to lights wont active my HID or wont active LED only factory bulbs


Quote:
Go back & look at your relay diagram and see how it differ's from how you now say you wired it

Headlights (all the lights too) are ground switched, they have power when the key is in "run" and the headlight switch provides the ground. It's backward from how people normally think of things wired.

pin 85 should goto one high-beam wire, pin 86 to the other (same connector). or you can run either pin to battery power and the other to the pink wire.
its same relay that i showed and i checked everything out and its 100% what the diagram i made is which was based off your info of the pin setup

would i use the lightbar/square lights grounds and connect them too pin 86 since its a switched ground pin?

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Old 12-17-2018, 02:31 AM   #11
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

my main issue is as soon as i turn on lights (headlights) it actives relay and turns on led square/ lightbar and only goes off when headlights are turned off im honesty lost on how it get power when headlights are on could it possibly be getting power from my quad beam relay?

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Old 12-17-2018, 10:15 AM   #12
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

The light bar should only be on when the high beam is on and the high beam ground wire (pink) is grounded. Either the relay is faulty or the BCM isn't disconnecting the ground wire enough to deactivate the relay. Are they connected temporary enough to stick a LED across the wires (+ on the led to the orange wire, - to the pink)?

If the current relay is a normal GM style relay you can swap it a similar relay from the UHJB. Horn or Fuel pump are easiest to verify with, but pick one with the same number of contacts.

The quad-beam setup shouldn't bother this, but if for some reason it's using the high-beam ground then it could be back-feeding the ground.

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Old 12-17-2018, 01:30 PM   #13
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

Quote:
Originally Posted by sc2 saturn View Post
dont have DRL cause of my hid the stupid factory 6 volt DRL it supplys to lights wont active my HID or wont active LED only factory bulbs.....
I think you may be misunderstanding how daytime ruining lights work and it's compounding attempts to wire in a light bar with existing wiring or modifying it.

First, the S-series uses series wiring to high beams, only in DRL mode, as shown in the wiring diagram. This does not mean 6 volts to each high beam (in drl mode). A series circuit means each high beam is wired back to back (series) with current reduced. Each high beam, in drl mode, gets half the current (not half the voltage) so they run not as bright. In daytime, no one notices any dimming of high beam lights, just the lights as the desired effect to get attention. Led or hid lights cannot work in a series circuit as you found out. Each led or hid requires full voltage to turn on. While they fail to turn on or flash erratically, they work when manually turning on high beams because manually turning on high beams switches series wiring to parallel wiring. All low and high beams are wired in parallel. That is, low beams are always wired in parallel so both lamps receive full 12v and current. When a lamp blows, the other one still lights up. In a series circuit (drl mode), if one lamp fails, the other turns off. If you modified high beam wiring for led or hid lights, this may be your problem.

You must have a clear wiring diagram in order to understand custom wiring for lighting setups. Without a working wiring diagram of your setup, it's anyone's guess how your lights work. Are you using modified wiring for led or hid for high beams?

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Old 12-17-2018, 10:17 PM   #14
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Default Re: sc2 aftermarket lights mod help

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdryer View Post
I think you may be misunderstanding how daytime ruining lights work and it's compounding attempts to wire in a light bar with existing wiring or modifying it.

First, the S-series uses series wiring to high beams, only in DRL mode, as shown in the wiring diagram. This does not mean 6 volts to each high beam (in drl mode). A series circuit means each high beam is wired back to back (series) with current reduced. Each high beam, in drl mode, gets half the current (not half the voltage) so they run not as bright. In daytime, no one notices any dimming of high beam lights, just the lights as the desired effect to get attention. Led or hid lights cannot work in a series circuit as you found out. Each led or hid requires full voltage to turn on. While they fail to turn on or flash erratically, they work when manually turning on high beams because manually turning on high beams switches series wiring to parallel wiring. All low and high beams are wired in parallel. That is, low beams are always wired in parallel so both lamps receive full 12v and current. When a lamp blows, the other one still lights up. In a series circuit (drl mode), if one lamp fails, the other turns off. If you modified high beam wiring for led or hid lights, this may be your problem.

You must have a clear wiring diagram in order to understand custom wiring for lighting setups. Without a working wiring diagram of your setup, it's anyone's guess how your lights work. Are you using modified wiring for led or hid for high beams?
quad beam setup and its factory wiring going into HID its all plug and play like most of them or all the HID i seen

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