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Old 10-16-2017, 03:13 PM   #1
dude33333
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Default Tire rubbing strut when braking

I swapped the 15" alloys from my sl2 to my sc1 before I sold the sl2 for cheap.

Now the tire is rubbing on the front driver's side strut only while braking.

I've tried pumping the tire all the way up, and adjusted the camber as much as I could, seemed to make a difference for a few miles then it starts happening again.

What the heck is going on? Frustrated because of course I'm trying to "upgrade" the sc1 and end up causing problems!
Thanks

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Old 10-16-2017, 03:15 PM   #2
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

What tire size are you running? I have 15" steel wheels on my SC1 with 195/60R-15 tires and never had a rubbing issue.

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Old 10-16-2017, 04:56 PM   #3
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

185 65 15 on alloys. Never any problems when they were on the sl2

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Old 10-16-2017, 11:18 PM   #4
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

If camber is correct then it's time to put a straightedge on the strut and knuckle. If what's bent isn't obvious then compare everything to the other side.

I've seen different size/length control arms...if the "bad" side has been replaced it's possible it got a short part and somehow the issue didn't show up with the 175/70R14 tires.

Stock S-Series parts don't cause problems on Stock S-Series unless the stock S-Series is broken...lol

My 1st S-Series, a '97 SC1 came with 185/65R15's on alloy wheels from the factory.

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Old 10-18-2017, 03:53 PM   #5
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

Thank you for the reply, I guess I'll have to take it apart and inspect a little more carefully. Maybe I can slot the knuckle a little more?

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Old 10-18-2017, 06:24 PM   #6
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

A well lit clear picture of the back side with the tire on would really help in this situation so we can help you further. There are camber/caster bolts you can buy, but I wouldn't try to slot the steering knuckle hole further if that's what you're talking about.

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Old 10-18-2017, 09:17 PM   #7
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

I am always perplexed when I hear of schemes to make the connection between the knuckle and strut "adjustable", whether by slotting the struts or some special screws with eccentrics. Moving the bottom of the strut relative to the knuckle also changes the king-pin angle (KPA), and that is usually considered to be "fixed". Is it ever even checked, are there any alignment specs for the KPA? Do commercial alignment machines provide for checking it? The proper way to adjust camber is to move the top of the strut.

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Old 10-18-2017, 10:46 PM   #8
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

KPA? Isn't that an oldschool term for caster? That's adjustable too, just slot the strut mount holes in the direction required. Going by this page, which has the only useful sound comparison I can find: http://www.roversd1.nl/sd1web/suspension.html

Despite what the idiot programmers on Gran Turismo say ANY vehicle has adjustable camber and toe from the factory, no fancy suspension kit required. If you look at the factory installed struts and most all aftermarket struts that aren't already slotted the dual layer of metal around the knuckle isn't 2-layer for both bolt holes, it's only 1-layer so it can be ground out easier if required.

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Old 10-19-2017, 10:51 AM   #9
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

I gotta ask... did you read the Rover article you linked-to? It clearly explains what the "King-pin Inclination" (an "angle") is. It is not the same as caster or camber, but works together with caster to return steering to center.

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Old 10-20-2017, 11:31 AM   #10
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

I used to work as a tech and used a fancy alignment rack to follow the directions and give alignments. Never saw anything about KPA

I was looking at the top mounts for the struts, thinking of loosening, adjusting and tightening. It's the 3 bolts on top? Or the one big one in the middle?

But after looking around online, it seemed like the knuckle was the definitive place to adjust. I haven't closely inspected the knuckle to strut bolt area and the double metal wall, maybe I can grind out one of the double metal pieces?

I will do my best to take a well lit picture of behind the wheel.

I guess I really should get a full alignment check too, but it tracks straight on the freeway.

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Old 10-20-2017, 12:40 PM   #11
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

Quote:
Originally Posted by billr View Post
I gotta ask... did you read the Rover article you linked-to? It clearly explains what the "King-pin Inclination" (an "angle") is. It is not the same as caster or camber, but works together with caster to return steering to center.
Mostly just skimmed the article, but even with a proper reading I don't see what your issue is with adjusting camber back to stock...if you move camber the KPA also changes but it's all within the same range. Sure, worry about it if you're racing and going to extreme "not to spec" camber angles but...stock is stock.

I've had 3 S-Series with lowering springs, and camber bolts and the steering effort/return to center only changed from before the lowering springs when I put a manual steering rack in place of a power rack at the same time.

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Old 10-22-2017, 06:23 PM   #12
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

Ok I realized that I forgot an important detail. The rubbing pulses, not an even rubbing.

Well I've adjusted it all the way and seems to no longer be rubbing, however there is definitely a pulsing/vibrating from that wheel.

Thinking about it, I think it's almost always have it slightly, be either the different wheels/tires made it more noticeable or it got worse?

What is going on? I may do the Firestone lifetime alignment.

There's a very very slight steering pull away from the bad side. There's some definite vibration coming through the steering wheel and it becomes much more pronounced if you slightly pull left or right on the steering wheel at freeway speeds especially.

There's something going on over there but I don't know what...

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Old 10-22-2017, 08:55 PM   #13
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

If you have a tire rubbing strut problem, you should see shiny paint where the tire sidewall rubs and polishes the strut or shiny steel where paint was rubbed off. Do you see a spot on the strut or not? If not and there is no evidence of tire rubbing marks anywhere in the wheel well, you may be describing brake issues. Removing the wheel and inspecting calipers thoroughly for uneven wear of pads or lack of periodic brake maintenance may result in sticking caliper slide pins and other problems.

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Old 10-22-2017, 08:56 PM   #14
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

Please help, I'm at a loss. Wheel bearing? Steering related? I've never had a problem like this

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Old 10-22-2017, 09:01 PM   #15
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

Thank you, yes after I swapped the wheels it started doing it right away and I could see where it was rubbing.
It hadn't happened very much by that point so it was just very clean and shiny compared to the rest of it being dirty


I've since adjusted the camber and it's not rubbing, but it's still kind of pulsating/ vibrating through the steering wheel, especially at speed.

Maybe your right about the brake issue... I replaced the rotors and pads about a year ago because it had some vibration when braking.

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Old 10-23-2017, 10:07 AM   #16
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

Where is this problem? Tire sidewall rubbing strut or brake? It can't be both unless you win the lottery for two problems occurring at the same time.

Are the aluminum rims stock or aftermarket?

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Old 10-23-2017, 10:19 PM   #17
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

I know! Forgive me, I'm usually not this confused...

The wheels are original, straight off the sl2 I sold.

The tire is no longer rubbing since adjusting the camber all the way out.

But now this other issue is showing up more, and it's all after swapping these wheels. Unfortunately I sold the sl2 with the 14" so there's no going back.

I'm going crazy, I do all my own work but I'm just stumped here. We're not using the car for now because of this

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Old 10-23-2017, 11:12 PM   #18
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

Can you measure the tires actual width? Sometimes one brands 185 is closer to 215...lol
Kinda handy for racing with tire width rules/limitations but rather annoying if you don't know about it.

Brake rotor thickness runout could be an issue and/or buildup around/on the hub...pushes 1 part of the wheel out just a bit and throws the balance of the entire assembly off.

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Old 10-24-2017, 12:35 AM   #19
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

Woah woah explain this build up thing....... This is news to me but is sounding like my problem!!??

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Old 10-24-2017, 12:39 AM   #20
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Default Re: Tire rubbing strut when braking

Man I've put like 500k miles on Saturns and never had a problem quite like this. Thinking about it, I think we put 50k on this sc1 with the problem, but it never bothered me enough to do anything but change the rotors and forget about it. The bigger wheels/tire just made it much much much much more pronounced I think plus it was rubbing at first making it even more obvious

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