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Old 03-20-2017, 06:34 AM   #1
spellman1989
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Question motor mount bracket broken

Ok I am new to the forums as well as the Saturn world so please bear with me. I was in the process of changing my motor mounts yesterday and I started with the dogbone mount under the battery tray as it was the easiest in my opinion. Well I noticed when I got to it that the part where the top screw bolts into was broken. I have attached a picture of where it was broken at. It's behind the actual mount. Does anyone know what that part is called or if it is something I can pull from another S-Series?

Thank you for your help everyone!
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Old 03-20-2017, 06:55 AM   #2
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Welcome.
Broken? Or has someone taken a grinder to the right edge?
That mount, It surely is held securely and not loose, correct?

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Old 03-20-2017, 06:58 AM   #3
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

It's bolted to the transmission. Take the mount off and then you can see the 2 bolts that hold it on. Automatic brackets are different than manual brackets even though the mount is the same.
I don't remember the exact size of the hex bolt but 13mm is a safe bet, and it'll take some leverage to break free.

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Old 03-20-2017, 01:00 PM   #4
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Whoa, that looks weird. It's as if someone welded a piece of metal on the right side of it (side closest to driver's side). It doesn't look right to me.

As far as replacement, it is a salvage yard only part....not something you'll find at an auto parts store. As fetchtfido stated, it is held on by two bolts. You will probably need a breaker bar to break them loose, and maybe a short extension as well.

Below is a picture I had taken when I was replacing my trans cooler lines. I circled the two bolts that hold on the bracket.
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Old 03-20-2017, 03:31 PM   #5
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Quote:
Originally Posted by fetchitfido View Post
It's bolted to the transmission. Take the mount off and then you can see the 2 bolts that hold it on. Automatic brackets are different than manual brackets even though the mount is the same.
I don't remember the exact size of the hex bolt but 13mm is a safe bet, and it'll take some leverage to break free.
That's the problem because that thing is broken it doesn't stay in place while trying to remove the mount. The two bolts are in firm but the part where the top bolt for the mount is broken off like not connected to the rest of it. Is it just a part I can remove the bolts and take it off and replace or is it wrapped around something? Just trying to gauge what tools I'll need to remove it at the salvage yard.

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Old 03-20-2017, 05:35 PM   #6
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Quote:
Originally Posted by bachands View Post
Whoa, that looks weird. It's as if someone welded a piece of metal on the right side of it (side closest to driver's side). It doesn't look right to me.

As far as replacement, it is a salvage yard only part....not something you'll find at an auto parts store. As fetchtfido stated, it is held on by two bolts. You will probably need a breaker bar to break them loose, and maybe a short extension as well.

Below is a picture I had taken when I was replacing my trans cooler lines. I circled the two bolts that hold on the bracket.
Thank you for the pic I will use it as reference when I go to salvage yard. Is the part just the two bolts and pull it off or is there more to it?

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Old 03-20-2017, 05:52 PM   #7
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Does this help....



In this photo they are changing the lower transmount but it shows the upper too...


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File Type: gif _mount.gif (13.5 KB, 91 views)
File Type: gif _mount2.gif (16.9 KB, 93 views)

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Old 03-20-2017, 10:13 PM   #8
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Quote:
Originally Posted by spellman1989 View Post
Thank you for the pic I will use it as reference when I go to salvage yard. Is the part just the two bolts and pull it off or is there more to it?
Yes, I believe the bracket comes off when you remove those two bolts. That should be all there is to it.

But it sounds like you're having trouble removing the mount from the bracket. If that's the case, remove the bolt that holds the mount to the frame-rail, Then you should be able to take off the mount with the top of that bracket still attached. Is that right?

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Old 03-22-2017, 03:14 PM   #9
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

So I have taken pics of the new one I got from the salvage yard. I thought the bracket itself was broken but it's not the bracket in the pics I have attached it looks like at some point someone welded something on to hold the bracket in place due to the part where it bolts onto breaking off with the bracket. My question is would I be able to put something in between their and torque it down to hold in place like the screw hole? I know I would have to repair the threads and possibly remove a broken screw from what is left of the screw hole. Would a lot of washers work the same if they are torqued down with a longer screw or am I just screwed here? The part that broke looks like it was a screw hole on the transmission possibly. Any help is greatly appreciated!
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File Type: jpg IMG_20170322_155516.jpg (159.1 KB, 29 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20170322_155531.jpg (89.0 KB, 25 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20170322_155525.jpg (70.5 KB, 25 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20170322_141639.jpg (205.0 KB, 20 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20170322_141644.jpg (144.8 KB, 16 views)

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Old 03-22-2017, 03:32 PM   #10
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Are you saying the block/trans casting is broken, where the bracket would normally attach?

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Old 03-22-2017, 03:40 PM   #11
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Quote:
Originally Posted by billr View Post
Are you saying the block/trans casting is broken, where the bracket would normally attach?
Precisely. Isn't this also the upper trans mount or is that located somewhere else on this car? I believe its the casting on the trans...

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Old 03-22-2017, 09:23 PM   #12
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Wow! What a hack job on that bracket! It appears that the top bolt that attaches it to the trans casing is sheared off. That would mean that the rest of the bolt (just the threads) is stuck inside the trans case. Is this correct?

If this is correct, then you need to find a way to extract those threads from the trans. Installing the "new" bracket you got from the salvage yard with only the bottom bolts may not be sufficient enough to hold the mount solid in place.

Do you have enough room to fit a drill in that space? I don't think there's any other way to extract the threads from the hole. Worse case scenario, you only have the bracket supported with the one bolt.

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Old 03-22-2017, 10:42 PM   #13
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Post a picture of the damaged area of the trans, with the bracket removed. Maybe we can suggest a more elegant way to repair it; hopefully one that allows use of a stock bracket.

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Old 03-23-2017, 08:22 AM   #14
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Wait, I think I see it clearly now....

Instead of the threads from the top bolt shearing off from the bolt head, the threads remain in tact and the "boss" (protruded area) from the trans literally broke off.

This is definitely a first for me....never seen that before.

I think the first step would be to remove the bolt from the broken "boss" that it is threaded into. Maybe use a vice or a really good set of locking pliers to hold the boss in place while you loosen the bolt. Put a rag over the boss to protect it a bit....it is only aluminum and will probably deform easily.

If you can manage to do that, then you can see of the boss fits into the "cavity" it made on the trans. If it is a decent fit, then I would try using JB Weld to re-attach it. Honestly, I think that may work better than a standard weld. I'm no expert, but I think aluminum is a difficult metal to weld to. JB Weld properly applied in a nice thin layer would probably work well. Just give it adequate time to dry and then you can go ahead and use your "new" bracket as normal.

Is that possible for you?

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Old 03-23-2017, 09:12 AM   #15
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Might be onto something with the idea of JB Weld, though I wouldn't trust standard JB Weld for his job (I wouldn't trust standard JB Weld for anything weight bearing). Get a real structural epoxy, it'll probably cost about as much as a new-to-you transmission (minus install costs) but should be easier to do.

Welding clean aluminum (the contents inside the metal not just the surface) isn't that hard with the right setup, welding dirty aluminum like the block and transmission case can be quite tricky/impossible due to the contamination inside.

Not sure which idea I'd trust more...though to be honest I see any (even perceived, not quite real) issue with a currently installed S-Series automatic as the perfect excuse to swap to a 5spd...especially for something like this when the best fix requires changing the transmission anyway...

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Old 03-27-2017, 10:48 PM   #16
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

That boss has already been welded on once and the weld failed from lack of penetration. It looks like someone made a bracket that bolted to the end cover on the transmission and welded it to the mount bracket. A photo of the mount area without the mount in place would be a big help in finding a solution.

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Old 04-06-2017, 04:08 PM   #17
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Question Re: motor mount bracket broken

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike R View Post
That boss has already been welded on once and the weld failed from lack of penetration. It looks like someone made a bracket that bolted to the end cover on the transmission and welded it to the mount bracket. A photo of the mount area without the mount in place would be a big help in finding a solution.
Wow I am just seeing this post. I finally got a pic without the mount and battery cover in the way. I have posted them. I was thinking is this something I could drill further and tap the threads and put in a longer bolt? Or what could I do without having to replace the entire transmission?
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Old 04-06-2017, 04:32 PM   #18
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Drill and tap as deep as you dare (use a bottoming tap), then install a stud using Loctite 620 or similar.

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Old 04-06-2017, 04:35 PM   #19
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

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Originally Posted by billr View Post
Drill and tap as deep as you dare (use a bottoming tap), then install a stud using Loctite 620 or similar.
Would I have to worry about vibration or the transmission rocking snapping the bolt or does it not move very much?

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Old 04-06-2017, 04:55 PM   #20
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Default Re: motor mount bracket broken

Put a heli-coil in.

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