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Old 12-28-2016, 09:08 PM   #1
Justross1979
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Wrench New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Hey saturn fans. I'm a New to site ok here it is car just didn't start no codes no blown fuses new fuel pump kicks on and pumps than I connect it to filter/pressure regulator.connections good nothing comes out going to fuel rail any thought .ps the wiring is good. Oh before new pump car would run than thus why I put new pump. THINKING THAT THAT WAS THE REASON FOR NO PRESSURE AT RAIL it sounded like it sounded like it was starving for fuel

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Old 12-29-2016, 01:14 AM   #2
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

There might be air in the lines so pressurizing and purging the lines may require several starts or several ignition ON/OFF cycles. Turning on ignition (no starting) cycles the fuel pump for two seconds then pump shuts off. You can pressurize the fuel lines by cycling ignition off, wait 30 seconds, cycle ignition on for five seconds, repeat several times. The delay between ignition on cycles is to prevent back to back cycles when the pcm detects it and prevents pump operation. An alternate method, possibly hazardous, would be using a small wire jumper across the fuel pump relay socket terminals 30 and 87; regardless of ignition switch position, this sends 12v immediately to power the fuel pump. You should hear a faint hum/hissing sound by the engine (or pressing an ear to the rear quarter panel) as the pump runs continuously. A rag covering the fuel test valve while depressing the valve stem should allow purging air from lines and spray fuel - this is dangerous with a wire jumper across the pump relay socket terminals unless a cover is used. Less than a few seconds is enough to pressurize empty fuel lines. Use care if you depress the fuel test valve in case the valve doesn't reseal when releasing it. A safer way to purge the fuel lines would be connecting a fuel pressure gauge with a shut off valve connected to a hose placed into a container. Fumes are just as dangerous as raw fuel if spark is nearby (wire jumper working loose).

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Old 12-29-2016, 12:47 PM   #3
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Ok tried that no go .just wondering the fuel pumps to the fat side where the pressure reg. Is and nothing out of 2nd smaller line that enters the filter/pressure reg. I have until hooked the line that runs to the rail from the filter turn the key on hear the pump prime checked no fuel coming out in unhooked the smaller connector no pressure unhooked fat side fuel sprayed with lots of pressure could it be a faulty pressure reg. But the pictures I've seen that there's no mechanical parts the could go bad stumpes

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Old 12-29-2016, 08:43 PM   #4
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Mileage on this car? The combination fuel filter/pressure regulator should be replaced every 100k miles with an OEM part. If its clogged, replace it.

Please check spelling. Its difficult to understand misspelled words, grammatical errors, word substitution from tablets and phones.
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File Type: jpg '99 SL fuel system.jpg (205.3 KB, 9 views)

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Old 12-29-2016, 11:22 PM   #5
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Thanks for the help sorry for the spelling just being lazy.The car has 94000 miles on it I change oil regularly and keep up on all fluids. I was reading some things on the crank position sensor thought I would try to bench test it while watching a Video the guy said to look at the r.p.m while cranking an that I should see about 500 r.p.m I saw no r.p.m change any thoughts I really apreciate the help.

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Old 12-30-2016, 04:21 AM   #6
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Tried what? There are several suggestions given and no specific replies to any.

1-Did a wire jumper in terminals 30 and 87 turn on fuel pump or not?
2-If you leave the inlet hose to fuel filter off and inserted into a container, does fuel shoot out when turning on ignition or using a jumper across the fuel pump relay socket terminals?

If you hear the pump running for two seconds at ignition on time, unless you see fuel at the fuel rail test valve, there's no point in going any further - without fuel being pressurized and spraying out the test valve, starting is useless. Injectors are useless if fuel isn't anywhere in the fuel lines. The fuel pump turns on in two places, at ignition on time and when starting/engine running.

The two second pump run its directly from the pcm commanding pump operation when ignition is turned on. A program runs the pump for two seconds then shuts off if the engine isn't started. When starting, the engine turns over with the crank sensor generating timing signals as it detects crankshaft rotation. The timing signals allows the pcm to; turn on fuel pump, initiate ignition for spark and pulse injectors. The tach should display rpm during starting.

If you have more than one problem, determining why fuel isn't coming out the fuel rail test valve is first in priority. A dead crank sensor does not prevent initial fuel pump operation at ignition on time or prevent pump operation if a wire jumper is inserted between pump relay socket terminals 30 and 87.

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Old 12-30-2016, 05:50 PM   #7
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Ok I jumped the 87/30 pins at relay. Pump ran still no pressure.It's a new filter. So I guess the pump isn't producing enough pressure to go through the filter I'll have to get a pressure gauge to test pump before filter. am I correct?thanks for your replys I actually understand the way you explained it.

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Old 12-30-2016, 06:28 PM   #8
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Disconnect the fuel filter from the output hose from the fuel tank and have someone monitor this hose if fuel shoots out into a gas container. You wire the jumper in place, coordinating your actions with the other person so you're both aware of what's about to occur (pump running at full output from the tank). This is much safer than working alone if anything goes wrong. Raw fuel evaporates easily and the fumes are more flammable than liquid gasoline when a spark occurs nearby. If fuel pumps out easily into a container, replace the fuel filter.

Operating pressure for fuel pumps can be as low as 35 psi and as high as 90 psi. Pressure regulators ensure operating pressures are maintained within a range for correct operation for EFI systems (40-55 psi?).

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Old 12-30-2016, 07:48 PM   #9
Justross1979
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Ok did that nothing came out of the filter.Im going to go exchange it and see if that was it. Quick question is fuel supposed to come out of the (going into filter)fat side line or the small side or both

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Old 12-30-2016, 09:03 PM   #10
Justross1979
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Ok did that nothing came out of the filter.Im going to go exchange it and see if that was it. Quick question is fuel supposed to come out of the (going into filter)fat side line or the small side or both

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Old 12-31-2016, 10:18 AM   #11
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justross1979 View Post
Ok did that nothing came out of the filter.Im going to go exchange it and see if that was it.
While I know that you're communicating with a very fine member regarding your fuel related issue, I thought I'd jump in with my thoughts anyway. Firstly, I believe that you should've merely disconnected the line at the back of the fuel filter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justross1979 View Post
Quick question is fuel supposed to come out of the (going into filter)fat side line or the small side or both
Although I don't know the answer to that question, it's most likely that fuel should move through the nipple in the center of the filter. Nevertheless, there should've been fuel exiting from the filter when the key was turned to the start position.

Secondly, you've previously stated that the fuel filter is new. If the fuel pump was working at all then gasoline would've been seen pouring out of the filter when you attempted to start the vehicle, but you found that nothing came out at all. That does not result from the use of a new fuel filter and there's no need, IMO, to get another one. New filter media will be absent of any particles which would cause it to be clogged. During my seventeen years in automotive repair and parts businesses I'd never seen a new fuel filter returned due to its being clogged. For that matter, I never saw a customer return a new filter as a defective part.

Simply put, having discovered that no fuel exited the filter I believe you've verified your where the source of your problem lies - it's the fuel pump.



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Old 12-31-2016, 01:56 PM   #12
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Thanks any help or suggestions are much appreciated I would have assumed that my self if I didnt see with my own eyes but ive disconneced it from the fuel filter and its got alot of pressure on the fat side but the skinny side nothing Ive also diconnected th skinny side and turned the pump on and nothing comes out so know the pump pisses like a race horse when not connected to fuel filter the only say its the filter cause of the regulator inside.

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Old 12-31-2016, 02:07 PM   #13
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

I'm happy for you that I was wrong regarding the fuel pump! I was unfamiliar with the fuel filter having a regulator built in to it.

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Old 06-11-2017, 11:51 AM   #14
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Yes, I know this discussion is old, but I'm having the same problem and not much luck finding information.

I have a new pump and filter/pressure regulator. When the new parts were installed no fuel would get to the test port on the rail. I cycled the key many times with no pressure building at the port. Took the hose off the end of the filter that goes forward to the rail: no fuel was in the line. Took off the hose from the small tube in the center on the back side of the filter: no fuel. The large supply tube had pressurized fuel. I rigged a way to test the pressure on the large tube supply line (direct supply from the pump): pressurized fuel spiked my fuel pressure gauge to 90 plus. Removed the filter/pressure regulator and hooked the large tube to a pressure gauge and an air compressor. No matter how much pressure I applied to the large tube, nothing would come out of the other tubes. Bought a different filter/regulator with the same results.

The plastic hoses on the new pump were not bent in the same pattern as the old one. Does that mean the pump is not the right part for this car? It was close enough to fit, so I installed it. Should the supply hose on the new pump connect to the smaller middle tube on the filter?

It would be helpful to find some diagram of the filter that shows which tube is supply, and which is return.

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Old 06-11-2017, 12:11 PM   #15
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Default Re: New fuel pump/filter no pressure out filter?????

Reviving an old thread isn't old if it helps since info remains the same. Are you familiar with richpin videos? Here's one for fuel filter replacement and may help; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFQB7fcT5oU.

Did you read this thread entirely to wire a jumper to turn on the fuel pump without using the ignition switch?

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