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Old 04-08-2001, 06:44 PM   #1
SATURNRAY
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Default Can LS lessons help VUE launch?

The recent problems with the GM trio of recalled SUVs begs the question: What did Saturn learn from the LS launch a couple years ago? What will they do different this time?

I was at my Saturn dealer on Saturday and one of the service folks said the large Saturns still have flaws. She was encouraged that the VUE would be built at Spring Hill, not Wilmington.

How will this launch be different than before?

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Old 04-08-2001, 08:16 PM   #2
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First, Saturn is launching the VUE in a very different manner than the L Series. They have certainly learned something from a marketing persepective if not from one of manufacturing.
As for the L having technical problems, it certainly has, but I fail to see how these problems are the result of being manufactured at Wilmington as opposed to Spring Hill. Wilmington didn't do the R&D, testing or make the decision to make large alterations in the original Opel platform to "make it a Saturn". According to people who work at Wilmington, many of the Saturn differences in manufacturing have been adopted at Wilmington.
I'd really like to know what your service person knows about Wilmington to make her speak that way.... or has she just made the age old mistake of confusing a correlation with a cause?

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Old 04-09-2001, 06:39 AM   #3
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i hope so too! launching the vue without proper r+d would be suicide, i do like what someone wrote the other day though, the vues launch might be good timing with the economy slowing down, better mileage, cheaper price than the stupid navigators etc.
of course saturn in no way knew the economy was gonna stumble so it was sheer luck but it makes sense, if i was in the market for a new suv and the economy stumbled i damn sure would be more worried about my positive financial worth thatn having a stupid show off navigator in the driveway!

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Old 04-09-2001, 08:47 AM   #4
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IT seems to me that the L was sold almost as soon as the thing would turn on. OF course this was not the case, but the thing was rushed. The VUE is already running and has for some time. This time they are testing the vehicle for well over a year to get all the bugs out. I feel that when the VUE finally comes out, it will be very bug free for a new release.

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Old 04-09-2001, 10:34 AM   #5
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My dad mentioned to me that he's still considering leasing an L200 when he turns in his SL1 this August. I guess they've got some pretty good lease deals, and hey, at least the car is under warranty for the lease period. I'd be interested to see how it compares to the S Series models.

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Old 04-09-2001, 06:16 PM   #6
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Beware the 39 month lease - you're not covered by warranty in months 37-39. Insist on 36 month term.

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Old 04-09-2001, 06:55 PM   #7
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Beware ANY lease! Most have nasty little surprises no one even thinks about until (sh)it happens to THEM...example? Your car got stolen? Totaled in a collision? Pay an exhorbitant "Early Termination Fee" on your lease! I don't know if Saturn has "cleaned up" any of those little issues in the language of their leases, but I'd ask for a complete copy of the lease agreement to go over with a fine tooth comb in advance!

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Old 04-10-2001, 08:39 AM   #8
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<blockquote><hr><font size="1">Original Post:</font><!--1-->
Beware ANY lease! Most have nasty little surprises no one even thinks about until (sh)it happens to THEM...example? Your car got stolen? Totaled in a collision? Pay an exhorbitant "Early Termination Fee" on your lease! <hr></blockquote>

All of Saturn's leases do not have any hidden fees. Just like everything else they do, everything is right out on the table. There is an acquisition fee at the front end which includes gap insurance. The gap insurance will protect you if the car is stolen or totalled. You'd only be responsible for your insurance deductibles. The lease would be satisfied by the gap insurance. There is an early termination fee only if you do just that, terminate the lease before its end and turn the car back in. In many cases it's just like paying all of the rest of your payments, so you might as well keep the car. If you really want to get out early, you're better off selling the car to someone else. The only other fee included is a purchase option fee at the end which is added on to the residual value if you decide to buy the car. However, the leasing bank will often waive that and then some just to sell you the car. They don't want it back. They are in the business of financing, not selling cars.

That's it! No other fees in Saturn's leases.

-Dhagg

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Old 04-10-2001, 08:45 AM   #9
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awww poo-poo, maybe you wouldnt term it hidden fees but what bob mentions, the 39 month lease where your off warranty, thats the biggest scam there is, saturn gets to charge you for work when your unprotected and off warranty, weve seen it happen before right on this newsgroup and it wasnt pretty from what i remeber, i would be soooo pissed if i was leasing a car, it came off warranty then in the last 3 months of owning it it snaps a t-chain and im stuck holding the bag, i think the 39 month lease without warranty shoudl be outlawed, nailing unsespecting and trusting people like that.shame on you saturn!
(ps, before i get all bashed for saturn bashing i would say the same about any manufacturer leaving your ass out in the wind like that)

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Old 04-10-2001, 09:53 AM   #10
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Yeah, I assume that my father is familiar with all of the terms of the lease. I don't really know. I do know about the warranty issue. My dad is currently about to enter the final 3 months of a 39 month lease on his SL1, so I guess he'll just have to hope nothing goes wrong with the car!

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Old 04-10-2001, 10:41 AM   #11
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Having recently signed a Saturn lease:
1) GAP insurance coverage was not included in any fees, but was brought to our attention up front.
2) Saturn needs to advertise the 36mo lease in a subtitle under the 39mo. It was less than $15 more a month, but at least customers are covered under the warranty for the whole lease period. We ended up having asking about it. Come on, Saturn, time to prove you're a Diff Kind of Company.

3) Back to the VUE launch. I think it's going ok. Not great, but ok. Would have been nice if people could sit in the auto show ones. But I understand the rationale why we couldn't. Also, Saturn should pursue the car mags with the VUE. Let them take it out for a quick spin (ala Homecoming '99's pathethic test track). LOL. It's better than nothing. Heck, let me take it out for a spin. <img src="http://64.77.2.166/cgi-bin/UltraBoard/Images/Wilk.gif" border="0" align="middle">

- Wei

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Old 04-10-2001, 10:55 AM   #12
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In response to the original subject:LS Lessons helping with Vue launch? I was just talking with my sales consultant yesterday. He was saying that he has several Vue's already bagged and ready to roll out the door as soon as they hit the lot. He really seems to think that the Saturn Customer base is ready to buy an SUV. I disagreed with him. I pointed out the 20+ Azteks at the Pontiac dealer next door. (same company). When I told him that somebody over there probably got their hind quarters chewed out for ordering that many Azteks, he laughed and admitted that I knew more about the car business than the average customer.(Thanks to all of my fellow Saturn fans here). RE: Leasing: I mentioned to him that my car was just a little too small for me. I told him that I wanted something bigger. I told him that I wanted an L100, 5spd, Air, AM/FM Cass, Cruise and that's all!. He mentioned the great lease rates on the L200. I don't want an L200. Noth that I have anything against that car but the l-100 would more than suit my needs. When the numbers that he showed me were somewhere out in the parking lot of my ballpark, I asked him what else he had up his sleeve. He mentioned that there was a 96 SW2 with only 55K "that just came in, and wagons don't come in often and he has some other people that he needed to call but had not had time yet...". I accused him of sounding like a used car salesman. He pointed out that I would be getting a bigger engine(sounds funny when refering to a 4cyl), the upgraded tires, etc. Also the space that the wagon offers as opposed to a sedan. The price was good, but I would be afraid that I would not be getting what I would want. He assured me that the wagon would be easier to get in and out of because of the higher roof line. I am debating it.

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Old 04-10-2001, 11:55 AM   #13
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<blockquote><hr><font size="1">Original Post:</font><!--1-->
I told him that I wanted an L100, 5spd, Air, AM/FM Cass, Cruise and that's all.<hr></blockquote>
Because of the way they bundle LS's, you can't get there from here. You would have to get an L200 and get a bunch of other stuff you don't want/need, and pay an extra $2500. An L100 can be had inexpensively if you can live without factory cassette and factory cruise. I have a 5 speed LS and payed under $15,000 for it. It had AC standard and it has roll up windows, no cruise, and I added my own MP3 stereo. I would imagine you could have aftermarket cruise and stereo (keep the factory speakers, they are quite sufficient) installed at a competent shop for around $500. I know that alot of people will tell you the stereo and cruise won't be warranted by Saturn, nor can you wrap up the goodies with your car payment. Both are true, but you will have to weigh that on your own. Just ensure that if you have cruise installed, that the company does not butcher anything to install it. Saturn will not cover any warranty items that they determine were caused by aftermarket add ons. As far as the stereo goes.. I installed mine my self with no wires being cut. Just got the appropriate harness and spent about an hour putting it in. Would be easy to return back to stock radio at any time.

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Old 04-10-2001, 05:25 PM   #14
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IMHO, if you want cruise, you're better off going for the L200. My LS (L100) fits me perfectly and, as Spork pointed out, the price can't be beat.

Fewer gadgets to go wrong on the L100.

Too many people have been royally screwed by aftermarket electronic installs. Remember what the guy at saturnexposed did to his car. At least while on warranty, steer far clear of any aftermarket electricals unless you're prepared to bet the life of your Satty on the competence of the shop and the quality of their product.

If you have a shop like Joey's at your disposal anything is possible!

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Old 04-10-2001, 06:33 PM   #15
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The only way I can see the roofline being any advantage on an SW as opposed to an SL is if you're going from 1st generation to 2nd generation (you didn't mention what year you currently have). If you've already got a 2nd generation, the roofline at the driver's door is no different, since it's the exact same car until the C-pillar, essentially! As for the "bigger" engine, um...it's not "bigger" (same displacement), just more powerful ('course, that's a good thing!). I'll give a a hearty second to the comments about wagon versatility and cargo hauling ability, though! If it's BIGGER that you want, though, stick with the LS idea, though I'd go without cruise before I let some aftermarket hoople at my new car!

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