SaturnFans.com
what's new (beta) - classifieds - forums - photos


Go Back   SaturnFans.com Forums > Models > Saturn S-Series > S-Series Tech
Register FAQ Members List Groups Calendar Chat Room Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-12-2016, 03:25 PM   #21
fdryer
Super Member
fdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond repute
 
fdryer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 39,313
 

2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

If you're thinking coolant sensor for the third time, its probably fine and not worth replacing. You have a reader that tells you coolant temps as the pcm sees it. All you need to do is monitor it at start up and compare the coolant temperature with intake air temperature - they should be reading the same ambient temps (within 5 degrees of each other) before start up in comparison to outdoor temps. Any drastic/erratic change in coolant temps would be indicating either a corroded connection or faulty sensor. A reader is a valuable tool when used in the right hands.

The most outstanding failure of the original plastic sensor was when it broke and some members were able to use a reader; erratic temps of -40F or other incorrect temperature was displayed when it was obvious the engine wasn't in Arctic subzero weather or the engine was already warm.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to fdryer's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help fdryer reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
fdryer is offline   Reply With Quote
SaturnFans.com Sponsored Links
Old 01-12-2016, 03:31 PM   #22
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

Yeah I was thinking about replacing the thermostat, ignoring the ECTS for now. I am heading back to my car, will plug in the reader and see what temperature info it reads.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2016, 05:16 PM   #23
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

One last update. When I went to my car after all day at work I checked the temperature information:

Coolant temp: 45 degrees
IAT temp: 39 degrees
Air temperature: 38 degrees
RPMs (while sitting in idle): 1173

After driving home the data was:

Coolant temp: 178 degrees
IAT temp: 54 degrees
Air temperature: 38 degrees.
RPMs (while sitting at idle at my house): 731

Just some more information. Of course there were no instances of the idle being stuck up around 1700 today, but it occurred yesterday.

Thanks for all of the help, I really appreciate it.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 09:51 AM   #24
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

Hi guys,

I'd like to follow up on this thread with some updates. I know it's been a couple of weeks but it took some time for me to able to change the thermostat.

I replaced the thermostat as per the suggestions and the car definitely seems to be warming up better. The gauge reads close to the middle, not at the the first 1/4 mark like it had been and I can physically notice the cab heating up quicker as a result (which is nice in this cold weather.)

When I drove the car home from where it was worked on it behaved well and it seemed like the idling issues were fine; once it was fully heated up it was idling in the 700s.

This morning I took it to work, which is about 40 miles of highway driving that begins with smooth cruising and ends with stop and go I near the parking garage.

The car heated up properly and was fully heated up after about 10 minutes. I did notice the inconsistent idling issues again, though, as there were periods of it idling at 1700-2000 RPMs when clutched in/shifted to neutral.

It finally got "stuck" in the 1700s right as I neared my destination, in stop-and-go traffic, giving me a chance to plug in the scanner once I parked to read the stats which are as follow:

Fuel SYS1: CL, using H02S
Fuel SYS2: N/A
Coolant (F) 199
ST FTRM1(%) -4.6
LT FTRM1(%) 6.2
MAP (in. hg) 7.4
Engine (RPM) 1770
VEH Speed (MPH) 0
IGN ADV (DEG) 19.5
IAT (F) 45
ABSLT TPS (%) 1.9
SECOND AIR Atmosphere
O2S11 (v) (%)
0.305 -6.2
O2S12 (v) (%)
0.715 N/A
OBD2 STAT
OBD2-CALIF


That's all of the information from the scanner, I don't know if that provides any further clues. When I took those readings the car was parked in the parking garage after driving for about an hour.

Any ideas?

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 10:22 AM   #25
guyg
Member
guyg will become famous soon enough
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: North Jersey
Posts: 367

1997 SW2
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

Looks like your throttle position is 1.9, see what the reading is when it is idling normally. This may be totally irrelevant but on one of my cars I was struggling with a high idle, turned out the cruise control cable needed adjustment, it was keeping the tps slightly open, similar to your tps reading.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to guyg's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help guyg reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
guyg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 10:25 AM   #26
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

Thanks for the reply, I took a reading earlier last week before I replaced the thermostat and the TPS was reading 2.7 at that particular time, so I wonder if there is something going on there. The TPS has been changed twice in the last 12 months, when this problem began.

The car does not have a cruise control feature, though.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 11:40 AM   #27
guyg
Member
guyg will become famous soon enough
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: North Jersey
Posts: 367

1997 SW2
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

After I dig my car out of the snow I will check my tps at idle.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to guyg's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help guyg reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
guyg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 02:51 PM   #28
guyg
Member
guyg will become famous soon enough
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: North Jersey
Posts: 367

1997 SW2
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

I checked two different cars, on both the TPS was 0 . Make sure there is no strain on the accelerator linkage or cable, you may want to disconnect it to check your reading,it appears it should read 0 .

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to guyg's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help guyg reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
guyg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 09:23 PM   #29
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

Thanks for your help. In the times where the car is stuck idling too high, the TPS position seems to be around 2.7, it did it again after I posted earlier.

I disconnected the TPS wires while the engine was running and idling too high, and nothing changed. Every time I flick the keys in the ignition so the engine quickly restarts, the idling fixes itself and the car idles perfectly. I then drive for a few minutes, and inevitably the idling will get stuck back at 1700-2000.

I also noticed an error code on the scanner: U1301 Class 2 Short to Battery. It does not cause a light to fire off on the dashboard, though. Could there be a link between the idle issue and this code?

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 10:14 PM   #30
fdryer
Super Member
fdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond repute
 
fdryer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 39,313
 

2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

Several members here have found tps' troublesome when they weren't OEM replacements. Its not wise to disconnect electronics in EFI systems since they're crucial to integrated systems. Once anyone disconnects any part of EFI systems when the engine's running, its beta testing with unintended consequences no one can predict. You assume all risks when doing so as well as move away from the problem. As it is, the majority of high idling that's reset immediately with cycling ignition off and back on with idle back to normal tends to indicate a faulty tps.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to fdryer's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help fdryer reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
fdryer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 10:32 PM   #31
guyg
Member
guyg will become famous soon enough
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: North Jersey
Posts: 367

1997 SW2
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdryer View Post
is your throttle stuck open or is the pedal linkage stuck? A cable operated throttle can be disconnected from the throttle body linkage to separate pedal/cable issue from throttle body. Once the cable is disconnected, a determination can be made to see if throttle or pedal/cable is stuck.
Have you tried this and checked the TPS reading, you can physically close the throttle body to see if it is hanging up.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to guyg's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help guyg reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
guyg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 10:42 PM   #32
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdryer View Post
Several members here have found tps' troublesome when they weren't OEM replacements. Its not wise to disconnect electronics in EFI systems since they're crucial to integrated systems. Once anyone disconnects any part of EFI systems when the engine's running, its beta testing with unintended consequences no one can predict. You assume all risks when doing so as well as move away from the problem. As it is, the majority of high idling that's reset immediately with cycling ignition off and back on with idle back to normal tends to indicate a faulty tps.
So are you recommending buying an OEM TPS and switching it in? Does anyone have any explanation of what the U1301 code could mean?

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 10:50 PM   #33
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by guyg View Post
Have you tried this and checked the TPS reading, you can physically close the throttle body to see if it is hanging up.
I have not experimented with this, though I thought the throttle was electronic, and no physical/mechanical cable to disconnect... but I will double check tomorrow.

I am also curious about the U1301 code.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 10:54 PM   #34
guyg
Member
guyg will become famous soon enough
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: North Jersey
Posts: 367

1997 SW2
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

I don't know if it is electronic, I just assumed it is mechanical.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to guyg's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help guyg reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
guyg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2016, 02:36 PM   #35
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

I'm not sure if I am double posting, because I tried to post this update a minute ago and I thought it submitted but I'll try again: I came home today from driving and the car was stuck idling at 1600, I plugged in the scanner and noted the TPS (%) was 1.9. After about 30 seconds I was sitting there and the car corrected itself to idle at 600 and the TPS (%) dropped to 1.1. After another 15 seconds it rose back up on its own to 1600 and TPS (%) climbed back up. Along with the U1301 class 2 short to battery, does this indicate some sort of electronic issue?

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2016, 12:22 PM   #36
Montreal300
Member
Montreal300 has a spectacular aura aboutMontreal300 has a spectacular aura about
 
Montreal300's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: St. Lazare, Quebec
Posts: 185

2002 SL1
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

I'm having the same problem EXACTLY as you describe it. When this happens I stop and restart the car and all is well for the rest of the trip (sometimes not). It high idles at any time, any temperature and any time of year but rarely at start-up. I'm watching this thread with great interest.

...
2002 SL1 (55,000 km @ 11/12/2016)
2006 Chrysler 300C (modified)
2012 Hyundai Santa Fe
1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to Montreal300's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help Montreal300 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
Montreal300 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2016, 12:35 PM   #37
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

I promise to update here with any answers I find so it can be a resource for those with this same problem.

I went over to reddit.com/r/cartalk to post there as well and those guys seem to think it might be an issue with the ECU, especially with the strange U1301 error code. I think there is a strong correlation between the code and the idling issues. The strangest behavior is when the idling revs up then corrects itself when the car is sitting in neutral. It makes me wonder if there's an electrical concern there.

I have found a compatible ECU and intend to try this procedure: http://sixthsphere.com/showthread.ph...n-PCM-Swapping that was provided to me from a poster on Reddit.

Once I get a chance to try that I will report back, it may be another week before I get to try it though.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2016, 10:57 PM   #38
saturnhusker
Member
saturnhusker is on a distinguished road
 
saturnhusker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Huskernation
Posts: 304

2000 SL
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

What a coincidence I just pulled into my driveway and my tach was sitting at 2k it I just got through driving 70 miles. Mine does every once in a while. Today was in the 50's. I have cleaned everything during the summer, also my car has 314k 00 sohc. I shut it off and turn it back on and it went back to normal idle. Temp at 195 I average in the 40's mpg when its warm out. During this winter dropped to mid 30's with mostly hwy driving. So not to worried it does it every now and then.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to saturnhusker's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help saturnhusker reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
saturnhusker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 10:25 AM   #39
deident0687
Junior Member
deident0687 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 26
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

I'd like to submit a quick follow up. I tried an idea submitted to me from Reddit and swapped out the ECU for another ECU that was compatible. I performed the relearn procedure laid out here: http://sixthsphere.com/showthread.ph...n-PCM-Swapping

It was successful in swapping the ECU's but did not fix my idling issue. I am still at a loss of where to turn to next.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to deident0687's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help deident0687 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
deident0687 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2016, 11:30 AM   #40
fdryer
Super Member
fdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond repute
 
fdryer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 39,313
 

2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: 2001 SL1 High Idle Problem

It was suggested to replace the tps with an OEM part back in post #30................. All you did was prove the pcm wasn't the issue.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to fdryer's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help fdryer reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
fdryer is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2001 SL-1 random high idle rscamaro73 S-Series Tech 5 03-11-2014 05:10 PM
high idle 2001 SL1 mtbdsavage S-Series Tech 4 11-18-2011 09:39 PM
2001 SL1 High idle - cant get ECTS clip off eriklane S-Series General 16 01-10-2010 04:00 PM
High idle problems 2001 SL1 thevaledic S-Series Tech 5 05-08-2009 03:37 PM
2001 sc2 w/ a high idle Mean Green SC2 General Saturn Discussion 0 10-27-2004 09:56 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:13 PM.

Advanced Forum Search | Advanced Photo Search


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SaturnFans.com. The Saturn Enthusiasts Site.