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Old 08-07-2013, 09:43 AM   #1
tunedbysaturnsl
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1995 SL1
Default '95 SL1 BTSI Issue

A little background on the car. It's a '95 SL1 with around 98k miles on it. It's an automatic by the way. The car is not daily driven as it hasn't been on the road since winter of 2011 due to being rebuilt after an accident. But, it does run, very well. In fact, it was started up Sunday and idles as a nice, smooth 700 rpms when it warms up.

I noticed a few weeks ago that my car is allowed to shift out of park without having to press down on the brake pedal. Thus, leading me to suspect the BTSI solenoid component on the shifter assembly. I haven't had time to troubleshoot it fully just yet. The service manual has some suggestions on how to test if it is good by running a 12 volt source to one of the wires. More or less, I'm needing to check to make sure it is connected to both the shifter itself and the wiring harness plugged in which it should be, but it never hurts to check.

Now, this is where my question will come into play. I currently do not have any brake fluid in the system itself (I know this) since I'm waiting on a nice set of powder-coated blue brake calipers and aftermarket rotors with pads. (The brake fluid was drained during the engine/transmission/subframe swap.) The brake warning light is on on the instrument cluster (thought I had a parking brake issue, but then I did a search and discovered low/none brake fluid would cause that as well).

So, my question is. Would having no brake fluid cause the car to be allowed to shift out of park without having to press the brake pedal?

I wouldn't think so as it is a safety feature, but I figured I would ask. If not, I will have to troubleshoot the BTSI circuit and look at the brake light switch at the brake pedal as well since those two "talk" to each other. If I do need a new BTSI solenoid module, any place to get them online or is the salvage yard my best bet?

Thanks in advance for the help.

...
1995 Saturn SL1 "Abby"-Powertrain Swap Completed. Running As Of 07/27/2013
1997 Mitusbishi GST "Phoebe"

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Old 08-07-2013, 11:08 AM   #2
Jim97sl2
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1997 SL2
Default Re: '95 SL1 BTSI Issue

Brake fluid level should not affect the system directly. However, if the pedal is sitting low (due to low/no brake fluid) it is possible the low pedal could be pressing the switch on the brake pedal causing a false signal as if the pedal was being pressed. I would check the pedal position (make sure it is not sitting low) and switch to see if it needs adjustment. I would wait until the brake system is completed before adjusting the switch position (if it is needed) as it may just be a low pedal causing the switch to be activated.

Here is a thread with the testing procedure overview for the switch on a 1997.
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=193568

It doesn't cover the solenoid testing but you already have that in your service manual.

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Old 08-07-2013, 10:37 PM   #3
madpogue
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1996 SW2
Default Re: '95 SL1 BTSI Issue

^^^^^ +1; if the brake lights are on, then the pedal has dropped and the brake light switch is closed. If the battery is disconnected, the BTSI would not be active anyway, regardless of the brake pedal position.

The red (!)BRAKE failure warning light on the dash is, primarily a FAILURE warning light. Its function as a parking brake indicator is secondary. This is true of all passenger vehicles sold in the US in at least the last 40 years. This is something that should have been covered in driver's ed.

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Old 08-08-2013, 08:08 AM   #4
tunedbysaturnsl
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1995 SL1
Default Re: '95 SL1 BTSI Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by madpogue View Post
This is something that should have been covered in driver's ed.
No need to be rude about it and insult my intelligence, I haven't insulted yours or anyone else's have I? It was a simple question is all. I merely mentioned it because, probably like most people, I have never seen this light come on before minus using the parking brake.

@Jim97SL
Thank you for that link you provided. Battery is connected, brake lights aren't on. So, I'll investigate further after I get the brake system tightened up.

...
1995 Saturn SL1 "Abby"-Powertrain Swap Completed. Running As Of 07/27/2013
1997 Mitusbishi GST "Phoebe"

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Old 08-08-2013, 08:34 AM   #5
madpogue
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1996 SW2
Default Re: '95 SL1 BTSI Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by tunedbysaturnsl View Post
No need to be rude about it and insult my intelligence, I haven't insulted yours or anyone else's have I? It was a simple question is all. I merely mentioned it because, probably like most people, I have never seen this light come on before minus using the parking brake.
Total misinterpretation. This indicates a failure of the driver's education system, not of any student thereof.

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Old 08-09-2013, 01:41 PM   #6
tunedbysaturnsl
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1995 SL1
Default Re: '95 SL1 BTSI Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by madpogue View Post
Total misinterpretation. This indicates a failure of the driver's education system, not of any student thereof.
Oh okay. Lol.

...
1995 Saturn SL1 "Abby"-Powertrain Swap Completed. Running As Of 07/27/2013
1997 Mitusbishi GST "Phoebe"

Looking For:
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