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Old 02-25-2013, 11:45 AM   #1
cjhsa
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Default Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

I'm at about 104,000 miles. Does that Honda engine use a timing belt?

If that needs to be changed I think it's trade bait.

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Old 02-25-2013, 12:28 PM   #2
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

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Originally Posted by cjhsa View Post
I'm at about 104,000 miles. Does that Honda engine use a timing belt?

If that needs to be changed I think it's trade bait.
It is a belt and there's lots of stuff suggested to happen around 100,000 miles.

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Old 02-25-2013, 01:37 PM   #3
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

That sucks because I have little spare change to spend. What's interesting is that the stealership said that all that was required was a tranny drain/fill, spark plugs, and rear diff drain/fill.

My car exhibits the TC shimmy even after having it replaced twice AND reprogrammed. I was thinking of trying an aftermarket ATF fluid instead of the Z1 stuff in there.

The rear diff was replaced about 50K ago so the fluid isn't that old.

I was gonna have a small shop do the plugs... but a timing BELT? Really.... Is this an interference engine design?

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Old 02-25-2013, 01:52 PM   #4
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

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Originally Posted by cjhsa View Post
I was gonna have a small shop do the plugs... but a timing BELT? Really.... Is this an interference engine design?
It is interference -

I would never try to talk you out of regular maintenance - but since money is tight - I can say I had timing belts changed on two Vue's at 100K miles and shop doing the work had trouble telling old belt from new.

I've also changed sparkplugs at 100K on two Vue's - I used OEM plugs as replacement and the old plugs were well within spec for gap.

I guess what I'm saying is if you are a semi-prudent operator and keeps oil, coolant and ATF fresh you could probably safely defer the big ticket items for a few thousand miles.

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Old 02-25-2013, 02:02 PM   #5
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

OK thank you. I sure would like to put off that timing belt change for awhile.

Any thoughts on the ATF? I was thinking of the Valvoline MaxLife Dex/Merc which says it is suitable for Honda Z-1 application.

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Old 02-25-2013, 05:29 PM   #6
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

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OK thank you. I sure would like to put off that timing belt change for awhile.

Any thoughts on the ATF? I was thinking of the Valvoline MaxLife Dex/Merc which says it is suitable for Honda Z-1 application.
I only use Honda or GM ATF-Z1 or the newer ATF-DW1. I take care of four family 3.5 Vue's and have not had one instance of transmission/TC related problems (I'll probably die when the cartons of empty and full ATF containers fall on me).

Many other members use non-Honda branded fluid and love it.

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Old 02-26-2013, 07:58 AM   #7
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

You know I find it a bit odd because all of the other vehicles I own don't have these kind of transmission fluid change requirements. In fact, on most boards people say "don't mess with it if it's working". My 30-year old BMW has had the MTL changed exactly three times. The first time they put the wrong stuff in it and had to change it again (that makes two times). The last time was over 10 years ago and it still is full of Redline MTL.

Jeep and Chrysler products - most will say leave them alone unless you notice something undesirable.

Is this tranny drain/fill common to GM vehicles? As noted above, the torque converter has been replaced twice in this Vue, and it was reflashed. The rear diff went and had to be replace at about 50K. There have been a myriad of other problems that seem fairly common, like wheel bearings and window regulators. Hard to figure out how they can make money on a $25K sale when they have to make so many warranty repairs.

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Old 02-26-2013, 09:51 AM   #8
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

Not GM transmissions- just the Honda.

And while the Honda motor is a timing belt with an interference engine, I've never heard of any belt breaking in one of these motors.

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Old 02-26-2013, 10:40 AM   #9
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom92SCm View Post
Not GM transmissions- just the Honda.

And while the Honda motor is a timing belt with an interference engine, I've never heard of any belt breaking in one of these motors.
Roger that on the Honda tranny. They make such good small engines, guess they never quite figured out how to mate up drivetrains. Wife had an Integra once. Dealer double filled it with oil. She drove it about two miles, called me, I got it corrected, didn't hurt that engine a bit. A couple years later, the clutch went... sounds familiar now.

If the TB never breaks, then what is the purpose of the scheduled service? I know it's a big job, requires removing the front cover off the engine, replacing the belt and gaskets, setting timing, time consuming. And typically you might replace the water pump and serpentine belt at the same time, maybe even the power steering pump.

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Old 02-27-2013, 01:50 PM   #10
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

I have a 2006 V6 so the same engine. I had my timing belt changed at 125K roughly and I had them do the water pump, serpentine, and thermostat all at the same time.

For trans fluid I use the Valvoline stuff. First fluid change was at 90K, 2nd was at 150K. I only did a single drain and fill but there are others that will do a drain and fill 3 times at each fluid change. Their theory is that by the 3rd refill then you have replaced 80% or more of the old stuff. Myself, still shifting strong with a single dump and refill each time.

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Old 02-27-2013, 03:46 PM   #11
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

OK... dumb question. Why does a drain of the tranny not drain all of the fluid?

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Old 02-27-2013, 04:15 PM   #12
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

Gravity and the fact that there is fluid trapped in places like the torque converter.

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Old 02-27-2013, 05:14 PM   #13
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cjhsa View Post
....... Is this tranny drain/fill common to GM vehicles? As noted above, the torque converter has been replaced twice in this Vue, and it was reflashed. The rear diff went and had to be replace at about 50K. There have been a myriad of other problems that seem fairly common, like wheel bearings and window regulators. Hard to figure out how they can make money on a $25K sale when they have to make so many warranty repairs.
An outdated term may be more relative now with certain exceptions -designed obsolescence. Its not fair comparing a BMW car to a Vue suv. Price structure alone makes an unfair comparison. Reliability is another. If you were to compare a similar year BMW suv against your Vue and examine all maintenance/irregularities with both along with maintenance costs, there might be room for the pros and cons. As is, your BMW seems to be holding up better than your Vue unless you haven't mentioned overall costs between the two spread out over the years.

Saturns as a whole was a venture that GM thought would bolster its low end model sales line. Obviously it didn't work. BMW on the other hand has been around before and after WW II with a tendency to continue improving its car line with long term goals. Different business mind set for GM and BMW. If you consider the fact that Saturn's Vue was another venture to get into the lucrative suv market and the overall poor engineering/reliability of a now extinct company, this may be seen in a better light. GM used everything in its product line to make Saturn and early Beta testing of every Saturn model bears the brunt of what works and what doesn't. All the design engineering and real world tests cannot reveal the mass marketing data gathered that displays overall reliability. Quality is what's designed and repeated without fail and continuous product support with customer feedback on real issues to correct flaws. A giant like GM has shown the legacy issues of too many duplicate engineers bloated with too many products resulting in one of the largest financial bail outs for any company. BMW didn't have this business ego and stuck to making and selling into a niche market. GM seems to be downsized and appears to be learning this lesson after bloating itself. It went on a diet................

Saturn's Vue was undergoing major changes (for the better before the bottom fell out?) when switching from the 2.2L to 3.0L to 3.5L to 3.6L and optioning awd. If allowed to continue, it would seem that Saturn would iron out teething pains eventually but then again engineering conflicting with marketing simply delayed the improvements waiting in the wings that never came to be. Then consider marketing that demanded the Outlook? Another suv. Duplication of efforts is a mistake when too many cooks are involved...............

Google 'torque converter operation' for basic info. This link shows how much xmission oil fills and remains in torque converters - that isn't drained in any drain and fill procedure since t/c's are pumping fluid only when the engine's running; http://www.tciauto.com/tc/fluid-capacity/. Consider the t/c as a sump that can't be drained but will have fluid circulating through whenever its turning.

Most vehicles won't need xmission service whether its a car or suv. What makes it difficult to determine whether or not your suv needs xmission oil replacement is the short life of Vues using one xmission without the history that would normally accompany any part if used in another model and adapted to suv's. Each application, say your xmission came from the L300's, doesn't mean this xmission will have the same durability as it has in the L300's. Adapting presents new areas and questions despite the engineering data sheets saying this will work........................

...
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*There's more to a/c than just a few cans of refrigerant*
*There's more to brakes than just replacing parts*

Last edited by fdryer; 02-27-2013 at 05:20 PM..

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Old 02-27-2013, 07:45 PM   #14
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cjhsa View Post
OK... dumb question. Why does a drain of the tranny not drain all of the fluid?
The 3.5 Vue transmission holds about 9.5 quarts. Much is located in torque converter and hoses leading to/from the ATF cooler in radiator. You can drain about 4.0 quarts from a FWD Vue and 4.5 quarts from AWD Vue.

Its easy to drain and fill the trans so if first time do three times with 50 miles or so between each change and thereafter change once at 25,000 intervals. I have four 3.5 Vues in family (50,000, 60,000, 102,000 and 106,000) and no transmission problems.

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Old 02-28-2013, 08:26 AM   #15
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

Thanks everyone for the excellent info.

FYI, I wasn't comparing a BMW SUV to the Vue. My BMW is an almost 30-year old 3-series, a project car now, but I wouldn't even try to to compare the first five to ten years of life, but I might compare the second decade of the BMW to the first of the Vue.

I paid more for the Vue than the BMW too, unless you adjust for real dollars. I have three vehicles that are first runs of their respective models, the 1984 BMW, a 2002 Jeep Liberty, and a 1996 Chrysler T&C. The Vue was the end of the run before they switched to the Opel. I would at least kinda think they might have had a lot of these issues sorted out by then.

The "market research" perhaps explains why this isn't the case.

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Old 02-28-2013, 12:19 PM   #16
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

Question for those who have done the timing belt: Which one did you use? I see there is an A/C Delco "kit" that sells for about $185 on Amazon. It includes a waterpump and other replacement parts so the price isn't that out of line.

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Old 02-28-2013, 01:00 PM   #17
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

Seems that many will get the rockauto.com kit that includes the water pump and all the other goodies.

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Old 03-01-2013, 08:09 AM   #18
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

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Seems that many will get the rockauto.com kit that includes the water pump and all the other goodies.
Thanks for that. I am not a fan of rockauto due to their absolutely unusable website, but I will (try to) check.

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Old 03-01-2013, 09:01 AM   #19
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Default Re: Timing Belt or Chain on 2007 AWD V6?

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Thanks for that. I am not a fan of rockauto due to their absolutely unusable website, but I will (try to) check.
Hmmm - RockAuto site always seemed friendly to me (?).
Yeah - Amazon has the ACDelco 19253929 kit a few $$$ cheaper than RA, and maybe free shipping.

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