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Old 06-18-2008, 08:17 PM   #1
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Default '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Refined

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'09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Refined Package

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The 2009 Saturn Aura sport-sedan demonstrates that customers wanting high fuel efficiency don't have to sacrifice uplevel amenities such as a six-speed automatic transmission, leather seating, alloy wheels and Bluetooth hands-free phone connectivity, as the brand is adding a new 2.4L four-cylinder XR model to its midsize car lineup.

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Old 06-18-2008, 08:58 PM   #2
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

Sounds like some nice improvements for 2009. I wonder what the grip on snow will be like on the 4-cyl models with the low resistant tires?

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Old 06-18-2008, 09:52 PM   #3
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

I like the sounds of this.

I really think this is when the Aura can finally "take off" as it hasn't really, at least in my area.

I would really like to see a Bluetooth upgrade for my Aura, if possible, but I doubt it.

The one thing I'm worried about is how GM could possibly once again toss the Aura into a dark corner to accumulate dust, while the Malibu will get all the publicity for getting 33 MPG.. Only time will tell.

What an exciting time for Saturn.

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Old 06-19-2008, 06:51 AM   #4
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

I'll be impressed when the Aura gets 49mpg like the Opel Vectra does with the 1.9L diesel engine. Then it will really be a class leader.

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Old 06-19-2008, 09:29 AM   #5
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Roll Eyes Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

already getting 35mpg highway in my 3.6L w/ 100 more hp

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Old 06-19-2008, 10:43 AM   #6
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

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Originally Posted by bc3tech View Post
already getting 35mpg highway in my 3.6L w/ 100 more hp
Please elaborate,

Are you saying your car has 100hp more than a standard Aura XR and you are achieving 35 mpg?
Please tell us how you are managing that, I am sure we would all like to take advantage.

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Old 06-19-2008, 10:58 AM   #7
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seasoned View Post
Please elaborate,

Are you saying your car has 100hp more than a standard Aura XR and you are achieving 35 mpg?
Please tell us how you are managing that, I am sure we would all like to take advantage.
i'm saying mine has 100hp more than the 2.4L they're talking about getting 33mpg with. and yes, i get ~35mpg hwy (which is what the 33mpg estimate on the 2.4 is from)

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Old 06-19-2008, 11:13 AM   #8
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

Quote:
Originally Posted by lbhskier37 View Post
I'll be impressed when the Aura gets 49mpg like the Opel Vectra does with the 1.9L diesel engine. Then it will really be a class leader.
Try adding U.S. Safety equipment to that Vectra 1.9 and see what the mileage goes to. When you add 6-700 ponds to a car, I believe the MPG goes down. When that weight is a significant percentage of the cars weight, like it is on all really small cars, the MPG will be impacted. There are hundreds of cars in Japan that get 40 - 50 MPG, carry 2 people and have under 660 CC engines. But run one into a parked SUV at 20 MPH and your dead.

So what do American drivers want? what will congress let American drivers have? It equals more power/lower MPG.

Ergo, you can't compare European or Asian cars with what we can have here.
You want 49 MPG? Move to Europe or Japan.

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Old 06-19-2008, 11:56 AM   #9
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaeton Driver View Post
Try adding U.S. Safety equipment to that Vectra 1.9 and see what the mileage goes to.
See the specs on the PDF files attached, the Vectra has no less equipment than any american spec vehicle

"Ergo, you can't compare European or Asian cars with what we can have here.
You want 49 MPG? Move to Europe or Japan."

Or bring Euro or Asian cars to America, like the Vectra
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Vectra%20Specifications%20-%201.pdf (87.5 KB, 7 views)
File Type: pdf Vectra%20Specifications%20-%202.pdf (36.3 KB, 3 views)

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Old 06-19-2008, 12:29 PM   #10
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seasoned View Post
See the specs on the PDF files attached, the Vectra has no less equipment than any american spec vehicle

"Ergo, you can't compare European or Asian cars with what we can have here.
You want 49 MPG? Move to Europe or Japan."

Or bring Euro or Asian cars to America, like the Vectra
Thanks for the Data files
Looks like the Vectra weighs about the same as the Aura I4 here. I am surprised to see all the same interior safety items.
The document says it gets 52 MPG (imperial gallons) extra-urban (Highway?)
which is almost unbelievable. Even converting the Gallons (1.2 US gal) it is still over 40 MPG (US).

So how do they get so much more efficiency out of a gallon of gasoline?
They seem to be getting more energy per gallon than is possible with todays emission and US measurement standards.

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Old 06-19-2008, 12:50 PM   #11
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaeton Driver View Post
Thanks for the Data files
Looks like the Vectra weighs about the same as the Aura I4 here. I am surprised to see all the same interior safety items.
The document says it gets 52 MPG (imperial gallons) extra-urban (Highway?)
which is almost unbelievable. Even converting the Gallons (1.2 US gal) it is still over 40 MPG (US).

So how do they get so much more efficiency out of a gallon of gasoline?
They seem to be getting more energy per gallon than is possible with todays emission and US measurement standards.
Its not impossible at all. A well designed modern diesel engine is 30% or more efficient than a modern gasoline engine of similar output. Diesel engines are just more thermodynamically efficient.

Since we've had low gas prices here for so many years auto makers have just decided we don't want fuel efficiency. For example Dodge builds Calibers, Avengers, minivans, and Chargers with 1.9L diesel engines in their American plants for sale in Europe. They all get similar mileage to the Vectra. With the cost of fuel rising though I have hope that we will see some of these fuel efficient vehicles soon. I need a new car in about a year and whoever can give me a midsized car with the best fuel economy is getting my money. I really hope GM stops toying around with 30-33mpg and really puts up the goods.

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Old 06-19-2008, 12:56 PM   #12
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

I guess the Jetta must not be technically in the same class as the Aura.

http://www.vwvortex.com/artman/publi...cle_2336.shtml

Just announced the 2009 Jetta TDI EPA rated at 29mpg city 40mpg highway with independent real world testing showing 38city 44highway. Available starting at $21,990. Jetta isn't much smaller than the Aura and has a much nicer interior. I like the look of the Aura better and would be more happy with an American car since I can get parts easier. If VW can do that, there is no reason GM can't sell us a mid 40s rated car of the same size for a similar price.

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Old 06-19-2008, 03:00 PM   #13
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

The reason it's getting that mileage though, is because it's a diesel, and the Aura has the 2.4L ecotec. If they offered diesel here, different story.

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Old 06-19-2008, 03:58 PM   #14
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

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The reason it's getting that mileage though, is because it's a diesel, and the Aura has the 2.4L ecotec. If they offered diesel here, different story.

Thats what I am saying. I wish they would offer us the diesel from the Vectra. If VW can make a diesel pass emissions and sell it for under $22k, GM should be able to as well. I think the new CAFE laws will force GMs hand, I hope it does by 2010 model year because that is all the longer I will wait for a new car.

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Old 06-19-2008, 04:14 PM   #15
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

My guess is GM is banking on Hybrids for NA, hence the big push to have the 'Volt' up and running by 2010.

I would be surprised if we ever see a GM diesel here, the NA market has a discension with diesels and a love affair with Hybrids. Purely perception.

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Old 06-19-2008, 05:11 PM   #16
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

Would the ultimate NA car be a car with a Diesel generator, a bank of batteries and electric motors at all four corners?
I'll consider a hybrid when the OEM's replace the batteries for free for the life of the car, not before. I have to put $600 worth of batteries in my Golf Cart every 5 years, and the cars don't use Lead-Acid batteries, which are cheap by comparison. When you factor in the $4-5000 replacement cost of a bank of batteries every 5 years, the cost per mile goes way way up.

Like a diesel getting 40 MPG VS a Gas car getting 30 MPG the price difference per gallon erases most of the advantages of the diesel. The gas car will always pollute less and out accelerate the diesel in the same class of car/truck.

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Old 06-19-2008, 06:16 PM   #17
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

Are they going to fix the crappy reliability?

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Old 06-19-2008, 06:30 PM   #18
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

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I'll consider a hybrid when the OEM's replace the batteries for free for the life of the car, not before. I have to put $600 worth of batteries in my Golf Cart every 5 years, and the cars don't use Lead-Acid batteries, which are cheap by comparison. When you factor in the $4-5000 replacement cost of a bank of batteries every 5 years, the cost per mile goes way way up.
Where did you get 5 years? The guy in Vancouver who uses a Prius in his taxi service didn't replace his batteries even after 250K miles. The batteries are warranted 8year/100K miles and 10year/150K miles in some states.
Plus, the battery packs can be tested and replaced individually.

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Old 06-19-2008, 08:28 PM   #19
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

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Like a diesel getting 40 MPG VS a Gas car getting 30 MPG the price difference per gallon erases most of the advantages of the diesel. The gas car will always pollute less and out accelerate the diesel in the same class of car/truck.
But the diesels usually get mid to high 40s in real world driving vs gassers getting in the low 30s. And diesel costing significantly more than gas right now is an anomoly that won't last in the long run. Diesel doesn't cost anymore to refine, it costs more right now because refining capacity for diesel is more strained that for gasoline right now. Refiners are making way more profit on diesel than gasoline right now so they are upping their refining capacity for diesel. In the long run this will even out. I plan on keeping a car 5-10 years, so looking at the trends over the last 20 years diesel and gasoline cost about the same per gallon. My bet is that in the next 10 it will average out as well.

As for hybrids. I believe they are more trouble than they are worth for many people. If you mainly do city driving they are great, but it you do mostly highway miles you don't take advantage of the hybrids advantage. For example on the highway in real world driving the civic hybrid will get no better mileage than a standard civic. Maintenance is another issue with hybrids. Shops that service hybrids need separate bays marked off specifically for hybrids to keep other away from the high voltage. And employees need special training to be allowed to work on them, even for oil changes! I for one don't want to have to deal with that.

I think GM will end up bringing diesels if the price of gas stays above $3. The Volt is a nice idea, but they are saying $40,000+ when it comes out. It will take several years before plug in hybrids are a real alternative. A diesel would be a solution they could sell to the masses right now. They already have the engines and they fit in the existing platforms.

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Old 06-20-2008, 12:38 AM   #20
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Default Re: '09 Aura Offers Class-Leading EPA Estimated 33 MPG Fuel Economy in a Stylish, Ref

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Where did you get 5 years? The guy in Vancouver who uses a Prius in his taxi service didn't replace his batteries even after 250K miles. The batteries are warranted 8year/100K miles and 10year/150K miles in some states.
Plus, the battery packs can be tested and replaced individually.
A few articles I have read have indicated that the expectations for the new batteries to still be 100% rechargeable is about 5 years and they will loose the ability to fully recharge after that, the vehicle range on Battery will become shorter and shorter. So I figure most people will need to replace them in about 5 years.

How many of these HyBrids have been running mostly on DC for 8 years?

Is the 8 year warranty 100% replacement or pro rated like other batteries?

How about the motors and Motor controllers, how long are they warrantied for?

How long does it take to recharge a completely depleted battery pack take to recharge from a 115V/15A AC circuit?

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