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Old 08-05-2007, 08:54 AM   #21
96GSL1
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

Anti-freeze does act as an agent to prevent freezing/boiling over of your coolant. But don't forget, proper (whatever that is) levels of coolant also provide good corrosion/cavitation protection as well. GM is getting sued because people who left their dex-cool systems low found rust.

Duh!

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Old 08-05-2007, 05:39 PM   #22
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

I agree that water can move more heat than anti-freeze.
However at 15 psig, water will boil at 250 degrees F.
Does your temp go that high on your coolant? Yes and no.
At the radiator, never. Around the cylinder sleeve, you bet.
All that there needs to be is a film of steam bubbles at the cylinder, and the heat transfer goes way down, and your cylinder sleeves end up cracking from heat cycling.

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Old 08-06-2007, 12:14 AM   #23
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Dizzy Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

OK, I swear I am not making this up. I had a neighbor stop over earlier today. His wife's Chrysler overheated on her just as she was coming up the street yesterday. He came over because he saw me out working on the rear deck of the SC2.

His car (Oldsmobile) and their son's Chevy truck both use Dexcool and have sealed cooling systems. So of course guess what kind of antifreeze they keep handy in their garage....

Guess what they put in her non-pressurized open air overflow tank system last time they changed the antifreeze about 15 months ago or so.....

Guess what we found in her overflow tank and radiator when we pulled the cap today. Clue- it is brown, thick and slimey and it is clogging up her entire cooling system. I showed him the leftover slime in my truck's overflow tank from its Dexcool misadventure. Identical.

They are limping it to a radiator shop tomorrow where it will be completely flushed out and a fresh load of green old-style antifreeze will be put in. He is just hoping they can get the radiator cleaned out without having to replace it. It looked like it was full of MUD.

Dexcool works OK in vehicles that were designed for it (I suppose), but if a vehicle was shipped with non-Dexcool coolant, for heaven's sake DON'T put Dexcool in it.

Be forewarned.

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Old 09-17-2007, 01:20 PM   #24
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by DIYguy View Post
OK, I swear I am not making this up. I had a neighbor stop over earlier today. His wife's Chrysler overheated on her just as she was coming up the street yesterday. He came over because he saw me out working on the rear deck of the SC2.

His car (Oldsmobile) and their son's Chevy truck both use Dexcool and have sealed cooling systems. So of course guess what kind of antifreeze they keep handy in their garage....

Guess what they put in her non-pressurized open air overflow tank system last time they changed the antifreeze about 15 months ago or so.....

Guess what we found in her overflow tank and radiator when we pulled the cap today. Clue- it is brown, thick and slimey and it is clogging up her entire cooling system. I showed him the leftover slime in my truck's overflow tank from its Dexcool misadventure. Identical.

They are limping it to a radiator shop tomorrow where it will be completely flushed out and a fresh load of green old-style antifreeze will be put in. He is just hoping they can get the radiator cleaned out without having to replace it. It looked like it was full of MUD.

Dexcool works OK in vehicles that were designed for it (I suppose), but if a vehicle was shipped with non-Dexcool coolant, for heaven's sake DON'T put Dexcool in it.

Be forewarned.
Put Prestone "universal" All Makes All Models "Dexclone" in a 92 Previa and 96 Saturn, both originally equipped with the green snot of death.

Nearly a year on both...no issues.

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Old 02-23-2008, 04:16 AM   #25
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by 97coupe View Post
There is some misconceptions about water verses coolant. Glycol is more dense and take more heat per degree of temp rise than water. The reason some say water cools better is that it take twice the energy to boil it off not to raise its temperature in a liquid state (it actually takes less). The reason some cars appear to run warmer on higher coolant mixture is because it removes heat from block better and temp sensor read coolant temp not block temp. It has to do with water surface tension and a gas/steam bubble barrier forming over parts with water retarding heat transfer and coolant (glycol) with a much higher boiling temperature and much lower surface tension removes heat better. When I used to drag race years ago I used pure antifreeze and a low pressure cap and never had boil over or heating problems. (pure antifreeze boils at about 340 degrees at atmospheric pressure)
As someone with a degree in chemical engineering, and having read many authoritative sources on the subject, I have to say that YOU are the one with the misconceptions. Ethylene Glycol and Propylene Glycol both have lower specific heat than water and therefore can absorb less heat per unit volume. They raise the boiling point of water because they are impurities (just like salting water in a pan on the stove). Don't you think that if antifreeze was like you claim, they would have everyone using it at 100% concentration? There is a really good reason they say to use 50/50.

As far as the issues with DexCool, look folks, there ARE people with engines that have been ruined. They have websites detailing what happened and their mechanics back them up. There IS gel in the block and radiator. Now how did it get there? Little pixies put it there? There are dozens of lawsuits over DexCool and how many against the old green stuff? That's right - ZERO!

AND... Prestone now is marketing a long life antifreeze designed to go 150k miles, yet it is based on ethylene glycol (NOT the propylene glycol in DexCool)and they say it can be mixed with either red or green antifreeze. So they have a new formulation. What does that tell you? What Prestone, GM and so many owners already knew - DexCool was a problem!

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Old 02-23-2008, 06:24 AM   #26
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

Read post #7 and #9; http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=110068

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Old 02-26-2008, 02:46 AM   #27
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

I'm contemplating switching to Honda Type 2 coolant which is the standard coolant for the J35 engine. I'm waiting until the 3 year mark to flush the cooling system and swapping out the coolant. By then my VUE should have ~13k miles.

My service advisor for 15 years told me honestly they don't have a problem with Dexcool in Saturns. I believe him.

I'm changing the Mobil 1 this week. The OLM said I'm down to 26%. It has 4100 miles on it. The dipstick is still reading full. No measurable oil usage.

A magnificent engine.

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Old 03-03-2008, 02:38 PM   #28
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

I use the "already mixed" DEX-Cool liquid in my 1999 Saturn SL2. Everyone talks about 50/50, but I use the already mixed solution to avoid this. Should I still add a little water "just in case"?

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Old 04-05-2008, 06:04 PM   #29
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by alleninpa View Post
I agree that water can move more heat than anti-freeze.
However at 15 psig, water will boil at 250 degrees F.
Does your temp go that high on your coolant? Yes and no.
At the radiator, never. Around the cylinder sleeve, you bet.
All that there needs to be is a film of steam bubbles at the cylinder, and the heat transfer goes way down, and your cylinder sleeves end up cracking from heat cycling.

Al
I'm puzzled. The only time I've ever seen 250 degree block temperatures were in Cat 6.25" bore industrial engines (D379, D398, D399), and this was to recover process steam. These high block temperatures resulted in ebullient cooling whereby circulation was strictly by convection, and no jacket water pump was used. Standard setup with a pump involves 195 degree thermostats and a top tank temperature of 210 F with a 15 degree delta T when the coolant returns to the pump inlet. I couldn't imagine a car engine being any different.

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Old 04-06-2008, 01:10 PM   #30
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Wrench Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

I don't like and will not use DEXCOOL in any of my vehicles. I use PRESTONES new formula with good results.

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Old 05-05-2008, 08:42 PM   #31
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by Motorhead62 View Post
I don't like and will not use DEXCOOL in any of my vehicles. I use PRESTONES new formula with good results.
Last time I looked, the new Prestone formula and Dexcool formula on the label looked about the same. The only thing that seemed to be different is one was green and one was orange.

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Old 06-18-2008, 09:27 AM   #32
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

i got brown gunky ***** using prestone. Now i got dexcool. But need to flush it and get a new resevoir cuz im too lazy to clean it although preston's flush chemical that we use at our dealer works great.

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Old 06-26-2008, 10:28 PM   #33
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

FWIW, and I'm not meaning to start any arguments here, but I'm simply pointing out that the DexCool lawsuits only involve vehicles equipped with the 4.3L V6, 3800 V6, and 60 degree V6.

All of these engines had issues with intake gasket leaks.

S/T trucks with the 2.2L 4 cylinder didn't have issues with DexCool... 4.3L S/T trucks did.
V8 full size trucks didn't have issues with DexCool... 4.3L full size trucks did. The supercharged 3800, which had an aluminium intake manifold didn't have issues with DexCool... the plastic-intake naturally aspirated 3800 did.
Once GM went back to the drawing board with the new generation of 60 degree V6 (3.5L and 3.9L) and fixed the leaking plastic intake in the 3800, the DexCool problems stopped in both engines.

See a trend here? Some vehicles are far more prone to DexCool problems. You'll hear varying reasons why this is (I'm sure you can guess my opinion as to why), but the scope really is limited to vehicles equipped with those three engines. The coolant hasn't changed, but the problems have stopped. Is it really the coolant's fault, or the vehicle which it was poured into? Regardless, the vast majority of the millions of DexCool-equipped vehicled GM has produced have been, and continue to be, trouble free.

In general, the coolent situation within the auto industry is a debacle. No two manufacturers can agree on a coolent they like (phosphate-free, silicate-free, low phosphate but silicate-free) and the color (pink, light green, dark green, yellow, orange) just makes it more confusing. The aftermarket, with their "universal" coolents that don't really meet any manufacturer's spec, doesn't make it any better either.

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Old 07-07-2008, 09:03 AM   #34
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

I've been lazy about changing my fluid. I shouldn't say lazy but it needs to be changed. But I'll stop procrastinating tomorrow.

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Old 06-01-2009, 11:03 PM   #35
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

So dex-cool's characteristics work ok with gm manufactured vehicles. Ford and Chrysler's gaskets are not made to work with dex-cool and do break down. This is mostly the problem that does happen and arise from dex-cool being put into vehicles that the gaskets are not compatible with.

I know many people blame dex-cool to be the problem for the 3.4 and 3.1 motors to leak at the upper intake manifold gaskets and the coolant has nothing to do with it, it is just a batch of bad gaskets from the initial supplier and many engines were built with them. I have done upper intake gaskets on vehicle and with the new gaskets and a little bit extra rtv sealant they never come back leaking.

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Old 06-15-2009, 03:51 PM   #36
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger View Post
Last time I looked, the new Prestone formula and Dexcool formula on the label looked about the same. The only thing that seemed to be different is one was green and one was orange.
I believe that the only things they are required to disclose on the labels are the toxic things; hence there can be stuff in there they don't mention on the label and the specific proportions may not be stated. they try to keep the proprietary info secret.

One thing about Dexcool -- if your car was not intended to use it, you should not. That is, any car made before 1996 should stay with the green stuff.

There are lots of people with lots of horror stories about Dexcool and since there are NONE with the green antifreeze, AND Prestone has now come out with a new formulation, well... common sense should kick in here at some point, shouldn't it?

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Old 06-15-2009, 06:33 PM   #37
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

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Originally Posted by bobbyrae View Post
I believe that the only things they are required to disclose on the labels are the toxic things; hence there can be stuff in there they don't mention on the label and the specific proportions may not be stated. they try to keep the proprietary info secret.
Interesting. Learn something every day here. I use the Dex-cool Prestone makes. I just change it out sooner than recommended. So far, no problems. Though, my water pump seal did go bad. So, was it the Dexcool, or would it have happened no matter what antifreeze I used?

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Old 06-19-2009, 09:33 PM   #38
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

plain old water transfers heat better than antifreeze mix.

I got a boat with twin inboards, fresh water cooled. Running water gives a cooler reading like 160 to 170
running 50 /50 antifreeze, the motors ran much hotter like close to 200
O did not like that.
So, I run a weak mixture like 25% antifreeze or I run plain water with water pump lubricant. rust preventer.

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Old 07-16-2009, 07:28 PM   #39
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by stocksaturn View Post
Right now I'm using
%25 Dex-cool at a 50/50 mix
%75 Peak at a 50/50 mix
one half bottle of Red line water wetter
I do have a aux. suck-in cooling fan in front of the radiator and a oversized air dam made out of a moon roof wind deflector I found in some ones garbage. Even in 95+ degree heat has yet to cross the 1/2 mark even in stop and go traffic. Itís my own blend
my car ion goes little beyond teh half mark, it goes up to teh line aboe its hat 100 degree angle and stays there

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Old 11-29-2009, 07:29 AM   #40
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Default Re: Good article about Dex-Cool

Great one. All the best man.

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