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Old 03-28-2011, 08:42 PM   #1
mysaturn99
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Default p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

ok here is some back ground on the problem. I replaced the timing chain in the car and when i went to start it the car would fire and just stumble and barely idle then stall. The first thing i thought of was the timing was off. So i pulled the valve cover off and put a long screw driver in the number 1cylinder.Whenever the number one cylinder was at TDC the mark on the timing gears were straight up or down. So i figure the timing was ok. so i put everything back together.
I try and restart it. If I hold the pedal to the floor it fires and then stumbles for a little bit. Then revs up and then idles ok. I take the car for a drive and it is low on power and holds the shifts alot more then normal. This is when the p0172 comes up. I have been driving the car this way for a week. When the engine is warm it will fire up and idle ok, but still lacks power. When it has been stting all day and is cold I have to hold it to the floor to get it to start. Here is what I have checked

1.fuel pressure with key on not running is good and didn't seem to leak down
2.Pulled the injectors and turned the key on. the one injector had a dime size wet spot under it. I wouldnt think that would be enought to do it.
3.checked the plugs and all 4 are black.
4. pulled the oxgen sensor and tried starting it but got the same results, so i figure the exhuast isnt pluged
5. vacum is right at 19 or 20 at idle is pretty steady
6 the coolant sensor is about one year old and is brass. The conector was kind of dirty, but when i tried to clean it I broke it. new one on the way
7.The live data with code scanner shows the timing at idle around 15 but it does jump around like up to 17 or 18.

I have read the alot on the p0172 code and I know it can be a pain to figure out,but i think what ever is causing that is the samething that is causing my starting issue. I keep going back to the timing chain. The car always started perfect before i did the timing chain and the p0172 was never a problem before that.

Could it still be a timing issue or did something else just happen to go bad while i had it apart.

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Old 03-28-2011, 08:49 PM   #2
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

Usually when something comes up wrong after fixing something the cause is what you fixed last. All indications are the engine is out of time. Where did the timing chain come from and did you replace just the chain or all the parts?

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Old 03-28-2011, 08:50 PM   #3
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

Was the timing set replaced along with a rebuild or later? Time line of maintenance is what I am asking.

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Old 03-29-2011, 09:20 AM   #4
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

Quote:
Originally Posted by mysaturn99
coolant sensor is about one year old and is brass. The conector was kind of dirty, but when i tried to clean it I broke it. new one on the way
I'm a little confused - do you have a broken connector on the ECTS then? Or is it just something minor, like a tab or something broken on the connector?

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Old 03-29-2011, 07:35 PM   #5
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

I rebuilt the motor a year ago this past summer. About 2 weeks ago the new timing set I had put on when i rebuilt it streched and started making a noise. So I e-mailed rock auto and they sent me a knew one.

I wasn't looking forward to pulling everything back apart, but it looks like I am going to have to.

The ECTS connector had some green on the termanals so i sprayed some cleaner in them and was trying to use a small screwdriver to scrap it off when I broke it.

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Old 03-29-2011, 08:14 PM   #6
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

I wonder if the stretched chain caused damage or the green ECTS is the reason it would not start. I would wait for the connector and be sure to actually solder the splices. Crimp connectors fail.

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Old 03-29-2011, 09:52 PM   #7
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

The car was still starting great with the streched chain when I took it apart, so i am hoping there wasnt any damage.

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Old 03-29-2011, 10:59 PM   #8
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

I suspect the ECTS is the problem. The engine starts rich and a defective ECTS can flood it right out and it will not start.
The 172 tells you it is swimming in gas...

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Old 04-03-2011, 07:31 PM   #9
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

All fixed and runs like a top! I put the new ECTS on and it didn't make any difference, so i broke down and took the front cover off. I was dead on with the 2 cam gears, but I was 2 or 3 teeth off on the crank sprocket. I fixed the crank sprocket, put everything back togther and it fired right up.

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Old 04-03-2011, 09:52 PM   #10
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

Well, that will make it run rich every time.

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Old 04-04-2011, 01:21 AM   #11
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

Two or three CRANK teeth off??!? It's a wonder it didn't mangle a valve or two, let alone that it started.

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Old 04-04-2011, 08:07 AM   #12
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

It was probably retarded direction so they miss.

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Old 04-04-2011, 10:06 PM   #13
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Default Re: p0172 and hard start after timing chain replaced

Yeah i got lucky that is wasn't alot worse. I know i am getting way to good at pulling that front cover off. lol

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