Front end is still squeaking...

[Xkontour98]

My Wife’s 2004 V6 AWD Vue with 70K has a very annoying squeaking noise coming from the front end. I’ve done a lot of research on the forums and concluded it was probably the strut mounts (it even sounds like it’s coming from that area). It only occurs when coming to a stop. It doesn’t happen over bumps or while driving, only while braking - coming to a complete stop.

I read about quieting the mounts by spraying silicon in them, but that only made the squeak worse. Last week I had my mechanic put in new Monroe struts & mounts (revised mounts) as well as new end-links, and for a very short time there was no squeaking and then it came back (later that day). It’s not quite as bad as before but its there and it drives me crazy!

Does anyone have any suggestions on how I can correct this? I’m going to bring it back to the mechanic after the Holidays and have him take a look at it…..

[far2grumpy]

Originally Posted by Xkontour98

My Wife’s 2004 V6 AWD Vue with 70K has a very annoying squeaking noise coming from the front end. I’ve done a lot of research on the forums and concluded it was probably the strut mounts (it even sounds like it’s coming from that area). It only occurs when coming to a stop. It doesn’t happen over bumps or while driving, only while braking - coming to a complete stop.

I read about quieting the mounts by spraying silicon in them, but that only made the squeak worse. Last week I had my mechanic put in new Monroe struts & mounts (revised mounts) as well as new end-links, and for a very short time there was no squeaking and then it came back (later that day). It’s not quite as bad as before but its there and it drives me crazy!

Does anyone have any suggestions on how I can correct this? I’m going to bring it back to the mechanic after the Holidays and have him take a look at it…..

I've pasted extract from recent post - repost if you'd like more data for any of the listed items.

Common sources of front-end noise:

Strut mounts (DIY - spray silicone fixed my noise)
Stabilizer bar end-links (DIY - parts approx $35 per front side)
Brake caliper guide pins (DIY - lube with bearing grease
Intermediate steering shaft - (DIY - adjust shaft)
Control arm bushing sleeve - (DIY - lube bushing)

[Xkontour98]

Thanks far2grumpy. I’ve seen this list before when I had searched and I don’t think any of these are the source of the issue.

#1 made the noise worse initially
#2 was done with the struts and mounts on Friday.

I don’t think it could be #’s 3-5. Anything is possible I guess, but it seems like I would be hearing this noise at other times opposed to just when coming to a stop… Like I said the noise temporarily went away (couple hours) after everything was replaced…

It really seems like it is coming from the strut mount areas. Other than replacing the mounts/struts, is there anything up there that would cause it to make noise? I was pretty confident the new struts and mounts would take care of this…. ugh

[far2grumpy]

Originally Posted by Xkontour98

Thanks far2grumpy. I’ve seen this list before when I had searched and I don’t think any of these are the source of the issue.

#1 made the noise worse initially
#2 was done with the struts and mounts on Friday.

I don’t think it could be #’s 3-5. Anything is possible I guess, but it seems like I would be hearing this noise at other times opposed to just when coming to a stop… Like I said the noise temporarily went away (couple hours) after everything was replaced…

It really seems like it is coming from the strut mount areas. Other than replacing the mounts/struts, is there anything up there that would cause it to make noise? I was pretty confident the new struts and mounts would take care of this…. ugh

Strut replacement means moving many things around - perhaps another suspension or steering component was manipulated in such a manner to temporarily hush the noise.

BTW - my strut mounts made the most noise when I let the Vue roll forward on level ground and applied sudden brake ... the sudden transfer of weight to front suspension caused what sounded like a "clack" (to me).

However, we know your struts and mounts were properly installed using the very best components - don't we?

I'll attach a few 2004 Vue "noise" service bulletins for you to review. At least one SB is VIN specific so you can quickly determine if it applies.

There's another regarding brake caliper pin lube which I've not yet located.

[far2grumpy]

I'd previously posted the front caliper pin SB - probably won't apply as you indicate the noise occurs with brakes applied.

See post # 2 of following thread:

http://saturnfans3.saturnfans.com/~s...d.php?t=157484

[Xkontour98]

Thanks a lot for all the info!

BTW - my strut mounts made the most noise when I let the Vue roll forward on level ground and applied sudden brake ... the sudden transfer of weight to front suspension caused what sounded like a "clack" (to me).

Yes, that is almost exactly what I am experiencing.... even with the new mounts...

[Xkontour98]

Just received call from mechanic, he's convinced the noise if due to warped rotors... I'm not convinced, but will replace and see what happens....

[far2grumpy]

Originally Posted by Xkontour98

Just received call from mechanic, he's convinced the noise if due to warped rotors... I'm not convinced, but will replace and see what happens....

Its very difficult to "warp" rotors ... the usual problem is uneven build-up of pad material on rotor surface.

Have you actually noticed a pulsation or shimmy in steering wheel when stopping? This is the number one clue rotors are due for turning or replacement.

Did this mechanic change struts and mounts? I've heard the strut mounts must be installed a certain way to assure proper operation.

Something sounds very strange about this operation.

[Xkontour98]

Originally Posted by far2grumpy

Its very difficult to "warp" rotors ... the usual problem is uneven build-up of pad material on rotor surface.

Have you actually noticed a pulsation or shimmy in steering wheel when stopping? This is the number one clue rotors are due for turning or replacement.

Did this mechanic change struts and mounts? I've heard the strut mounts must be installed a certain way to assure proper operation.

Something sounds very strange about this operation.

No, I don't recall any noticeable vibrations/pulsations in the steering wheel, which is why I was skeptical of the rotors being warped. Sure enough though he replaced them and the noise is completely gone! I was pleasantly surprised!

I provided the parts so I had him replace the struts, mounts and end-links. I trust these guys, luckily they were right about the rotors!

If anyone stumbles across this thread, check the rotors!

[What a VUE]

Originally Posted by far2grumpy

Its very difficult to "warp" rotors ... the usual problem is uneven build-up of pad material on rotor surface.

I've never seen that, far2. I would have thought that the rotor/pad combination would be self-cleaning by it's braking action?

My experience is that full-stop panic braking causes spot-hardening of the rotor surface(s) if you come to a complete stop and hold the brake pedal down while stationary. Akin to heat-treating a very localized area on the rotor. The pad hits that hard spot on the rotor and changes the braking dynamics very briefly - and that causes a shudder that feels like the rotor is 'warped.' Only way to get rid of it is to machine or replace the rotor.

Unless a rotor has been dropped, or severely overheated, they just don't warp.

[far2grumpy]

Chuckle ... brake discussions can last forever - I just typed warped rotors in Google and noted over 65,000 hits.

I've "turned" a few rotors in my life and noted - for most part - there were patches of pad adhered here and there.

I think we can agree pads wear and not all the lost material is jettisoned over-board. And where you see heat-treating a localized area on the rotor causes changes in breaking dynamics - I see the super heated pad transferring a minute layer of material to the rotor once the raging beast to brought to a halt.

There's no way I'd say you're wrong and I'm right - lets wait on someone else to tell us we're both wrong.

BTW - great avatar - one mid-life crisis was caused by a double wing of B-52G.

[What a VUE]

Originally Posted by far2grumpy

Chuckle ... brake discussions can last forever - I just typed warped rotors in Google and noted over 65,000 hits.

I've "turned" a few rotors in my life and noted - for most part - there were patches of pad adhered here and there.

I think we can agree pads wear and not all the lost material is jettisoned over-board. And where you see heat-treating a localized area on the rotor causes changes in breaking dynamics - I see the super heated pad transferring a minute layer of material to the rotor once the raging beast to brought to a halt.

There's no way I'd say you're wrong and I'm right - lets wait on someone else to tell us we're both wrong.

BTW - great avatar - one mid-life crisis was caused by a double wing of B-52G.

F2G, you misunderstand, I wasn't arguing - just asking. I literally have never seen excessive buildup of friction material on a rotor. Patches here and there as you say, but nothing I would consider excessive.

I HAVE seen, however, incredible pitting and deep rust on a rotor that no amount of machining could get rid of. Damnedest thing I've ever seen. I literally cut it FAR below minimum just to see if I could clear it off, and was utterly unsuccessful. I've never seen such a porous casting since.

So tell me about the G-model that caused you such consternation.

[far2grumpy]

Originally Posted by What a VUE

F2G, you misunderstand, I wasn't arguing - just asking. I literally have never seen excessive buildup of friction material on a rotor. Patches here and there as you say, but nothing I would consider excessive.

I HAVE seen, however, incredible pitting and deep rust on a rotor that no amount of machining could get rid of. Damnedest thing I've ever seen. I literally cut it FAR below minimum just to see if I could clear it off, and was utterly unsuccessful. I've never seen such a porous casting since.

So tell me about the G-model that caused you such consternation.

I suppose all my brake information is out of date ... I see where many use ceramic pads and other such exotic stuff.

It wasn't just one G-model that ruined my mid-life - I was transferred from a unit primarily equipped with F-4's to a southern US base with 30 bombers.

Each BUFF bristles with ECM stuff and I was maintenance super for EW branch. We were manned at 50% of authorized strength - very few parts - had to take parts from other aircraft to fly daily missions - egads.

I'm still amazed the U.S. recovered from fours years of Jimmie Carter.

[What a VUE]

Originally Posted by far2grumpy

I suppose all my brake information is out of date ... I see where many use ceramic pads and other such exotic stuff.

It wasn't just one G-model that ruined my mid-life - I was transferred from a unit primarily equipped with F-4's to a southern US base with 30 bombers.

Each BUFF bristles with ECM stuff and I was maintenance super for EW branch. We were manned at 50% of authorized strength - very few parts - had to take parts from other aircraft to fly daily missions - egads.

I'm still amazed the U.S. recovered from fours years of Jimmie Carter.

I don't like the ceramic pads on my spousal associate's Camry. They take forever to warm up enough to give good bite into the rotors, and when you need brakes NOW it's a bit disconcerting, takes too much pedal pressure to get satisfactory results. I'll be going back to semi-metallic on that car in the spring, dust be damned.

Read in the news today where the community organizer is fixing to start slashing the defense budget, reduce the number of active-duty warfighters, eliminate weapons platforms and research... Yeah, who needs a strong defense these days.

There were SAC bases all over the south. Give me a hint. Some of my friends were at a few of them, KC-135 (E-models at the time) crew chiefs and boomers, etc.

I stayed in TX for my hitch. Had no desire to travel outside the US.

Yeah, I remember a LOT of bodies leaving the AF during the Carter years, and again during the Clinton years. Why risk your life for an administration that doesn't care if you're poorly paid, on food-stamps and living in sub-standard housing? True story: when the navy de-commissioned a lot of the enlisted family quarters at NAVBASE Pearl Harbor on the north side of Nimitz Highway, they gave the units to the city of Honolulu - free and clear - for subsidized housing use. The city refused it because most of the units were in such bad shape that if they were privately owned, they'd have been condemned as unfit/unsafe for habitation. They were tearing them down when I left O'ahu in '95.

[far2grumpy]

The base was Barksdale AFB - Bossier City, LA.

Good base and nice city under normal circumstances.

[XRL]

One thing I've noticed with the brakes is that they're very prone to forming surface layers of rust. Especially down here in humid, salty Florida. Every day I go out to my car and there's a very small layer of rust on my rotors, happened with my OEMs, happens with my new R1s. It goes away after a stop from 20+ mph, but it is rather obnoxious when I leave the complex. Oh well.

Grumpy, you're 100% right about not all he material being thrown far away. My rotors are cross drilled and there's little bits of stuff (actually I think it's the metal from the rotors mostly) that end up on and around the cross drilled parts. I have ceramic pads which dust a different (almost invisible) color. That's the best part about the ceramic pads, your wheels don't get absurdly dirty very quickly. I haven't noticed the heating up issues, then again, I have a short stop and go trip out of the complex so that might be enough to warm them up down here in FL.

My gf's PT Cruiser has metallic pads on it still, and they make her wheels look NASTY after a few days of driving. Can't wait to put some ceramics on that car just to make them look nicer, but she doesn't drive very much so it takes time for them to wear down (good news is, she's almost getting low on those damn OEM pads). FWIW, her pads at 50k look MUCH worse than my pads at 100k were. My OEMs looked like they were brand new when I replaced my pads and rotors. My rotors however, were totally trashed.

[What a VUE]

Originally Posted by far2grumpy

The base was Barksdale AFB - Bossier City, LA.

Good base and nice city under normal circumstances.

Did you get my PM?

[far2grumpy]

Originally Posted by What a VUE

Did you get my PM?

Yes sir ... got the PM ... twice!

BTW ... we referred to Richards-Gebaur as "Dicky Goober" and was never sure if the nickname was considered derogatory. We sure hoped so.

[What a VUE]

Originally Posted by far2grumpy

Yes sir ... got the PM ... twice!

BTW ... we referred to Richards-Gebaur as "Dicky Goober" and was never sure if the nickname was considered derogatory. We sure hoped so.

Hahahaha!