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Old 09-05-2019, 03:33 PM   #1
ZuluKono
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2000 SC1
Default Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

-2000 SC1

-Cannot turn key at all,
so unable to get to accessory
position for cylinder removal.

-This is not a jiggle-the-steering-
wheel situation, it's just stuck.

Suggestions welcome.
Thanks in advance.

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Old 09-05-2019, 04:24 PM   #2
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Check this thread and see if it applies, or helps:
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=232149

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Old 09-05-2019, 05:19 PM   #3
ZuluKono
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Thanks!
Yeah, I've already read through that and eight other threads like it.
What I'm hoping is that somebody has the solution already.
This is sort of a throw-away car, and rather than spend much more time reading threads,
my next solution will be to eliminate the lock cylinder by brute force.

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Old 09-05-2019, 05:54 PM   #4
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

If you trash it then passlock will shut it down permanently. It can be drilled so it can be removed and replaced with a new properly coded cylinder.

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Old 09-05-2019, 05:56 PM   #5
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

This is why you want to replace your key every few years and keep a virgin key to make copies from. As the key wears it rubs away on the pins which eventually jam. A little graphite lube helps too. At this point you're beyond that. But future reference.

-Robert

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Old 09-05-2019, 07:24 PM   #6
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Flush out the lock cylinder with CRC Electrical Cleaner until the waste fluid becomes clear. It'll flow from the bottom of the steering wheel shroud so have a tray on your lap to catch it. Next, try using a new key coded from VIN by a GM dealer (or locksmith), if it still doesn't turn, with the key in the ignition and applying pressure to turn to ACC tap the end of the key will a small rubber mallet or coated screwdriver handle. It may take several minutes but shocking the key will usually get it to turn. When you get it into ACC position then remove the cylinder. Don't mess with it anymore...just replace it.

When you get a new key from the dealer ask for the tumbler coding. This is what they use to make the new key and they can print it out. You will need it to set the tumblers in the new lock cylinder.

...
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Old 09-05-2019, 08:49 PM   #7
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

ZuluKono, GM installed Passlock anti theft to Saturn starting with models made in 2000. Security is enabled/disabled with the remote while locking/unlocking doors. The security light blinks once every few seconds when enabled, flashes quickly when theft is detected. When security flashes, Passlock disables injector operation - the starter can crank the engine all day but without injectors the engine will never fire up. As shown in drawings, three components make up Passlock; pcm, bcm and Passlock sensor. The sensor detects ignition lock cylinder rotation to determine a go/no go situation with the ignition key turning the ignition lock cylinder. If the ignition lock cylinder is removed, Passlock will not detect lock cylinder rotation and disable injectors (flashing security). A resistor, if I'm not mistaken is embedded into the ignition switch with a discrete voltage sent to the bcm along with Passlock sensor signals to determine whether or not to allow normal startup. Over the years, some say cutting the white wire disables Passlock but no guarantees this forever. Passlock is a program in the bcm and pcm so it cannot be programmed out/disabled with software.

It would be wiser to figure out from suggestions given to loosen the seized lock cylinder to remove it for repair while not damaging the Passlock sensor assembly or disrupting the way Passlock requires ignition switch/lock cylinder rotation sensing.
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Old 09-06-2019, 11:55 AM   #8
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Thanks for all the input!
One thing I failed to mention is that I live in the country
over an hour away from a GM dealer (I've never gone
to a car dealership in my life and don't intend to start
now) or any place where I can run quick errands.
I really wanted to like this car, especially since it runs so
good (when it runs), but I'm pretty sure I hate it at this point
(the hate started to sprout when I learned
I had to remove a tire to do an oil change).
Never had this problem with any car ever,
and I've owned many dozens of cars.
Thanks again, I've read every response
at least once and appreciate them all!

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Old 09-06-2019, 12:41 PM   #9
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Why do you remove the tire to do an oil change?

-Robert

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Old 09-06-2019, 12:54 PM   #10
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder Will Not Turn

This lock cylinder issue is pretty common on GM vehicles and is caused dirt and metal dust from repeated key insertions. The electrical cleaner flushes out the dirt and grime and evaporates pretty quickly. The dirt and grime prevents the tumblers from sitting in the right place when the key is inserted.

You can try what I suggested with your existing key but I imagine that it is pretty worn. If your second key is not used and still in good shape then use it.

I should also clarify that a key made by VIN at the dealer only costs about $15; probably the same or a bit less from a locksmith.

All cars have quirks and it's just a matter of what you're willing to endure. I personally have had great experiences with the S Series over the 27 years I've been driving them.

...
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2012 Ford Focus SEL HB MT
2011 Suburban LT

Past Saturns
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1993 SW2 AT (10y)
2001 LW200 MT (3.5y)
1992 SL2 MT (5y)

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Old 09-06-2019, 01:14 PM   #11
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertGary1 View Post
Why do you remove the tire to do an oil change?
-Robert
I'd also like to know. Maybe I've been doing it wrong for the last twenty years!

...
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Old 09-06-2019, 01:52 PM   #12
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertGary1 View Post
Why do you remove the tire to do an oil change?

-Robert
You don't have to remove the tire, but I find it is easier to reach the filter from the wheel well than underneath. There is even a removable access cover in the passenger wheel well (held on by a tab, a guide pin, and push-pin) so you don't have to remove the whole liner.

It's not unique to Saturn - my previous car, Ford ZX2, had the oil filter in the same spot. I hated changing the oil in that car (that was before I found about removing the tire, so don't know how easy it was to reach the Ford filter from the wheel well)

My favorite was my '02 minivan. Oil filter was right up front, could reach under and remove it without even jacking the car up, and plenty of space for a huge oversized fillter

...
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Old 09-06-2019, 02:01 PM   #13
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

I always drive up on ramps. Pretty easy to reach from underneath in my opinion. My 2006 Dodge Ram is super easy to get to everything with no jacks or ramps. Doesn't make the 11 MPG worth it though.

...
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Old 09-06-2019, 02:38 PM   #14
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertGary1 View Post
Why do you remove the tire to do an oil change?
Because the oil filter is located behind a splash-guard in the passenger-side wheel well.

...
All GM, all the time.

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Old 09-06-2019, 03:51 PM   #15
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Quote:
Originally Posted by Waiex191 View Post
I always drive up on ramps. Pretty easy to reach from underneath in my opinion.
That's something I don't have in my garage - ramps

Had a bad experience when I was younger - overshot a metal ramp. Don't recall the details, but I wasn't interested in ramps for a long time. It's been a few decades since, though, so maybe it is time to give ramps another try. Always thought those Rhino Ramps looked interesting.

I considered buying ramps briefly when I was doing the trailing arm as I was having a hard time getting the rear high enough for the impact to fit under there.

First, I need to clean out my garage to make space.

We went with a 20x24 garage to save money - should have splurged on 24x24. We had lots of room the first few years but stuff started accumulating.

...
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Old 09-06-2019, 04:10 PM   #16
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Quote:
Originally Posted by alordofchaos View Post
That's something I don't have in my garage - ramps

Had a bad experience when I was younger - overshot a metal ramp. Don't recall the details, but I wasn't interested in ramps for a long time. It's been a few decades since, though, so maybe it is time to give ramps another try. Always thought those Rhino Ramps looked interesting.
My dad has metal ramps and hasn't used them in years. He always had issues with the car pushing one or the other, rather than driving up onto it. I think I had the same issue, when I tried them. I did buy some plastic ramps... Rhino maybe? I've never had that issue with them. I suspect it's because they're one piece. I have driven off the back with my truck in 4-lo.... it shoved the ramp into the ground when the weight was concentrated on the edge

In short, I think the plastic ramps work well, but the old steel ramps do not. My dad asked me if I wanted his steel ramps awhile back, and I declined.

...
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1999 Chevy K3500

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Old 09-06-2019, 04:23 PM   #17
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Quote:
Originally Posted by alordofchaos View Post
Had a bad experience when I was younger - overshot a metal ramp.
Me too - up and over. To make it better it was late at night, I landed on the trouble light cord and blew out the fuse in the garage so everything went pitch black. Same ramps I have today, though back then they were my dad's. You know what they say about getting back on the horse...


...
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Old 09-07-2019, 04:03 PM   #18
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Iíve been using ramps for 30 years. Once I drove over them but it was easy to get it out after raising with a jack.

Getting under the car is a great time to look everything over, check tor leaks, inspect steering hoses etc

-Robert

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Old 09-07-2019, 11:29 PM   #19
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

So I gather that the filter can easier be accessed
from underneath the car when it's up on ramps.
Good to know.
Never really trusted those steel ramps,
and the plastic ones are, to me, a ridiculous joke.
I've been planning to make my own out of wood,
so I guess I need to get 'er done by my next oil change.

Concerning the lock cylinder, it's a bust.
Drilling it out was my last resort,
and I wasn't able to do it without damaging the housing.
Ordered a new housing and cylinder off Amazon.
And the nickel-and-diming begins.

...
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Old 09-08-2019, 10:22 PM   #20
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Default Re: Ignition Lock Cylinder WIll Not Turn

Hopefully after repairs, you'll have a reliable car. However, as a new member, are you aware of the infamous factory coolant sensor failures? The tell tale indicators are the temperature gauge needle hovers over the 1/4 mark and engine overheats with the cooling fan never turning on. Removing and examining the coolant sensor is the only way to identify which one is used if you're the second or third owner. The factory round nosed one is plastic and cracks, sending incorrect signals as if the engine was freezing so the pcm runs a rich mixture all the time. The cure is replacing the original sensor with a flat nosed brass one. Engine starting becomes more familiar with instant starting in summer or winter, temps rise to either the 3/8 or 1/2 mark. When hot, the cooling fan will turn on (beyond 3/4 or redline). Another related failure is the thermostat melting it's rubber gasket and allowing coolant to circulate with coolant never warning up. Replacing the t-stat solves this problem. Or if you have a reader, display warm engine temps - above 185F is good, below that replace the t-stat.

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