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Old 03-03-2019, 09:22 PM   #21
GTS350
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn Night View Post
https://www.consumerreports.org/car-...for-fire-risk/

Usually, I don't recall automakers recalling vehicles, when they don't have
a problem.

As I have stated, many times, for what you pay for a BMW, their build quality should be far better than the build quality of our S-Series.
There is one YouTube video, of a 1993 SL2, that flipped its odometer from 999,999 to 000,000. It has an MP7 automatic, too.
Does anybody recall that time, that BMW made with "German precision and quality", made it to 1 million miles?
Yeah, neither do I.......
This is just plain ignorance. Do you know anything about automobile manufacturing? Every manufacture has recalls including Saturn which like every other manufacturer has several open recalls at any time. Its part of manufacturing a car. I don't believe ANY manufacturer has never had a recall.

You would think with all your internet trolling you would know that Mobile 1 ran an advertising campaign with a BMW in which they ran a BMW for 1 million miles then took it apart to prove it was still within specifications. They chose the brand because they are known for their longevity. There are several BMWs with 1 million miles.
Which proves you donít even try to find the truth you search till you find something you agree with, reguardless of the facts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn Night View Post
Your thoughts that a BMW is somehow a "better" quality car, for what you paid for it and because you own one, is exactly why you are getting offended.
First off I would NEVER be offended by something YOU say.
Don't confuse "thoughts" with "facts"
When you say your opinion about a line of vehicles based on nothing more than what you read or saw on you tube that is a very uneducated "thought" based on being nothing more then an internet troll.
When I give my opinion on BMWs its based on ownership, working on and driving several 100 thousand miles both leisurely as well as competitively in various BMWs. Those are facts.
Secondly I never said that BMW is somehow a "better" quality car. I said you don't know what your talking about when you condemn an entire line of vehicles when you know nothing about them, you haven't even driven one.
Unlike you I don't state opinions about other manufactured vehicles unless I have personal experience with that automobile. Because I am smart enough to know that would be ignorant.
I guess you're the person who would go to a dealer and say "I read great things on the internet about your car I'll buy it - I don't need to drive it." Do you buy your clothes the same way if so I read on the internet that these are the latest fashions (see picture below) Personally I think you would look nice in the last one, the tie really ties it together. How about a house? Do you have it checked out by someone who might know more than you? Or do you just make sure its made of bricks since you read about these 3 pigs?
If you were smart you would try to listen and possibly learn something, instead of feeling a need to bad mouth other manufacturers based on nothing more than your internet searches.
It is better to remain silent and thought a fool then to speak and remove all doubt. Talking with other on this forum, I can assure you, that you have definitely removed all doubt.
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Old 03-04-2019, 02:13 AM   #22
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTS350 View Post
This is just plain ignorance. Do you know anything about automobile manufacturing? Every manufacture has recalls including Saturn which like every other manufacturer has several open recalls at any time. Its part of manufacturing a car. I don't believe ANY manufacturer has never had a recall.

You would think with all your internet trolling you would know that Mobile 1 ran an advertising campaign with a BMW in which they ran a BMW for 1 million miles then took it apart to prove it was still within specifications. They chose the brand because they are known for their longevity. There are several BMWs with 1 million miles.
Which proves you donít even try to find the truth you search till you find something you agree with, reguardless of the facts.



First off I would NEVER be offended by something YOU say.
Don't confuse "thoughts" with "facts"
When you say your opinion about a line of vehicles based on nothing more than what you read or saw on you tube that is a very uneducated "thought" based on being nothing more then an internet troll.
When I give my opinion on BMWs its based on ownership, working on and driving several 100 thousand miles both leisurely as well as competitively in various BMWs. Those are facts.
Secondly I never said that BMW is somehow a "better" quality car. I said you don't know what your talking about when you condemn an entire line of vehicles when you know nothing about them, you haven't even driven one.
Unlike you I don't state opinions about other manufactured vehicles unless I have personal experience with that automobile. Because I am smart enough to know that would be ignorant.
I guess you're the person who would go to a dealer and say "I read great things on the internet about your car I'll buy it - I don't need to drive it." Do you buy your clothes the same way if so I read on the internet that these are the latest fashions (see picture below) Personally I think you would look nice in the last one, the tie really ties it together. How about a house? Do you have it checked out by someone who might know more than you? Or do you just make sure its made of bricks since you read about these 3 pigs?
If you were smart you would try to listen and possibly learn something, instead of feeling a need to bad mouth other manufacturers based on nothing more than your internet searches.
It is better to remain silent and thought a fool then to speak and remove all doubt. Talking with other on this forum, I can assure you, that you have definitely removed all doubt.
For somebody who isn't so offended, you sure get riled up at my comments towards BMW being overpriced junk.

And a car that is purposely maintained to 1,000,000 miles as an ad campaign technique versus a daily driver that makes 1,000,000 miles without any media attention is comparing "Apples to Oranges"

Saturn didn't have recalls for failing water pumps that resulted in blown engines.

Saturn did not get a class-action lawsuit for excessive oil consumption complaints being filed, because Saturn acknowledged the issue with a TSB, while BMW executives flat out LIED in their statement that "engines are supposed to burn oil", while selling a trunk-mounted carrying case for extra oil jugs.

Of course, if BMW wasn't busy getting sued for oil consumption issues, which I'm sure has nothing to do with their frivolous claims that you only need to change the oil every year or 10,000 miles(only an idiot believes such nonsense), they probably wouldn't need to advertise a car that went 1,000,000 miles.

I know that Saturn never needed to do that. Maybe because the build quality speaks for itself.

Since there are so many BMWs with 1,000,000 miles, start digging up the YouTube videos of BMW daily driver videos of it, not the ad car that was specifically maintained(likely at no-cost to the owner, so BMW could claim bragging rights).

cgg already posted the 1993 SL2 hitting one million, a while back. Guy recorded it with his cellphone.

Is it true that BMW will give you free German Shepard, with every BMW vehicle purchase?

They should, that way you have a companion to walk home with you, while waiting for the tow truck......

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"He checks the gas, and fills the oil....."

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Old 03-04-2019, 02:23 AM   #23
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Actually, I am the person a dealer does NOT want to see on their lot, because I will know what the problems are with the junk they will try to pawn off off on somebody that doesn't know anything about cars.

My favorite time, was when I went to the local Chevy dealership, back in 2009.(Right after O'Bailout gave GM all our tax dollars, and they became Government Motors LLC).

Salesman tried selling my brother a Ford Windstar(which are known for fracturing the rear, solid-beam axle in half, because of cheap steel & rust), a Buick Park Avenue with no coolant in it(cracked, plastic upper intake plenum), and a few other cars that my brother didn't like, because he needed something that could haul 3 kids around).

Finally, they financed him on a 2002 Honda Odyssey, with 126k miles. They wanted to install a GPS locator, in case he defaulted on the loan. I looked at the loan manager and said, "Why are you worried about him defaulting on the loan? If he defaults on the loan, can't your bank just call the President and get bailed out like they did last time?"

Truth hurts, sometimes.....

And I know a lot about automotive manufacturing. My family is rich because of their engineering failures. In the used parts business, you only sell the parts that break on a regular basis, like BMW engines that over heat from poorly-designed water pumps and excessive oil consumption.....

Cadillac Northstar engines made us rich, too.....something about constant issues with head gasket failures from Dex-Cool....
And Chrysler automatic transmissions, THOSE ARE A GOLD MINE!!!!!.....

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Old 03-04-2019, 02:28 AM   #24
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

And you do not have to say that you think BMWs are better quality, in a direct statement.

Your attitude towards the topic and my accurate comments about BMW issues, say it, without you saying it.

I made a personal goal, at the age of 15, to understand women. To do this, you have to be VERY SKILLED at what women will say, without them directly saying it. Anyone that is married likely understands the concept I am speaking of.

The concept of "reading between the lines" doesn't just apply to dealing with only females. It can be used to deal with pretty much any person, as we all say things by our attitude and behavior, without speaking the words.

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Old 03-04-2019, 03:34 AM   #25
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

I can honestly say I didn't read a word of your last novel (posts) I didn't want to waste my time when I could be reading something with more substance like Everybody Poops.
I was going to suggest someone read it for me and give me the cliff notes but I didn't want to subject anyone to THAT and I'm pretty sure its the same uninformed ramblings that we've all grown to expect from you. Plus, that would mean someone would have to read that mess.
I don't know why but it appears your like Nancy Pelosi trying to make up for ignorance with volume. An intelligent individual would realize that's the opposite of what they should do, when they have no idea what they're talking about.
I'll say it again:
It is better to remain silent and thought a fool then to speak and remove all doubt.

...
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1996 BMW E36
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Old 03-04-2019, 02:39 PM   #26
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
A 4-stroke, Otto gas engine should NOT burn oil.
nit-pick - it WILL burn oil, but the amount will vary from "barely measurable between oil changes" to "adding oil every few days"

Quote:
A rotary engine will burn oil, because its design will not prevent oil from leaking into the combustion chambers.
Wasn't from leaking (main/sump oil completely separate); the oil was needed to lubricate the apex seals.

the "combustion chamber" of a rotary would get no other oil, otherwise.

From Wikipedia
Quote:
. . . the sump oil remains uncontaminated by the combustion process, so no oil changes are required. The oil in the mainshaft is totally sealed from the combustion process.

The oil for Apex seals and crankcase lubrication is separate. In piston engines the crankcase oil is contaminated by combustion blow-by through the piston rings

...
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11/2016 red 2002 5 spd SC2 141k DD
7/2010 Craigslist white 1997 SC2 project
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Old 03-05-2019, 07:08 PM   #27
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn Night View Post
How much does that Auto-Rx run you? I am planning a rebuild of my original engine, with pistons that have the drain back holes cast in them.

As far as cost, if it means the engine will stay clean, lean, mean gas burning machine, I am considering that cost justifies the use, as I have learned that proper maintenance costs always outweigh the costs of a full breakdown in the automotive world.
To be honest, I don't remember the per-bottle cost. I still have one bottle left from the last time I bought, which was a couple of years ago. From what I recall it's generally around $25/bottle and I usually buy 3 bottles at a time for my own cost+shipping price-per-bottle buy ratio. I think they might also have discounts for military veterans.

If you're starting with a clean & rebuilt engine they have "maintenance dose" instructions that use less than their cleanup doses. But if it were me, I'd probably just always use a 5W-40 oil and not worry about it, especially since your new pistons will have the drain back holes. I think Mobil's Delvac 1 5W-40 still uses esters for additive miscibility, which would provide the same effects as adding Auto-Rx.

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Old 03-05-2019, 08:00 PM   #28
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn Night View Post
How much does that Auto-Rx run you? I am planning a rebuild of my original engine, with pistons that have the drain back holes cast in them.

As far as cost, if it means the engine will stay clean, lean, mean gas burning machine, I am considering that cost justifies the use, as I have learned that proper maintenance costs always outweigh the costs of a full breakdown in the automotive world.
In a fresh rebuild you do not need to be spending the $$ on AutoRx. AutoRx is a good product designed to be added to a group 2 or 3 Mineral based oil. The effectiveness is degraded when added to a true PAO based oil. You can verify this by carefully reading the AutoRx site.

I have more than 80,000 miles on a rebuilt engine and it still consumes zero oil between oil changes. Those oil changes are between 8000 and 14,000 miles. I would suggest either 5w-30 Amsoil Signature Series or Amsoil 5w-30 Series 3000 Heavy Duty Diesel oil. No additives. I can still read the magic marker notes I made on the tops of the pistons during assembly.

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Old 03-06-2019, 12:26 PM   #29
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eiron View Post
To be honest, I don't remember the per-bottle cost. I still have one bottle left from the last time I bought, which was a couple of years ago. From what I recall it's generally around $25/bottle and I usually buy 3 bottles at a time for my own cost+shipping price-per-bottle buy ratio. I think they might also have discounts for military veterans.

If you're starting with a clean & rebuilt engine they have "maintenance dose" instructions that use less than their cleanup doses. But if it were me, I'd probably just always use a 5W-40 oil and not worry about it, especially since your new pistons will have the drain back holes. I think Mobil's Delvac 1 5W-40 still uses esters for additive miscibility, which would provide the same effects as adding Auto-Rx.
Ok. I'll look into the Delvac, when this comes to pass. Thanks for the suggestion, Eiron. I appreciate the work you showed us, with your own engine, as well.

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Old 03-06-2019, 01:30 PM   #30
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Auto RX pricing is based on how many bottles you buy. It's under $20 buying a single bottle, goes down to under $16 if buying 3 or more. I don't remember if shipping is included or not, which may change the final per-bottle cost.

...
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Old 03-06-2019, 01:51 PM   #31
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn Night View Post
Ok. I'll look into the Delvac, when this comes to pass. Thanks for the suggestion, Eiron. I appreciate the work you showed us, with your own engine, as well.
I would suggest taking a hard look at current test results for any oil you decide to use. You only have 1 single change to get it right. Using a 40 weight oil in properly rebuilt engine will end up frying the oil to a hard carbon and varnish.

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Old 03-07-2019, 01:36 AM   #32
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by alordofchaos View Post
Auto RX pricing is based on how many bottles you buy. It's under $20 buying a single bottle, goes down to under $16 if buying 3 or more. I don't remember if shipping is included or not, which may change the final per-bottle cost.
Yeah, I always figure my per-item costs including shipping. And their unit costs might be different now than when I last bought mine. Less than $16/bottle sounds like a really good price to me!

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Old 03-07-2019, 01:46 AM   #33
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldNuc View Post
I would suggest taking a hard look at current test results for any oil you decide to use. You only have 1 single change to get it right. Using a 40 weight oil in properly rebuilt engine will end up frying the oil to a hard carbon and varnish.
I agree, everyone should make decisions based on valid data whenever possible. Which test results would provide meaningful information supporting your claims of generating hard carbon and varnish? And why do you say there's only one single chance to get it right when there's data showing evidence to the contrary?

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Old 03-07-2019, 07:27 AM   #34
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Just go with the Kreen.

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Old 03-07-2019, 10:54 AM   #35
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eiron View Post
Yeah, I always figure my per-item costs including shipping. And their unit costs might be different now than when I last bought mine. Less than $16/bottle sounds like a really good price to me!
Was it called Auto-RX Plus when you bought it? I hadn't looked at it in a while and wasn't sure how long they called it "Plus"

Might try the Kreen again in the future. Has to be relatively fresh, though. I did not realize last time I bought it that Kreen has roughly a 2-year shelf life. Not sure how old my can was, when I used it.

...
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Old 03-07-2019, 02:11 PM   #36
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
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Was it called Auto-RX Plus when you bought it? I hadn't looked at it in a while and wasn't sure how long they called it "Plus"
Yeah, the last bottle I still have says "Plus" on it. I don't know when they added that to the name, but I'm not convinced the formula is any different from what it was before the name change. I can't readily find any info that explains the name change.

I thought Kreen was a blend of solvents? The only reason I can think of that a sealed container would have any kind shelf life is because of unequal evaporation of some of the volatile compounds. I'm not comfortable with solvents in my crankcase, so I prefer using ARx in the oil. I can see using Kreen as a piston soak or adding to the gas tank, though.

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Old 03-07-2019, 02:22 PM   #37
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Thanks, I was thinking evaporation, too. They currently list a proprietary ingredient that I don't think was listed in previous Kreen formulations

http://www.kanolabs.com/MSDS2015/Kre...0SDS%20(2).pdf

edit, I take that back. Proprietery ingredient is just listed at a different location

...
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Old 03-07-2019, 02:36 PM   #38
Pitcher
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1998 SC2
Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

I'm running 3-4 year old Kreen in my Oil & Gas right now.

Insane increase in throttle response.

Oil is nice & black now too.

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Castrol Edge EP + M1 Ext Perf. Oil Filter.

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Old 03-11-2019, 12:25 PM   #39
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1995 SC2
Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eiron View Post
I agree, everyone should make decisions based on valid data whenever possible. Which test results would provide meaningful information supporting your claims of generating hard carbon and varnish? And why do you say there's only one single chance to get it right when there's data showing evidence to the contrary?
I think it has to do with seating the rings and break-in period. The shop told me the honing process will seat the rings, fine. I have read a few articles about using incorrect oil on rebuilt engines causing issues, so I asked them about it. He said it was more because of the camshafts, than the rings, but I am not taking any chances. Last time I didn't head OldNuc's advice, I went from 1qt/200 miles to 1qt/80 miles and burnt an exhaust valve.

I still gotta order the pistons and prep the block for delivery to the shop. Won't take long to remove my water pump and sensors, but for now, I need new hub bearings, tires, and two new front struts. Ohio potholes and the car has always had a thud that I though was a tie-rod or LCA, but the tie-rod end is newer and the LCA has been replaced by me.

I do appreciate the advice. Please do not fight amongst yourselves on this debate. That was not my intent for asking or commenting.

...
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"He checks the gas, and fills the oil....."

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Old 03-11-2019, 12:45 PM   #40
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Default Re: Well darn, my '99 SL2 laps oil like a BMW

It is very easy to see who is not interested in wading through insanely long documents and appear to be immune from observing hard physical evidence.

This is a running continually updated document and all historical info is preserved. Beware that it was correct in the opinion of the author when written but may be entirely incorrect today.

https://540ratblog.wordpress.com/

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