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Old 02-19-2019, 02:43 AM   #1
Toasterbath
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Default More of my dumb research...

Okay, so i have alot of questions.
Does the sl corner better under speed then the sc?
Will a awd fit in this car or will rwd fit?
Can a sl be rally crossed?
Is there any good quality body kits for the sl that dont look rice?
Can a boxer fit in the engine bay without too much work?
Can the sl chassis take alot of power or beating from off roading.
My vr6 idea was loosing my attention.

Last edited by Toasterbath; 02-19-2019 at 02:44 AM.. Reason: My phone has small keyboard

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Old 02-19-2019, 08:48 AM   #2
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

I don't remember the RWD transmission that mostly bolts onto the LLO but I believe the 240SX axle fits pretty good width wise.

The H4 should fit pretty good under the hood & between the frame rails (IIRC when I measured it was about the same side spacing as in the Impreza, tight but workable). 1st gen Impreza's have the same wheelbase as 1st gen SC's; the Legacy's are a few inch's longer than the rest of the S-Series.

It'd be fun to find out the Subaru strut & knuckle bolts onto the S-Series frame, so far I think people have only put the struts onto the S-Series knuckle (but you'll need to swap out the engine cradle anyway so it doesn't really matter). It'll take quite a bit of custom fab to get the Subaru front and rear cradles to fit with space for the driveshaft and shifter linkage (solid rod shifted, no cables).

10 years ago both S-Series & Subaru's were a dime a dozen up here, now despite the overhyped head gasket issue's and major rusting issue's only Subaru's are still a dime a dozen. I'd hate to hack up a perfectly good 1st gen SC, but the end result just might be worth it.

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Old 02-19-2019, 11:41 AM   #3
Toasterbath
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

I have i have 3rd gen sl that i was gonna do this to.
The engine in my car had heat stroke.
Also how is scary a s series when it has double the power?

Last edited by Toasterbath; 02-19-2019 at 11:45 AM.. Reason: Toasters in baths are great (dont fo it)

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Old 02-20-2019, 04:08 PM   #4
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toasterbath View Post
Also how is scary a s series when it has double the power?
When you have to change the transmission every 2 months, it's scary.

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Old 02-21-2019, 01:29 PM   #5
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toasterbath View Post
I have i have 3rd gen sl that i was gonna do this to.
The engine in my car had heat stroke.
Also how is scary a s series when it has double the power?
It depends on the transmission you are running. The autos can't handle more than about 200hp(from the reading I have done on the subject because I have an automatic), before the clutches start slipping.

The manual transmissions are fairly robust, so even building the stock engine for very high power tends to not hurt the manual.

If you are going with a turbo build, the MP2 from the SOHC will have the wider gearing and is better suited for a turbo built Saturn 1.9L engine.

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Old 02-22-2019, 11:56 AM   #6
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

I am taking a subaru boxer engine, pumping 500hp(goal) in my sl2.
So how scary is a saturn with 500hp.
Does a sl corner better then a sc2.
And this saturn of mine will be getting awd from a impreza or wrx.

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Old 02-22-2019, 12:22 PM   #7
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

How old are you and do you have much mechanical experience under your belt?

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Old 02-22-2019, 01:17 PM   #8
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

^ Age is no longer a prerequisite for intelligence. Brain functions of highly intelligent people somehow separate physical age from their superior cranial aptitudes.

You've probably seen the news of a 12 yr old boy from Memphis, Tenn successfully creating a fusion reactor from eBay parts, spending his parents $10,000 to make one. His interest came from reading about another young man his age to create a fusion reactor. Sensationalism aside, these home made reactors only demonstrate the ability to start a fusion reactor but technically cannot contain the reaction to generate more power than is required to begin fusion. In other words, these reactors use power to start the fusion process but cannot complete it. Great headlines but not so different from billions spent attempting fusion power to have another form of energy generation to supplement the national electrical grid using coal, natural gas, nuclear, solar and wind. Fusion reactors quietly went away due to problems of containing the reaction to self sustaining status and using the energy given off to generate steam to power electrical generators.

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Old 02-22-2019, 03:10 PM   #9
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toasterbath View Post
I am taking a subaru boxer engine, pumping 500hp(goal) in my sl2.
I'm pretty sure that won't work. Subaru EJ20 Quad cam dimensions
Quote:
width = 830 mm = 32.7"
from outside edges of cam covers

height = 600 mm = 23.62"
from bottom of sump to top of intake manifold/throttle body

length = 430 mm = 17"
front pulley to back of motor, not including flywheel
This does not include any space for turbo or intercooler, plumbing, etc

I have not measured the Saturn engine bay but it looks to be less that 3' between the strut towers.

The reason AlexofNazareth asked the question is, people who are actually capable of doing this kind of mod don't ask the kinds of questions you are asking . . . they are measuring and planning the mod, and not relying on others to tell them, "oh, yeah, that will be bad ass"

You are looking at a lot of metal fab work and a fair amount of expense. Can you weld and shape metal?

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Old 02-25-2019, 01:19 AM   #10
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

The reason why i am asking questions is because i moved away from my saturn and i am getting info so when i get my saturn again i can go straight to work.
Is the kid from memphic the nuclear boy scout?
Im am under the age for driving in my provice, ill give you that much.
I want to learn how mechanic's work with this build, as i lost my father last year and dont have anybody to learn from.
The plan for this car is reliability and to be able to go rallying, i am probably asking for to much.

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Old 02-25-2019, 01:21 AM   #11
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Also i own a welder.
So the engine mounts wont be a issue.

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Old 02-25-2019, 06:31 AM   #12
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Taylor Wilson was the young man who created a fusion reactor at home. He succeeded in creating fusion but failed in containing it.

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Old 02-25-2019, 10:26 AM   #13
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Sorry to hear about the loss of your father. We will try to help answer your questions and guide you in the right direction with your endeavours.

The honest answer we can give you is not to attempt doing this to a Saturn. You would be better off sticking with the Subaru platform and moving forward with modifying that.

Unless you simply welded a Saturn frame to the subaru's frame, you would need to deal with several other challenges that most people with decades of experience in auto-mechanics would shy away from attempting. There's only so much a "can-do" attitude can accomplish without experience to back it up.

Our advice would be to start small and work your way up from there. Rallycrossing a cheap Subaru will be much more fun than an S-series.

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Old 02-25-2019, 03:47 PM   #14
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

I would suggest not worrying about the car for now as it would be a waste of time and money, but focus on the most important factor - the driver.

Find and join a legitimate club, analogous to the SCCA and learn to drive. Not just the kind of thing you need to get a license, but high performance driving.

Then you can worry about more power, cornering, etc., and it will not be wasted because you will hopefully be a good enough driver to take advantage of it.

Driving a 100 hp at 99% of its capability is more fun and takes more skill than driving a 500 hp car at 20%


Not saying this to be mean - I've had a license for four decades, owned over 35 cars including 2 Porsches, and I am not a good enough performance driver to take full advantage of a 500 hp car. You have to know your own limits before you can explore the limits of your machine.

You can wrap yourself around a tree with 100 hp but you can do it more easily with 500 hp.

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Old 02-26-2019, 07:25 PM   #15
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toasterbath View Post
I am taking a subaru boxer engine, pumping 500hp(goal) in my sl2.
So how scary is a saturn with 500hp.
Does a sl corner better then a sc2.
And this saturn of mine will be getting awd from a impreza or wrx.
Might want to ask SeanR, as he has a 400+ HP, LS4 V8 swapped into his 1999 SL1 & it is mated to a Cavalier J-Body 5-speed manual.

Personally, because of reliability issues, I would stay away from the Subaru engines.

They are known for blown head gaskets, because in order for Subaru to get the WRX stock power output so high, they have to run almost 20psi of boost on an engine with only 0.1L of more displacement than our Saturn engines have.

A lot of the newer Subaru engines are prone to destroying the pistons as well.

...
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"He checks the gas, and fills the oil....."

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Old 02-27-2019, 12:05 AM   #16
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

I was thinking lowering my hp to 300.
Would they let a person under 16 drive a rally car?
I would build the engine for power and reliability.
I kinda want to do this to my saturn, at least give it AWD so it can be happy during winter.
I had the idea way back to put a rotary in my saturn so i would say this is kinda a step up for reliability.
Is there any mods to make the stock motor a lot more powerful and work?
Is a Saturn a good rally platform?

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Old 02-27-2019, 10:00 AM   #17
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

You need to start with smaller goals and work your way up. We can appreciate your enthusiasm as we have all been in your shoes. You're just wanting to do something amazing right out of the gate, but without some experience and knowledge under your belt, its just going to turn into a mess. Get your feet wet instead of diving in head first.

A first step for you would be to make a list of what you want out of your first car and see while model/platform aligns best with your desires and budget constraints. It's safe to say you wont be getting a WRX or STI as the insurance at your age for a sports car would be a killer on what money you do have to spend towards this car. It's also our recommendation you don't substantially modify your only car turning it into a lawn ornament that sits broken for months. Like I said before, you gotta start slow and start small.

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Old 02-27-2019, 12:10 PM   #18
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Of i can't make the saturn fast then i could leave it pretty much stock.
I have around $150 CAD, i am just doing research as this thread is called.
Has anybody RWD swapped a saturn before?
I guess my idea of AWD swapping a Saturn came from playing much forza, yeah probably.
Is there any motor that can fit in a saturn bay (other than the ls4) but have a little more power then 132hp.

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Old 02-27-2019, 12:26 PM   #19
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Not 132hp...only 124hp, with only about 105hp making it to the ground if you have a 5spd lol (100hp with about 85 to the ground if you have a SOHC & 5spd)

The LSJ is probably the easiest non-LLO engine swap you can do. Not that it's easy...just that it's easier than other possible swaps.

Sixthsphere.com for modding questions. I can pretty much guarantee any question you have has been at least asked over there and in the case of RWD S-Series...I believe it's been done twice so far.

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Old 02-27-2019, 12:36 PM   #20
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Default Re: More of my dumb research...

Here is what is possible if you have the resources. A rwd v8 turbo swap.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aa6es9_Emao


But if it's mainly rallying you're after, why not just focus on the suspension?
Raise it a couple inches, find bigger tires and away you go.
For now.
You'd learn alot from just trying it out and seeing what breaks and fixing it as you go along.
That's my opinion anyways....

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