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Old 07-01-2013, 09:48 AM   #1
chong
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Default Sound Deadening

I've seen a couple of threads on this subject, but they are all a bit out of date:

Making the car quieter
Sound Deadening/Interior Redo
Dynamat
Jeez, my car is loud

I drove a new Ford Taurus over the weekend and it really called into question the amount of noise I can hear while cruising down the highway at 70mph in my SL2. I'm thinking that if I can do it cheap and easy enough, then it might be worth the investment. My questions:
  1. How much work is this?
  2. How much should I be looking to budget for a project like this?

For the dynamat (Amazon Link: Dynamat) stuff I'm thinking that I'd get the best results if I were to completely strip down the interior (remove seats, dash, carpet, headliner, disassemble the door panels, etc...) and put the stuff down wherever I could make it fit.

Any input on the subject would be welcome!

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Old 07-01-2013, 10:38 AM   #2
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

At the end of the day, you can only do so much.

Just my opinion, but if you haven't done it already and live in an area you can do it, the 5th gear swap will probably reduce highway noise as much as some sound deadening. You can always do both with the 5th gear swap saving you money on gas as well.

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Old 07-01-2013, 10:44 AM   #3
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Quote:
Originally Posted by Signmaster View Post
At the end of the day, you can only do so much.

Just my opinion, but if you haven't done it already and live in an area you can do it, the 5th gear swap will probably reduce highway noise as much as some sound deadening. You can always do both with the 5th gear swap saving you money on gas as well.
The 5th gear swap will be MUCH more expensive as I'll have to swap the entire transmission in the process (auto). I'm not sold on the drawbacks that come with such a swap (losing cruise control) yet so I'm in a holding pattern there.

I've done some more searching and I found a thread where someone (DIYGuy?) mentioned that you get the most bang for your buck out of the doors so I'm thinking of starting there. Anyone have any links to threads that show the door dis-assembly process?

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Old 07-01-2013, 11:14 AM   #4
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Quote:
Originally Posted by chong View Post
The 5th gear swap will be MUCH more expensive as I'll have to swap the entire transmission in the process (auto). I'm not sold on the drawbacks that come with such a swap (losing cruise control) yet so I'm in a holding pattern there.

I've done some more searching and I found a thread where someone (DIYGuy?) mentioned that you get the most bang for your buck out of the doors so I'm thinking of starting there. Anyone have any links to threads that show the door dis-assembly process?
Doh! Never thought about the auto tranny... it was a thought.

The door panels remove easily, but not sure if there are any good links or "how to". You might want to try searching for posts by Pioneer_Saturn. He has massive audio and I think he did quite a bit of sound proofing... still not sure about photos though.

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Old 07-01-2013, 11:38 AM   #5
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Don't forget about the outer panels as well. Our cars do not seal well so coating both the exterior and interior panels would net the best benefit. The key is to expect "reduction" in road noise as you'll never get it as quite as that Taurus. How many miles are on your car? Going with some good shocks/struts and replacing your bushings all around will reduce a lot of road noise as well. Pulling the seats/carpet and the headliner, for me, would be far too much work to be beneficial. However if you have the time, money, and energy to do so, then have at it.

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Old 07-01-2013, 12:07 PM   #6
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

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Originally Posted by GeeWiggles View Post
Don't forget about the outer panels as well. Our cars do not seal well so coating both the exterior and interior panels would net the best benefit.
You mention coating. I've seen some mention of some sound deadening products that come in a can. Is this what you are referring to or do you just mean cover it with the dynamat stuff?

I'm not expecting perfection. Time and energy I have. When it comes to money, I'm looking for the best bang for the buck as I only paid $1000 for the car in the first place.

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Old 07-01-2013, 12:53 PM   #7
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

A lot of noise comes from the trunk...
Echo chamber...
I got another layer of trunk insulation from a donor SL at the junkyard...

Also run a good quality synthetic, does a little to quiet the engine noise...
5W-30 or 0W-30...

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Old 07-01-2013, 01:01 PM   #8
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Deading works in more than one way. It insulates and absorbs vibrations. To do the later doesn't take much. Our cars would probably benefit from vibration control a lot and it wouldn't add much weight.

There are other dynamat-like products out there. I've used B-quiet with good results in a couple of cars. It helped drop some noise for the Saturns loud opened up exhaust. I didn't go through the whole car though, because weight is a big issue.

The Saturn's issues are more than what sounds deadening can do though, so I would try to keep things reasonable. I'd bet that the Taurus is using triple sealed doors and not riding on Mcstruts. You'll be able to cut some noise out but just no that going to extreme will only make the car needlessly heavy for little return.

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Old 07-01-2013, 01:07 PM   #9
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

So cobbling some of the different viewpoints together it is probably wise to not rip the entire interior apart and put it back together as it will be more hassle than its worth. I can focus on things like the trunk, maybe the doors, and running some better oil. I wish I'd have gotten this idea sooner, I just changed the oil a couple of weeks ago...

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Old 07-01-2013, 01:24 PM   #10
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Cherry Bomb makes a short straight muffler that may help quiet the exhaust, if added.

87521, 2.25 inlet/outlet, 12 inches long...

Not sure if there is 12 inches of straight pipe to add this...

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Old 07-01-2013, 03:04 PM   #11
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Quote:
Originally Posted by chong View Post
You mention coating. I've seen some mention of some sound deadening products that come in a can. Is this what you are referring to or do you just mean cover it with the dynamat stuff?

I'm not expecting perfection. Time and energy I have. When it comes to money, I'm looking for the best bang for the buck as I only paid $1000 for the car in the first place.
The spray on coating is easier to apply and fills in cracks nicely, but it won't deaden as well as some regular cut and stick material like dynomat or the b-quiet. It comes in different thickness and deadening levels, so if weight is a concern go for the thinner stuff in less vital areas, like the outer door panels and the thicker stuff for the inner door panels. Putting some on the interior roof of the trunk and deck lid will cancel a lot of what comes from the trunk. All in all it shouldn't add that much weight, unless you just go crazy.

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Old 07-01-2013, 03:42 PM   #12
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Comparing the ride quality between a new Ford Taurus and an old Saturn is unfair to both cars. You're insulting Taurus with the comparison and using a cheap car too for the comparison. I know, my nephew drives the 'company' (leased) Taurus that's loaded and the ride quality is remarkable - quiet and firm. I used my '03 L300 for comparison and my car reflects the 'cheapness' with more sound coming through in comparison to a Taurus. While I enjoy my L300 and its relative quiet, it doesn't compare to a more expensive Taurus that costs more and reflects it in sound deadening along with excellent ride quality. Its to be expected in a main line model Ford to retain a customer base otherwise anyone would walk and choose any other car. To Fords credit, they did an excellent job.

A Saturn S-series car was never designed for anything more than basic transportation to go from here to there. The relatively low cost means a basic engine of adequate power, a/c, and cruise control. Basic sound deadening; thin carpeting, no sound deadening material in doors or ceiling with ceiling using a plain liner, and engine/trunk not having any sound deadening material other than liners. Weight is a concern for basic transportation so this becomes the owners duty to balance the added weight of sound deadening material to comfort/fuel economy. A Taurus is a middle weight car with a relatively large engine, large body mass for a sedan, carrying lots of sound deadening for anyone wanting a middle priced car.

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Old 07-01-2013, 04:07 PM   #13
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

^This

Like I said you will never, EVER get one of these cars near as quite as that Taurus, or any decently build mid size sedan, it's just virtually impossible. That being said, you can take steps to make it quieter, and most of it comes in the way of stuff that probably needs service anyway, like the suspension and exhaust system. The deadening material is just a buffer. THAT being said, my first car way back when was an 89 Dodge Shadow that was so loud you could literally hear the gradient of the road under you. A friend of mine that worked at a local audio shop gave me a few sheets of dynamat, enough to do the doors and the trunk lid/deck and let me tell you, the difference was pretty drastic. Of course this was because it was already so loud to begin with, any dampening would be noticeable.

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Old 07-01-2013, 04:26 PM   #14
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdryer View Post
...Weight is a concern for basic transportation ....
Sound deadening works by its mass.

Used to be that the office area in the Ypsilanti, Michigan GMSPO (3 million square foot big box warehouse building) was a building built inside of the big box building. Hanging from the roof of the big box building at the perimeter of the office area were lead sheets that stopped the warehouse noise from getting over top of the office area.

Dynamat is light-weight lead sheeting...

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Old 07-01-2013, 04:41 PM   #15
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdryer View Post
Comparing the ride quality between a new Ford Taurus and an old Saturn is unfair to both cars. You're insulting Taurus with the comparison and using a cheap car too for the comparison. I know, my nephew drives the 'company' (leased) Taurus that's loaded and the ride quality is remarkable - quiet and firm. I used my '03 L300 for comparison and my car reflects the 'cheapness' with more sound coming through in comparison to a Taurus. While I enjoy my L300 and its relative quiet, it doesn't compare to a more expensive Taurus that costs more and reflects it in sound deadening along with excellent ride quality. Its to be expected in a main line model Ford to retain a customer base otherwise anyone would walk and choose any other car. To Fords credit, they did an excellent job.

A Saturn S-series car was never designed for anything more than basic transportation to go from here to there. The relatively low cost means a basic engine of adequate power, a/c, and cruise control. Basic sound deadening; thin carpeting, no sound deadening material in doors or ceiling with ceiling using a plain liner, and engine/trunk not having any sound deadening material other than liners. Weight is a concern for basic transportation so this becomes the owners duty to balance the added weight of sound deadening material to comfort/fuel economy. A Taurus is a middle weight car with a relatively large engine, large body mass for a sedan, carrying lots of sound deadening for anyone wanting a middle priced car.
That, and overall quality standards have risen in the past few years. That being said, a Taurus from the 90's was almost certainly quieter, due to what fdryer said.

@fdryer where did your username come from anyway? (Out of curiosity)

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Old 07-01-2013, 04:42 PM   #16
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

You can sound deaden a car with several cans of professional spray foam. You want about 1/4" of foam on the inside of the exterior panels and top. The floors get some of the matting of your choice. Fill the front header and top rails with foam as well. Will add about 5lb to the total weight.

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Old 07-01-2013, 04:59 PM   #17
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Doubling up the carpet pad in my '96 SC2 didn't do anything but make the carpet thicker. I dunno what I expected it to do but I figured it'd do more than nothing...

Plugging up the holes around the windshield from (I think) a botched replacement job, properly aligning the hood, and bending the door frames back into shape did awesomely for quieting the interior noise. Sometimes I have to play with just how much up/down the windows are as well, too far up bends something allowing noisy air in.

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Old 07-01-2013, 05:26 PM   #18
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

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....@fdryer where did your username come from anyway? (Out of curiosity)
The name was taken from an old TV series character.

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Old 07-01-2013, 07:11 PM   #19
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Default Re: Sound Deadening

Loved that show!

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/photopo...hp/photo/83878


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Old 07-02-2013, 01:43 AM   #20
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Happy Re: Sound Deadening

Quote:
I've done some more searching and I found a thread where someone (DIYGuy?) mentioned that you get the most bang for your buck out of the doors so I'm thinking of starting there. Anyone have any links to threads that show the door dis-assembly process?
Yes, I put carpet padding in my doors, under the carpet, under the dashboard cover, under the rear deck, and about anywhere else I could think to put it.

You can go to Lowes, Home Depot, etcetera, and buy a fairly large roll of it for around $30. Or go to a carpet place and get a few yards of it. They might even just give you scraps you can tape together.

There are lots of threads (and even Richpin videos) on removing the outer door panels. Cut the padding to shape and use duct tape to hold it in position on the outside of the plastic drip shield (the thin plastic sheeting just under the outer door skin). That shield also acts as an air barrier against wind noise, so try not to rip it up too much. There is plenty of space under the door skins. You'll just need to trim away from the edges and the door handle a little bit.

Padding the doors made a huge difference in my car. It was indeed the most "bang for the buck" I found, at least so far as I am concerned.

Then when I replaced the carpet I added a layer of the same padding underneath (double in some spots) and stuffed foam into the space behind the center console where the shift cables enter (to help deaden engine noises).

The dash cover is easy to get off. Cut a piece of carpet padding and just drape it over all the stuff under the cover then put the cover back. Be generous with it.

I also added it underneath the rear deck cover when I installed the 6x9 speakers. Again, it made a noticeable difference.

I then put a layer under the trunk carpet. That helped too, but not as much as the other places because of course my rear seats deaden a lot of trunk noises.

Another thing you can do is to check your door and window seals. Look for signs that they are not sealing. There should be witness marks where they get compressed while they are closed. If not, you may need to pad, adjust or replace them. Look at anything that comes through the firewall as a potential noise source as well.

I also put some fiberglass batting (the attic kind) in the cavities over the fender wells in front. That stopped a fair amount of wind noise all on its own. It's not a mod for everyone though.

It isn't too hard to quiet down the interiors of these cars a lot, but as has been said, it's not a Taurus.

I hope I helped.

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