SaturnFans.com
saturnfans.com - classifieds - forums - webmail


Go Back   SaturnFans.com Forums > Models > Saturn Vue > Vue General

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-29-2019, 01:10 PM   #1
Bismarck318
Senior Member
Bismarck318 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Birthplace of Rust, FKA The Heart of the Rustbelt, AKA The Angry White Planet Ohth
Posts: 1,079

2006 VUE 3.5L
Default E15

Anyone using this besides myself on occasion? Just became avail in my area in the last 6 months. Nickle to a dime less/gal.
Bismarck318 is offline   Reply With Quote
SaturnFans.com Sponsored Links
Old 03-31-2019, 09:36 PM   #2
onefunkar
Master Member
onefunkar is a jewel in the roughonefunkar is a jewel in the roughonefunkar is a jewel in the roughonefunkar is a jewel in the rough
 
onefunkar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,512

2008 Outlook XR
2007 AURA XR
Default Re: E15

Just remember it gets a nickel or dime a gallon less mileage so it all equals out. Also your car designed for up to 10 percent ethanol.
onefunkar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2019, 06:33 PM   #3
Woodpecker
Member
Woodpecker is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Houston, Tx
Posts: 230

2007 VUE 3.5L
Default Re: E15

Yeah, you don't really save anything, but the alcohol will do damage to the system.
Woodpecker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2019, 08:56 PM   #4
fdryer
Super Member
fdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond repute
 
fdryer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 44,021
 

2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: E15

If anyone were to examine pricing a gallon of 100% antifreeze against the same gallon but as a 50/50 blend of premixed water and antifreeze, there's a definite disparity. Two gallons of 50/50 premix costs more than one gallon of 100% antifreeze. The one gallon cut with another gallon of water makes two gallons of premix, costing less than buying two gallons of premixed coolant. A similar cost analysis applies to using regular 100% gasoline compared to 10% or 15% ethanol added to gasoline but becomes clouded over by cost comparison unless fuel mileage is applied.

For all intents and purposes, using 100% gasoline (zero ethanol) is the basis for all other costs and fuel mileage comparisons. Costs per gallon and fuel mileage must be taken together to appreciate any real or false benefits. Making things easier might be comparing 10% ethanol/fuel mileage to 15% ethanol/fuel mileage.

A full tank of 10% ethanol costs and total mileage used is compared to a full tank of 15% ethanol used and total mileage. Costs and fuel mileage are now compared to arrive at values reflecting any positive or negative benefits.

In reality, adding ethanol lowers fuel mileage by a few miles compared to 100% gasoline. Adding another 5% ethanol lowers fuel mileage some more. Per gallon costs isn't useful for comparison. Full tank costs and total fuel mileage are compared between 10% and 15% for a better perspective.

In combustion discussions, more ethanol is needed than gasoline per combustion cycle. Air fuel ratios for gasoline is always 14.7:1 - 14.7 parts air to one part fuel. Ethanol air/fuel ratios are around 9:1 - nine parts air to one part ethanol. More ethanol is needed to burn in one cycle compared to gasoline. In heat numbers, gasoline has about 115,000 BTUs while ethanol has about 76,100 BTUs. Ethanol has less heat energy compared to gasoline and needs to be fed in greater amounts per engine combustion cycle. This translates to using more ethanol than gasoline from an air fuel ratio. Going from 10% to 15% ethanol in gasoline is simply lowering fuel mileage no matter what the costs as no one in the petrochemical business is giving anyone discounts on fuel no matter what's said or advertised.

I used the premix antifreeze cost comparison to 100% antifreeze as an example of false advertising to bring honest fuel costs/fuel mileage for a greater perspective when considering 10% to 15% ethanol/gasoline comparisons. Diluting 100% gasoline lowers fuel mileage, period.
fdryer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2019, 10:50 AM   #5
Bismarck318
Senior Member
Bismarck318 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Birthplace of Rust, FKA The Heart of the Rustbelt, AKA The Angry White Planet Ohth
Posts: 1,079

2006 VUE 3.5L
Default Re: E15

You are saying diluted gasoline with on higher point in octane (88), would think this would be cleaner for the engine & correct I noted my mileage has dropped into the low 16's, though never had fantastic mileage in winter months anyway plus we have special winter formulations starting in November - May here & the car being another year older.

I never understood the premix Prestone (or any coolant for that matter), though now with the sealed systems, disables the inept (such as me) from flushing the coolant systems which I had always done on my vehicles in the past.

We run on the planet Ohth in the winter months @ up to 10% ethanol & E-15, id "up to" 15% so the points may be only negligable in the winter months anyway.

Winter gas formulations... most of you folks will not know anything about though, it's mandated here.
Bismarck318 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2019, 12:20 PM   #6
fdryer
Super Member
fdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond repute
 
fdryer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 44,021
 

2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: E15

If I'm not mistaken, winter gasoline is formulated to lower vapor pressure in cold temperatures for easier combustion. The change from summer to winter gasoline occurs to all 48 states with 14 states using lower RVP gasoline; https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a1...ine-explained/ (one of several informative sites). Going back to base reference of non leaded 100% 87 octane gasoline, fuel mileage for a specific vehicle drops when 10% ethanol is added, drops some more when an additional 5% is added and finally, drops again when switching from summer to winter gasoline. To appreciate fuel mileage for each change would require the same vehicle be driven over the same roads using a full tank and driven by the same driver, repeated in summer then winter conditions. Temperatures, road conditions, traffic and weather influence fuel mileage as well as how hard or soft the right foot applies throttle.

The sealed cooling systems does not mean car owners are prevented from changing antifreeze. Sealed cooling systems means a better designed and more efficient cooling system not venting to the atmosphere by using a plastic radiator cap on the coolant container with the coolant container pressurized as part of the cooling system. The small air volume allows expansion and contraction of coolant without venting at operating pressures. This stops coolant from oxidizing while allowing longer life time use before replacement. The plastic coolant cap is the radiator cap with a pressure and vacuum valve built in. When overheating occurs and pressures exceed rated values, the pressure valve opens to release excess pressures (above 15 or 20 psi). When hot coolant cools down, a vacuum may occur. The vacuum valve opens to allow atmospheric pressure in. This prevents hoses, radiators and heater cores from collapsing. Under normal every day driving conditions with a car in good condition, cooling systems remain sealed - neither over pressurizing nor creating a vacuum hence the term sealed cooling system.

Anyone can replace their antifreeze any time. Radiators still have a drain valve while the coolant container cap is left off. Pulling the lower radiator hose is still the alternative to the radiator petcock.

Last edited by fdryer; 04-03-2019 at 12:25 PM.
fdryer is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:55 AM.

Advanced Forum Search | Advanced Photo Search


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
SaturnFans.com. The Saturn Enthusiasts Site.