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Old 11-15-2019, 08:10 PM   #121
98SaturnSL2Bett
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

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Originally Posted by toggenburg View Post
Was the ICM a used one from a junkyard, or parts store new?
I would get a good used one and see.
Parts new store.

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Old 11-15-2019, 08:16 PM   #122
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

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Originally Posted by toggenburg View Post
Was the ICM a used one from a junkyard, or parts store new?
I would get a good used one and see.
I really don't like the idea of having to go hang out at a junk yard digging around for something like this. I don't have the time or the knowledge to do this.

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Old 11-15-2019, 08:30 PM   #123
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

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Are you desperate enough yet to get compression readings?

I asked this second mechanic what's involved with that. So I learned we definitely hadn't done that yet. He said he'd be willing to do that test for me if I wanted but he was too busy with other work to do it right away. He also gave me his opinion that he didn't think it was a compression problem because it runs so well when it runs and doesn't misfire or anything.

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Old 11-15-2019, 11:04 PM   #124
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

OK, I'll wish you good luck and leave you in peace.

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Old 11-16-2019, 12:35 PM   #125
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

With this erratic random crank no start problem, going back to basics may be best; testing for fuel and spark right after another no start event occurs.

Spark is easiest but requires two people; one to turn the ignition switch to START while the other person observes for spark jumping across the two ignition coils. Prior to testing spark, note spark plug firing order then remove them from the two ignition coils. As the driver tries starting, the observer watches for (expected) spark jumping cross both ignition coil towers. Spark is always generated while starting. If another failed starting mode occurs, this is a quick test to see if spark is randomly missing during starting. Fuel is a little more difficult to check for as this requires removing spark plugs.

During another crank no start issue, removing spark plugs should show them wet and smelling of raw gasoline. One or two failed starting attempts is more than enough to have wet smelling plugs since the engine doesn't startup. Plenty of fuel should be injected into all four cylinders unless something is randomly preventing injectors from operating.

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Old 11-19-2019, 12:40 PM   #126
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

Alright. Here's my latest update:

Fabulous news --- my car has been starting every day since I picked it up at the shop last Thursday (remember I shared that I did have trouble starting it there and had to plug it into my cousin's battery charger for 20 minutes or so). So, it's started Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday and Tuesday!!!! Hasn't done that since all of this started in late September or early October.

Frustrating part is that I don't know why it's working now. The second mechanic didn't DO anything to the car. He ran his tests, which were all well within normal range and said anything that he could think of to do, I and/or my main shop had already done (thanks to this thread and all of your help).

I bought a battery warmer but haven't installed it yet. I intend to make Fleet Farm honor their warranty on my 10-month-old battery which is warrantied for 72 months, but haven't had a chance to yet.

The ONLY thing I can think of is that my neighbor highly recommended I start using BP gas exclusively, which I've done. I've put in a 1/4 tank, 1/4 tank, a 1/2 tank, and another 1/2 tank yesterday.

Thoughts?

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Old 11-19-2019, 02:12 PM   #127
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

Glad your car is working for now, however; what many folks don't know is that all gasoline is the same, all brands have the same additives as their competitors.

The refiner merely 'licenses' their retailers (Shell/Exxon/BP/Mobil/Texaco/etc) the privilege of marketing certain 'pet' buzz-word-catchy-names to us the consumers.

We are pressured by long standing marketing hype and made to believe that gas retailer X is a better fuel than gas retailer Y because X contains this special additive that Y does not. It is all smoke and mirrors, and some of us pay a whole lot more money each fillup because of this deception.

Same goes for diesel fuel, add in RED dye and it is off road diesel (farm tractor/untaxed fuel), add GREEN dye its on road diesel (car stuff), add no dye and you have expensive clear kerosene (portable heaters). Jet fuel has the same process, it is just kerosene.

Remember when they introduced unleaded fuel to us 45 years ago? The price shot up sky high, and we were told it cost the refiners much more for the new fuel. Bunk, all they did was to stop adding leadtetraethyl to the naturally unleaded gas and charge everyone a ton more....less work to make it ='s more profit with proper advertising schemes.

We are all duped on these things and don't even know it.

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Old 11-19-2019, 06:05 PM   #128
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

^ I agree. ^ Gasoline tends to be the same if not exactly the same from brand to brand. The most recent sales pitch is 'top tier' fuel. I don't know if this is more hype except for GM service manuals recommending them for best all around performance.

As I see it from perhaps my narrow perspective with hundreds of gas stations in the tri state area of NYC, New Jersey and Connecticut, I think I've bought from every name brand to as many no name brands without noticing any difference. Although I've been driving and buying my gasoline for less than a hundred years, I think I have some experience in this area. As a matter of fact, I swear I get better mileage when I was commuting around 160 miles round trip in a day. Once out of NYC and onto the NJ turnpike, my mpg always jump up but never quite hits 25 mpg while on cruise control (set for 72/73 mph). Around home in what seems like every block has a stoplight or stop sign, my mpg falls down and returns embarrassing numbers (3.0L V6). Even when buying gasoline from a third world no name gas station, my mpg remain the same for turnpike driving. From no name to name brand gasoline, my idle remains near perfect despite meddling with a new timing belt and throwing off timing and idle a little (corrected two weeks later). Regular 87 octane with ethanol. Whether gas was bought locally from every station with lowest prices to name brands on turnpike rest stops, my mpg has been steady with higher mpg for highways and lowest in local traffic. I've managed to avoid the two biggest turnpike disasters when the tanker driver dumped diesel fuel into underground gas tanks, ruining every vehicle filling up with diesel that's supposed to run with 87 regular gasoline. The news showed a line of vehicles along the side of the turnpike after diesel enters each engine and stalls out a mile or so down the road. These two incidents occurred to the name brand companies with the station taking responsibility for damages. As fast as I'm concerned, gasoline is gasoline. 87 octane should be the same for name brand as well as no name brands.

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Old 11-20-2019, 12:52 PM   #129
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

6 days in a row starting. No idea why. Especially if, as the guys above say, it's not the gas change or cleaning out something in the gas tank.

Oh, you know, I did go through a car wash last week. Maybe that fixed my car

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Old 11-20-2019, 01:20 PM   #130
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

Shhhh, will you puleeeze keep this under the table!? If it ever got out what you did, the car world as we know it would have an apocalyptic collapse..........

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Old 11-20-2019, 01:36 PM   #131
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

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Shhhh, will you puleeeze keep this under the table!? If it ever got out what you did, the car world as we know it would have an apocalyptic collapse..........
Thanks for that

Have a very nice Thanksgiving! Thank you so much for all of your help these weeks fdryer.

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Old 11-20-2019, 02:07 PM   #132
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Default Re: 1998 Saturn SL2 won't start when parked on driveway incline

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Originally Posted by 98SaturnSL2Bett View Post
6 days in a row starting. No idea why. Especially if, as the guys above say, it's not the gas change or cleaning out something in the gas tank.

Oh, you know, I did go through a car wash last week. Maybe that fixed my car
You may be on to something

water can complete a broken circuit or water pressure could have moved a wire slightly where it makes a better connections or cleaned off something that was ground current.

Long shot but not out of the realm of possibility

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