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Old 07-10-2019, 11:32 PM   #21
Waiex191
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Typically that is because the lines are not quite lined up, so then neither is the nut. Bend the lines around a bit until you can get the nut started and screwed in most of the way by hand. Don't use a wrench to force it. That's one of the things that leads to the dark side of the force.

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Old 07-12-2019, 12:18 PM   #22
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Well I think I broke the fittings, my wife gave my the ultimatum, cant fix it, the car is going to the junkyard, is there an easy solution ? I dont want to change the brake lines
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Old 07-12-2019, 02:14 PM   #23
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Quote:
Originally Posted by SIRPAULGERMAN View Post
Well I think I broke the fittings, my wife gave my the ultimatum, cant fix it, the car is going to the junkyard, is there an easy solution ? I dont want to change the brake lines
What exactly does "broke" mean here? Although I can see the pictures on my phone I can't tell if the threads are damaged. Is that the problem? Or is the damage you're referring to regarding the fitting edges having been rounded off (stripped)?

With regard to the ultimatum, taking the car to a wrecking yard is a bad idea. It's a greater money loser than selling it in running condition to a private party.

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Old 07-12-2019, 03:04 PM   #24
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

I stripped the fitting, in addition I am not able to connected the fitting that are fine back to the master cylinder.

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Old 07-12-2019, 07:06 PM   #25
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

You've not stated which of your cars is the one being repaired. Is it the SL1 or the SL2? Does the car have ABS? Does your new master cylinder match up in size and with brake line connection locations (meaning the distance from the back of the unit to each fitting's port)? In short, do know that you have the correct replacement part?

If the threads of the fittings at the master cylinder lines have been stripped then it's also possible that the threads of the master cylinder's ports have also been damaged. I would hope not, but it may have happened.

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Old 07-12-2019, 08:17 PM   #26
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Is a new master cylinder, is a 2001 sl1 no ABS, here is the part RAYBESTOS MC390574,
the ports seem to be fine, I just have a difficult time putting the fittings back to the master cylinder and I also stripped one fitting.
I was able to connect only 1 fitting so far.

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Old 07-12-2019, 08:29 PM   #27
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

If the threads are ok, I would tweak the line until you could put it in by hand. Then it looks like your only wrench option is vise grips.

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Old 07-12-2019, 10:45 PM   #28
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Vice grips vs a flare wrench?

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Old 07-12-2019, 11:37 PM   #29
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Quote:
Originally Posted by toggenburg View Post
Vice grips vs a flare wrench?
At this point a flare wrench (line wrench as it was referred to at my dad's businesses) wouldn't be of any help as the hex on the fitting is too badly damaged. Sadly, vice grips - or perhaps Channel Lock pliers - are the only tools I'd know of which could assist the OP in this situation. If use of such tools is unsuccessful then the steel line would have to be replaced.

If the steel line must be replaced then here are the possibilities:
1) there may be a company that SIRPAULGERMAN can find that will make a custom steel line based on his sample somewhere near the Greater Salt Lake City area, or
2) he may have to purchase
a) aftermarket straight, bendable steel lines and perhaps a coupler fitting (enough to create a line of the proper length - as an example...https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/BK_8131235) and,
b) a tubing bender.

Based upon what has happened here I believe that the OP may not own any flare wrenches. Minimally, he shoud have one or more of the correct sized wrenches to assist him so that there won't be more damage as this repair goes forward especially when he comes to the point of making his final twists in tightening the flare nut fittings. None of us would want to repeat the error which caused the damage we've seen because we lacked the proper tools for the job.

...
320,000 miles - Holy canolli!
The blessings of liberty erode in my country.
Gov't's grown bigger, but a chance exists that it will be reduced. I'm cautiously hopeful.

Last edited by pierrot; 07-12-2019 at 11:52 PM..

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Old 07-18-2019, 07:14 PM   #30
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

quick update

1) was able to connect the master cylinder to the lines
2) bleed all the brakes lines

I noticed an improvement, however the brakes are not 100%.
What else to do ?

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Old 07-18-2019, 07:35 PM   #31
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

If it's not good after new parts and bleeding, there could be a leak somewhere. Clean off all the brake fluid mess and go hard on the brakes. Then look for leaks.

...
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Old 07-20-2019, 01:29 PM   #32
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Quote:
Originally Posted by SIRPAULGERMAN View Post
quick update

1) was able to connect the master cylinder to the lines
2) bleed all the brakes lines

I noticed an improvement, however the brakes are not 100%.
What else to do ?
I'm glad that you were able to connect the brake lines to the master cylinder, but other statements in the post still leave me puzzled. Questions:

1) Assuming that the master cylinder was bled, how did you do it?
2) "however the brakes are not 100%" doesn't help us know what you're experiencing. What exactly are you referring to?
3) Does this relate to a test drive?

Waiex191's point is well taken. Unless there's a mechanical problem that we're unaware of then all that's left is hydraulics.

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The blessings of liberty erode in my country.
Gov't's grown bigger, but a chance exists that it will be reduced. I'm cautiously hopeful.

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Old 07-22-2019, 12:15 AM   #33
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Replacing calipers, rotors, and MC is 90% brake system.
I hope you procured & installed the PAIR of copper washers for each banjo bolt
(1-per caliper).

If the pedal response is yet imperfect... could be Master Cylinder was not adequately 'bled' prior to attachment of the steel brake lines. In some cases, the situation will resolve eventually with use- but this considered risky.

Ideally ALL lines will be bled after MC installation, and this would afford checking condition of rear wheel cylinders, but "bench bleeding" the MC prior installation is preferably the best path.

I recently installed MC in my 2000 S (no ABS). I bought a MC bleeding kit (actually two, for needed lines) and brought it to a mechanic-friends shop, and messed with it for over an hour, eventually forcing all the air OUT.
But in the past I've installed MC without that step... it involves endless pumping on the brake pedal, then a somewhat soft pedal for a thousand or so driving miles....
....................
It is characteristic that one or more line nuts are difficult to thread into MC.

Last edited by TomM96; 07-22-2019 at 12:17 AM.. Reason: fergat un

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Old 07-22-2019, 09:52 AM   #34
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Quote:
Originally Posted by TomM96 View Post
I hope you procured & installed the PAIR of copper washers for each banjo bolt
(1-per caliper).
2 per caliper. 1 on either side of the brake line, 1 between the bolt head and the line with the other between the line and the caliper.
One or the other usually gets stuck to something so is hard to find and could be mistaken for not needing replacement because you've added another one there and then the bolt doesn't fit with 3 washers.

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Old 09-17-2019, 05:19 PM   #35
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Updates with my car

I took the car to the shop, they did not find anything wrong with the brakes, the bleed the whole system, they tested the Power Brake Booster and is fine, also no leaks in the system.

I took for a test and is not breaking right, at low speed the car wont lock the wheels, during cruise speed is working normal or ok, cant remember.


What else cut it be ?

here is the list of all the repairs
New master cylinder
new pads
new front rotors
new o-rings for the calipers
the shop adjusted the rear breaks
I tested the brake booster and seems fine too

I am lost ? any ideas ?

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Old 09-17-2019, 05:34 PM   #36
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Quote:
Originally Posted by SIRPAULGERMAN View Post
...I took for a test and is not breaking right, at low speed the car wont lock the wheels, during cruise speed is working normal or ok, cant remember...
I don't understand the quoted segment. Would you please clarify it?

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Gov't's grown bigger, but a chance exists that it will be reduced. I'm cautiously hopeful.

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Old 09-17-2019, 06:36 PM   #37
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Sorry, I am using my phone

I took the car for a drive

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Old 09-19-2019, 12:20 AM   #38
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Quote:
Originally Posted by SIRPAULGERMAN View Post
Sorry, I am using my phone...
That's fine. I occasionally use my phone to post things here as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SIRPAULGERMAN View Post
I took the car for a drive
I understood that you'd taken the car for your own test drive. This was quite clear to me. It was your description of the results which were a bit confusing. You said that "I took for a test and is not breaking right, at low speed the car wont lock the wheels" What does it mean when "the car wont lock the wheels?" Locking the wheels when braking is not desireable as that results in skidding. Are you trying to say that the car isn't slowing down when the brakes are applied at "low" speeds?

And then - "during cruise speed is working normal or ok, cant remember..." I think you're saying that the brakes seemed okay here, but then you said "can't remember" (<punctuation correction mine). So could you not remember if the brakes did work correctly while driving at "cruise speed?"

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The blessings of liberty erode in my country.
Gov't's grown bigger, but a chance exists that it will be reduced. I'm cautiously hopeful.

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Old 09-19-2019, 08:13 PM   #39
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Sorry for all the confusion, Is hard to type on your phone and at work

Took the car for another test drive, during low speed ( minus 20mph ) when I hit the brakes, the pedal feels soft when I pushed the pedal all the way, and in my other cars I am able to lock the wheels at the same speed when the pedal is depressed, meaning that the brakes are good, is the opposite on the Saturn.

I am not feeling a hard pedal when I pushed it all the way, is a soft pedal when a reach the bottom of the brake pedal travel, is not braking.

Last edited by SIRPAULGERMAN; 09-19-2019 at 08:19 PM..

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Old 09-24-2019, 01:11 PM   #40
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Default Re: Questions about breaks

Well took the car to another shop, and they told me that they did not find anything wrong the brakes. The car is fine.

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