SaturnFans.com
what's new (beta) - classifieds - forums - photos


Go Back   SaturnFans.com Forums > Models > Saturn S-Series > S-Series General
Register FAQ Members List Groups Calendar Chat Room Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-15-2013, 05:06 PM   #1
macbox
Senior Member
macbox will become famous soon enough
 
macbox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 1,185
 

1995 SC2
1997 SC2
Default Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

95 SC2, new rear calipers were put on four years ago, now they are seized. I'm in the process of removing the calipers, and the bolts holding the caliper to the knuckle are now rust-welded to the rest of the assembly. I've let them soak for 5 days with kroil and PB blaster, and tried heating them with a map/propane torch (not the real Mapp, the substitute for Mapp), but no luck.

Looking for a little advice. How long should I be heating the bolt, or the metal surrounding the bolt, in order to break them free? Will the map/propane do it if held long enough, or do I need to break down and find a way to get oxyacetylene to these buggers to break them loose? On the passenger side both bolts are 10mm head, and I have the lower bolt out. On the drivers side it is 10mm on the bottom and 17mm on the top, and the 10mm is rounded, and the 17mm I haven't started on yet.

What would be the prevailing wisdom in this situation?

...
"The Twins"
#4, "Betty" 1995 SC2m, 163K, 400 Miles per quart. Garage queen. Currently in 1000 pieces for a rebuild.
#7 "Betsy" 1995 SC2, 131K, daily driver.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to macbox's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help macbox reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
macbox is offline   Reply With Quote
SaturnFans.com Sponsored Links
Old 05-15-2013, 06:49 PM   #2
johnny95sl2
Senior Member
johnny95sl2 will become famous soon enough
 
johnny95sl2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,139

1997 SW2
1995 SC2
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

Red hot and find an impact wrench

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to johnny95sl2's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help johnny95sl2 reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
johnny95sl2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2013, 12:36 AM   #3
macbox
Senior Member
macbox will become famous soon enough
 
macbox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 1,185
 

1995 SC2
1997 SC2
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

I was afraid there wasn't a simple solution, I guess I'm either finding someone with an oxyacetylene setup or finding one on craigslist.

...
"The Twins"
#4, "Betty" 1995 SC2m, 163K, 400 Miles per quart. Garage queen. Currently in 1000 pieces for a rebuild.
#7 "Betsy" 1995 SC2, 131K, daily driver.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to macbox's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help macbox reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
macbox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2013, 08:44 PM   #4
85HP
Member
85HP is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: CT
Posts: 79
 

1993 SW1
1998 SW2
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

Quote:
Originally Posted by macbox View Post
Will the map/propane do it if held long enough, or do I need to break down and find a way to get oxyacetylene to these buggers to break them loose?
I've found a few occasions where propane was sufficient. Biggest drawback with propane is, if the part is massive, it takes forever to heat. The goal of heating is to break the chemical (rust) bond, so you don't want to heat the two stuck parts uniformly, you want to heat one of them to get max. movement due to thermal expansion. It's that movement that breaks the bond. That's my opinion, anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnny95sl2 View Post
Red hot and find an impact wrench
Yep. Let the part cool before hitting it with the impact gun.

6 point impact socket will not damage the bolt heads, and impact will gently drive out the most "impossible" bolts. If you don't own an impact, get one - makes things go very quickly.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to 85HP's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help 85HP reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
85HP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2013, 02:40 AM   #5
fdryer
Super Member
fdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond repute
 
fdryer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 43,271
 

2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

^ I agree. ^ Without an impact tool a hammer and steel rod will work. If the heads round off then use bolt extractors.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg be.jpg (2.5 KB, 59 views)

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to fdryer's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help fdryer reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
fdryer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 12:16 AM   #6
macbox
Senior Member
macbox will become famous soon enough
 
macbox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 1,185
 

1995 SC2
1997 SC2
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

I picked up an oxyacetylene torch off of craigslist, and it is my new favorite tool. The 6000˚ heat got the stuck bolts out that all the hardware I had, plus the bolt extractors I bought, could not get out. The rotors were rusted on solid as well.
All my impact did was round off one of the heads, it took the heat to break it loose.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 98SW2_Rear_brake_05-26-13_1.jpg (70.6 KB, 17 views)
File Type: jpg 98SW2_Rear_brake_05-26-13_2.jpg (60.5 KB, 17 views)

...
"The Twins"
#4, "Betty" 1995 SC2m, 163K, 400 Miles per quart. Garage queen. Currently in 1000 pieces for a rebuild.
#7 "Betsy" 1995 SC2, 131K, daily driver.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to macbox's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help macbox reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
macbox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 01:50 AM   #7
fdryer
Super Member
fdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond repute
 
fdryer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 43,271
 

2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

Nice.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to fdryer's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help fdryer reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
fdryer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 09:33 AM   #8
S3aturnR
Master Member
S3aturnR is a jewel in the roughS3aturnR is a jewel in the roughS3aturnR is a jewel in the rough
 
S3aturnR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Oxford, Mi.
Posts: 3,545
 

1996 SL2
1999 SL1
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

Quote:
Originally Posted by macbox View Post
Looking for a little advice. How long should I be heating the bolt, or the metal surrounding the bolt, in order to break them free?
you should be spending exactly ZERO seconds trying to separate them. break the bolt head off, buy a new or used caliper bracket and a new set of slides and install them on your car.

time is money and you will literally spend hours and hours trying to get those apart and still probably break them anyway. if you value your time, get new parts...


s3aturnr

...
"reno is a lot like maybury, except everyone's on crystal meth and prostitution's legal" - junior

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to S3aturnR's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help S3aturnR reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
S3aturnR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 11:28 AM   #9
fdryer
Super Member
fdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond reputefdryer has a reputation beyond repute
 
fdryer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 43,271
 

2003 L-Series 3.0L Sedan
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

^ You're right of course.......... if you're in business but I don't recall the OP mentioning this brake repair related to a business repair. ^ I do agree that it can be aggravating to almost no end when dealing with seized fasteners unless some experience is shared to reduce the time for unusual situations.

On a belated note, if the rotors were seized after only four years (that bolt doesn't look rusted at all) then it may be worth using blue loctite. Loctite serves a dual purpose - to lock fasteners against loosening from heat/cold/vibration and provide a seal against moisture that accelerates corrosion.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to fdryer's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help fdryer reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
fdryer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 12:00 PM   #10
Nels
Member
Nels is on a distinguished road
 
Nels's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Manitowoc, Wisconsin
Posts: 221

1996 SL
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

I know that in my own humble opinion, I will just buy complete rebuilt calipers and new rotors for the next disc brake job I do. After all the putzing around with the sticky calipers on my recent front brake job on my Saturn I still ended up replacing one of the calipers anyway. NAPA has rebuilt caliper assemblies with pads included for under $50 each (after exchange). Two bolts, one hose connection, and a quick bleed, and you're done. Well worth it!

And this is also my opinion only --
I see the OP is in MN. I see nothing but bad things happen to rear wheel disc brake setups in this climate next to the Great White North. Rear calipers and rotors do not get enough heat and friction from normal use to be self-cleaning. The few cars I have had with rear wheel disc brakes have always seemed to need the rears changed out due to corrosion rather than wear, and at shorter intervals than the front brakes. Extra maintenance for not much benefit, but they look cool . . . . . ;-)

...
--------
Nels
Manitowoc WI
1996 SL, 5 Speed manual ╠╬╝

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to Nels's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help Nels reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
Nels is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2013, 12:11 AM   #11
macbox
Senior Member
macbox will become famous soon enough
 
macbox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 1,185
 

1995 SC2
1997 SC2
Default Re: Stuck rear brake caliper to knuckle lower bolt

Nels, you are probably right about rear disc brakes in the north and having to be replaced due to corrosion rather than wear. I actually have some nice calipers from the JY, they were painted and had good hardware, so they are replacing the rusted units.

As far as the "time is money" argument, I'm a hobbyist and do this to learn, to have a working car, to relax, and to preserve the old saturn. Also no need to bust the head of the bolt off when you have an oxyacetylene torch, it works like a charm breaking the rust bond.

fdryer, locktite = yes, I'll be using it for the assembly.

...
"The Twins"
#4, "Betty" 1995 SC2m, 163K, 400 Miles per quart. Garage queen. Currently in 1000 pieces for a rebuild.
#7 "Betsy" 1995 SC2, 131K, daily driver.

REWARD EXCELLENCE!

Add to macbox's Reputation
Rate the quality of this post and help macbox reputation points. Click the reputation button near the bottom left corner of this message box. Thank you!
macbox is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
SW2 front caliper bracket to knuckle bolt? thewanderer S-Series Tech 10 01-17-2014 06:30 PM
Lower Control Arm Bolt STUCK nibowin S-Series Tech 10 10-11-2013 02:13 PM
97 sc2, cant get drivers rear lower caliper bolt off. demoncamber S-Series Tech 6 03-12-2012 05:50 PM
HELP! Fatty caliper bolt stuck and stripped! demoncamber S-Series Tech 8 09-20-2009 01:40 PM
stuck brake caliper Jim Waibel S-Series Tech 9 09-13-2004 01:33 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:09 AM.

Advanced Forum Search | Advanced Photo Search


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SaturnFans.com. The Saturn Enthusiasts Site.