SaturnFans.com
saturnfans.com - classifieds - forums - webmail


Go Back   SaturnFans.com Forums > Models > Saturn Ion > Ion General

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-31-2014, 06:41 PM   #1
picaman
Junior Member
picaman is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 25
Default Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Apparently it's an official recall now, not just an extended warranty. Good news.

Sorry I don't have enough posts to put up the link.

Last edited by picaman; 03-31-2014 at 06:49 PM.
picaman is offline   Reply With Quote
SaturnFans.com Sponsored Links
Old 03-31-2014, 06:45 PM   #2
picaman
Junior Member
picaman is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 25
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled

From USA Today:

General Motors announced another whopping recall Monday on the eve of its CEO's testimony to Congress over safety lapses. This one covers more than 1.3 million vehicles in the U.S. that may experience a sudden power steering loss.

GM says drivers will instantly know if the electric power steering system fails because a chime and dashboard message will appear. The car can be steered without power assist, but it can require a lot more muscle to turn the wheel, especially at low speeds. Because of the difficulty, the car could be more susceptible to a crash.

The recall adds to the number of Chevrolet Cobalts that were included in a 2010 steering. That one included the Pontiac G5 as well. Chevrolet HHR and Saturn Ion, which are included the new recall, use the same power steering system.

In addition, the new recall adds to the Saturn Aura, Chevy Malibu and Malibu Maxx and Pontiac G6 that were the subject of a 2012 recall over steering problems.

The Cobalt, G5, HHR and Ion all are also part of GM's ignition switch recall, blamed for 12 deaths in the U.S. and one in Canada, that will the subject of a House subcommittee hearing Tuesday where CEO Mary Barra is scheduled to testify.

Cars included in the new recall:

Chevrolet Malibu: All from model year 2004 and 2005, and some from model year 2006, 2008 and 2009.
Chevrolet Malibu Maxx. All model year 2004 and 2005, and some from 2006.
Chevrolet HHR: Some non-turbocharged models from 2009 and 2010.
Chevrolet Cobalt: Some model year 2010 vehicles.
Saturn Aura: Some model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles.
Saturn Ion: All model year 2004 to 2007 vehicles.
Pontiac G6: All model year 2005, and some model year 2006, 2008 and 2009 vehicles.
picaman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2014, 06:58 PM   #3
picaman
Junior Member
picaman is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 25
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

The GM press release has more detail:

DETROIT – General Motors informed the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration today that it would recall more than 1.3 million vehicles in the U.S. that may experience a sudden loss of electric power steering assist.

If power steering assist is lost, a message displays on the Driver Information Center and a chime sounds to inform the driver. Steering control can be maintained because the vehicle will revert to manual steering, but greater driver effort would be required at low vehicle speeds, which could increase the risk of a crash.

Models subject to safety recall are the:

Chevrolet Malibu: All model year 2004 and 2005, and some model year 2006 and model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles
Chevrolet Malibu Maxx: All model year 2004 and 2005, and some 2006 model year
Chevrolet HHR (Non-Turbo): Some model year 2009 and 2010 vehicles
Chevrolet Cobalt: Some model year 2010 vehicles
Saturn Aura: Some model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles
Saturn ION: All model year 2004 to 2007 vehicles
Pontiac G6: All model year 2005, and some model year 2006 and model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles
Service parts installed into certain vehicles before May 31, 2010 under a previous safety recall
Depending on the vehicle, GM will replace free of charge either the power steering motor, the steering column, the power steering motor control unit or a combination of the steering column and the power steering motor control unit. Customers who previously paid for repairs of these parts would be eligible for reimbursement.

In addition, 309,160 non-turbocharged Chevrolet HHRs from the 2006-2008 model years (and several hundred 2009 models) and 96,324 Saturn IONs from the 2003 model year that are not subject to these recalls will be given lifetime warranties for replacement of the electronic power steering motor.

“With these safety recalls and lifetime warranties, we are going after every car that might have this problem, and we are going to make it right,” said Jeff Boyer, vice president, GM Global Vehicle Safety. “We have recalled some of these vehicles before for the same issue and offered extended warranties on others, but we did not do enough.”

The 2004-2007 Saturn ION, the 2009-2010 Chevrolet HHR and the 2010 Chevrolet Cobalt are included in previously announced recalls for ignition switches that may not meet GM specification for torque performance. Repairs for the ignition switch and power steering assist may require separate dealership visits depending on parts availability.

GM expects to take a charge of up to approximately $750 million in the first quarter, primarily for the cost of recall-related repairs announced in the quarter. This amount includes a previously disclosed $300 million charge for three safety actions announced on March 17 and the ignition switch recall announced Feb. 25.
picaman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2014, 10:45 PM   #4
choitzs
New Member
choitzs is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 4
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

So my 2003 Saturn Ion should be covered then? Because I know for a fact that the steering is way off. The dealership has my car currently and I assume they will look into this as well before returning it to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by picaman View Post
The GM press release has more detail:

DETROIT – General Motors informed the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration today that it would recall more than 1.3 million vehicles in the U.S. that may experience a sudden loss of electric power steering assist.

If power steering assist is lost, a message displays on the Driver Information Center and a chime sounds to inform the driver. Steering control can be maintained because the vehicle will revert to manual steering, but greater driver effort would be required at low vehicle speeds, which could increase the risk of a crash.

Models subject to safety recall are the:

Chevrolet Malibu: All model year 2004 and 2005, and some model year 2006 and model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles
Chevrolet Malibu Maxx: All model year 2004 and 2005, and some 2006 model year
Chevrolet HHR (Non-Turbo): Some model year 2009 and 2010 vehicles
Chevrolet Cobalt: Some model year 2010 vehicles
Saturn Aura: Some model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles
Saturn ION: All model year 2004 to 2007 vehicles
Pontiac G6: All model year 2005, and some model year 2006 and model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles
Service parts installed into certain vehicles before May 31, 2010 under a previous safety recall
Depending on the vehicle, GM will replace free of charge either the power steering motor, the steering column, the power steering motor control unit or a combination of the steering column and the power steering motor control unit. Customers who previously paid for repairs of these parts would be eligible for reimbursement.

In addition, 309,160 non-turbocharged Chevrolet HHRs from the 2006-2008 model years (and several hundred 2009 models) and 96,324 Saturn IONs from the 2003 model year that are not subject to these recalls will be given lifetime warranties for replacement of the electronic power steering motor.

“With these safety recalls and lifetime warranties, we are going after every car that might have this problem, and we are going to make it right,” said Jeff Boyer, vice president, GM Global Vehicle Safety. “We have recalled some of these vehicles before for the same issue and offered extended warranties on others, but we did not do enough.”

The 2004-2007 Saturn ION, the 2009-2010 Chevrolet HHR and the 2010 Chevrolet Cobalt are included in previously announced recalls for ignition switches that may not meet GM specification for torque performance. Repairs for the ignition switch and power steering assist may require separate dealership visits depending on parts availability.

GM expects to take a charge of up to approximately $750 million in the first quarter, primarily for the cost of recall-related repairs announced in the quarter. This amount includes a previously disclosed $300 million charge for three safety actions announced on March 17 and the ignition switch recall announced Feb. 25.
choitzs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 06:37 AM   #5
picaman
Junior Member
picaman is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 25
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

"GM dealers will replace the power steering motor and other parts for free. Spokesman Alan Adler said owners will be notified of the recall the week of April 28 and will be told when parts are available after that."

Watch your mailbox for more letters.

picaman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 03:28 PM   #6
lgodave
Senior Member
lgodave will become famous soon enough
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: WI
Posts: 1,683
 

2003 ION-3 Sedan
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

So what was "Special" about the '03 ION's Steering that it was given "Lifetime Warranty" vs Replacement Status? Hard time thinking was actually different from the one used in rest of the Model run.
lgodave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 03:54 PM   #7
Dutchman1954
Member
Dutchman1954 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 84
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Watching the Congressional hearing with the current GM CEO. She's holding her own. It's becoming very apparent that they needed to be grilling the people originally responsible, not the one stuck trying to clean up the mess.
Dutchman1954 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 05:20 PM   #8
picaman
Junior Member
picaman is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 25
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by lgodave View Post
So what was "Special" about the '03 ION's Steering that it was given "Lifetime Warranty" vs Replacement Status? Hard time thinking was actually different from the one used in rest of the Model run.
I don't get that either. Just like I didn't get why they didn't include the Ion in the original Cobalt ignition recall.
picaman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 05:47 PM   #9
2006 ion2
Master Member
2006 ion2 has a spectacular aura about2006 ion2 has a spectacular aura about2006 ion2 has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Da U.P, EH!
Posts: 8,863
 

2007 ION-2 Sedan
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

when I talked to GM back when the cobalt was first recalled for the power steering motor, they said it has the same motor, but because one or two other parts in the line from the steering wheel to the wheels was different, they weren't prone to failure. basically, a BS excuse to get away with not spending money.
...
2007 Saturn Ion 2
2003 Chevrolet venture lt

trifecta dealer for the U.P. and WI. There is no two door ion. Proudly driving one of the last saturns produced before gm killed the brand.
2006 ion2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 08:33 PM   #10
col_dude190
Advanced Member
col_dude190 has a spectacular aura aboutcol_dude190 has a spectacular aura aboutcol_dude190 has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Erie
Posts: 633

2006 VUE Red Line
2004 ION-3 Quad Coupe
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by lgodave View Post
So what was "Special" about the '03 ION's Steering that it was given "Lifetime Warranty" vs Replacement Status? Hard time thinking was actually different from the one used in rest of the Model run.
Probably not enough reports of issues with 2003's to justify the recall. Rather than spending the money to replace all of the motors for they 03's under recall, they opted to just replace them anytime there is an issue. It will end up being cheap for them in the long run.

I had high hopes when they finally recalled the power steering for the IONs. Unfortunately, this just feels like another GM cop out. Yes the lifetime warranty is something, but GM should have replaced them all.
col_dude190 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 08:37 PM   #11
col_dude190
Advanced Member
col_dude190 has a spectacular aura aboutcol_dude190 has a spectacular aura aboutcol_dude190 has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Erie
Posts: 633

2006 VUE Red Line
2004 ION-3 Quad Coupe
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2006 ion2 View Post
when I talked to GM back when the cobalt was first recalled for the power steering motor, they said it has the same motor, but because one or two other parts in the line from the steering wheel to the wheels was different, they weren't prone to failure. basically, a BS excuse to get away with not spending money.
It's stories like this that are so frustrating. GM hid behind smoke and mirrors for so long trying to make it look like there were no issues, doing whatever they could to avoid replacing parts that they knew were faulty. Did they really think that people would stop reporting issues with these cars and that these problems would just go away on their own? GM is going to end up paying dearly for the way it's handled these problems, in both fines and lost business.
col_dude190 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 09:48 PM   #12
2006 ion2
Master Member
2006 ion2 has a spectacular aura about2006 ion2 has a spectacular aura about2006 ion2 has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Da U.P, EH!
Posts: 8,863
 

2007 ION-2 Sedan
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

That was right from their mouths as their excuse for not recalling the ion. And since when was it a lifetime warranty? Last I checked it was only 10 years or 100k miles.
...
2007 Saturn Ion 2
2003 Chevrolet venture lt

trifecta dealer for the U.P. and WI. There is no two door ion. Proudly driving one of the last saturns produced before gm killed the brand.
2006 ion2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 09:56 PM   #13
col_dude190
Advanced Member
col_dude190 has a spectacular aura aboutcol_dude190 has a spectacular aura aboutcol_dude190 has a spectacular aura about
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Erie
Posts: 633

2006 VUE Red Line
2004 ION-3 Quad Coupe
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2006 ion2 View Post
That was right from their mouths as their excuse for not recalling the ion. And since when was it a lifetime warranty? Last I checked it was only 10 years or 100k miles.
I have no doubt that somebody at GM told you that. Probably one of many BS reasons given why they didn't recall the IONs as a part of the original recall.

All of the '04-'07 IONs, along with various other models, are being recalled. The '03 IONs, along with a few other models are being given lifetime warranties instead of recalls. See the GM press release on the recall/warranty program below:

DETROIT – General Motors informed the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration today that it would recall more than 1.3 million vehicles in the U.S. that may experience a sudden loss of electric power steering assist.

If power steering assist is lost, a message displays on the Driver Information Center and a chime sounds to inform the driver. Steering control can be maintained because the vehicle will revert to manual steering, but greater driver effort would be required at low vehicle speeds, which could increase the risk of a crash.

Models subject to safety recall are the:

Chevrolet Malibu: All model year 2004 and 2005, and some model year 2006 and model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles
Chevrolet Malibu Maxx: All model year 2004 and 2005, and some 2006 model year
Chevrolet HHR (Non-Turbo): Some model year 2009 and 2010 vehicles
Chevrolet Cobalt: Some model year 2010 vehicles
Saturn Aura: Some model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles
Saturn ION: All model year 2004 to 2007 vehicles
Pontiac G6: All model year 2005, and some model year 2006 and model year 2008 and 2009 vehicles
Service parts installed into certain vehicles before May 31, 2010 under a previous safety recall
Depending on the vehicle, GM will replace free of charge either the power steering motor, the steering column, the power steering motor control unit or a combination of the steering column and the power steering motor control unit. Customers who previously paid for repairs of these parts would be eligible for reimbursement.

In addition, 309,160 non-turbocharged Chevrolet HHRs from the 2006-2008 model years (and several hundred 2009 models) and 96,324 Saturn IONs from the 2003 model year that are not subject to these recalls will be given lifetime warranties for replacement of the electronic power steering motor.

“With these safety recalls and lifetime warranties, we are going after every car that might have this problem, and we are going to make it right,” said Jeff Boyer, vice president, GM Global Vehicle Safety. “We have recalled some of these vehicles before for the same issue and offered extended warranties on others, but we did not do enough.”

Link to full press release:
http://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/n...-steering.html
col_dude190 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 02:01 PM   #14
kg6mvb
Member
kg6mvb has a spectacular aura aboutkg6mvb has a spectacular aura about
 
kg6mvb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: DM65pe
Posts: 351
 

2003 ION-1 Sedan
2002 SL2
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by lgodave View Post
So what was "Special" about the '03 ION's Steering that it was given "Lifetime Warranty" vs Replacement Status? Hard time thinking was actually different from the one used in rest of the Model run.
Way back when the 2004 models came out, Saturn claimed "The electric steering has been revised for improved feel at highway speeds..." along with a few other improvements.

Something was changed. It could be as simple as different programming, or the hardware may have changed (I don't know). Apparently it is enough of a change that our 2003's are not part of the recall. So far (knock on plastic), I have never had a problem with the power steering on my 2003.
...
Proud to be a member of both the Ham Radio and Saturn Cults.

Avitar is a Saturn V rocket engine.
kg6mvb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 11:20 AM   #15
kaviation
Senior Member
kaviation has a spectacular aura aboutkaviation has a spectacular aura aboutkaviation has a spectacular aura about
 
kaviation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Posts: 1,064
 

2003 ION-2 Quad Coupe
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by col_dude190 View Post
Probably not enough reports of issues with 2003's to justify the recall. Rather than spending the money to replace all of the motors for they 03's under recall, they opted to just replace them anytime there is an issue. It will end up being cheap for them in the long run.

I had high hopes when they finally recalled the power steering for the IONs. Unfortunately, this just feels like another GM cop out. Yes the lifetime warranty is something, but GM should have replaced them all.
I remember calling, when they were recalling the pontiacs, I complained about stiffness in my steering but no messages, unfortunately its my steering universal thats been giving me issues, but I plan on keeping this car for as long as financially feasible, so I'll take the lifetime warranty, but I can assure you in the fine print its a "one time replacement" after the replacement warranty expires.

Probably not all that many 03's out there anyway. Def not going with GM next time though, unless they have several years without any more Recalls with a model I like.
...
2003 Ion QC- Sold August of 2015
2016 Toyota RAV4 LE AWD
2004 Ion Redline
Meth Injection, WOT Box, Stage 2, Fidanza aluminum Flywheel, Spec clutch Stage 2+

I ENJOY WHAT I DO- I DO WHAT I ENJOY
kaviation is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 07:18 PM   #16
Cougarstang
Member
Cougarstang is a jewel in the roughCougarstang is a jewel in the roughCougarstang is a jewel in the roughCougarstang is a jewel in the rough
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 217

2006 ION-2 Sedan
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaviation View Post
I remember calling, when they were recalling the pontiacs, I complained about stiffness in my steering but no messages, unfortunately its my steering universal thats been giving me issues, but I plan on keeping this car for as long as financially feasible, so I'll take the lifetime warranty, but I can assure you in the fine print its a "one time replacement" after the replacement warranty expires.

Probably not all that many 03's out there anyway. Def not going with GM next time though, unless they have several years without any more Recalls with a model I like.
I just lubricated the intermediate steering shaft, too. After spending some time thinking it was the power steering motor, it was the shaft all along.

I would still want the motor replaced under warranty, but the shaft is the first thing people should check if they have heavy/sticking steering and do not receive the "pwr steering" message in the IP
...
My ride: 2002 Ford Mustang GT, 4.6L v8, 5-speed manual
Wife's ride: 2006 Saturn ION 2, 5 speed manual
Gone but not forgotten: 2000 Saturn SL1, auto
Cougarstang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 07:38 PM   #17
GTSRider
Junior Member
GTSRider is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 32
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

I have an 03 with 165,000 on her....steering wheel " wines"
when wheel is turned.... but what really bothers me is a heavy clunk in CV axles at full turn.... I blamed original cv axles , so just put in new ones.....
same problem at full turn in parking situation..... I just won't turn wheel full turn any more....but I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this.
I think I just trashed 2 original good GM CV axles....cause new replacements do the same !
Pete
03 ION
Hudson Valley NY
GTSRider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 09:28 PM   #18
Citation84
Master Member
Citation84 has a spectacular aura aboutCitation84 has a spectacular aura about
 
Citation84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Tucson AZ
Posts: 3,000
 

2005 ION-1 Sedan
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cougarstang View Post
I just lubricated the intermediate steering shaft, too. After spending some time thinking it was the power steering motor, it was the shaft all along.

I would still want the motor replaced under warranty, but the shaft is the first thing people should check if they have heavy/sticking steering and do not receive the "pwr steering" message in the IP
The intermediate steering shaft has been a recurring problem on GM cars for years. My 99 Cavalier had to have the thing replaced at 20 something thousand miles [purchased new]. Have read about them causing noise and problems from the Lumina/Impala, Pontiacs, to the Chevy and GMC trucks
Citation84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 09:47 PM   #19
Cougarstang
Member
Cougarstang is a jewel in the roughCougarstang is a jewel in the roughCougarstang is a jewel in the roughCougarstang is a jewel in the rough
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 217

2006 ION-2 Sedan
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by Citation84 View Post
The intermediate steering shaft has been a recurring problem on GM cars for years. My 99 Cavalier had to have the thing replaced at 20 something thousand miles [purchased new]. Have read about them causing noise and problems from the Lumina/Impala, Pontiacs, to the Chevy and GMC trucks
I was shocked to find so much rust on an 8-year old steering shaft. My 12 year old mustang's intermediate shaft has almost no rust on it. I guess GM just cheaped out on these pieces
...
My ride: 2002 Ford Mustang GT, 4.6L v8, 5-speed manual
Wife's ride: 2006 Saturn ION 2, 5 speed manual
Gone but not forgotten: 2000 Saturn SL1, auto
Cougarstang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 10:15 PM   #20
Citation84
Master Member
Citation84 has a spectacular aura aboutCitation84 has a spectacular aura about
 
Citation84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Tucson AZ
Posts: 3,000
 

2005 ION-1 Sedan
Default Re: Power steering actually recalled, not just extended warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cougarstang View Post
I was shocked to find so much rust on an 8-year old steering shaft. My 12 year old mustang's intermediate shaft has almost no rust on it. I guess GM just cheaped out on these pieces
Article in Bloomberg News validates exactly what you are saying. Part of their demanding suppliers give prices as if their labor costs were the same as the Chinese or they would take their business off shore. No doubt to my mind that they "cheaped out".
Citation84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Has Your Saturn Been Recalled? Charlie General Saturn Discussion 7 10-24-2014 12:23 AM
Power Steering failure/recall & rattling steering marrika Ion General 8 05-01-2012 11:47 PM
Converting Power Steering to Manual Steering? cfg83 S-Series Mods 33 09-18-2007 10:26 PM
power steering leak/steering rack question Gadweller S-Series Tech 9 11-19-2005 03:18 PM
Recalled 4dhtrs S-Series General 8 03-15-2005 10:00 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:02 AM.

Advanced Forum Search | Advanced Photo Search


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
SaturnFans.com. The Saturn Enthusiasts Site.