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Old 03-19-2002, 09:31 PM   #1
94sc2boy
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1994 SC2
Default Oil Pan removal

Woo, having a blast working on my 94 sc2 with 5 speed. In the lame ass Chilton manual it mentions nothing about removing the crank pulley. Well I couldn't do it for the timing chain, and I can't do it now. Is there anyway to remove the oil pain with the crank pulley on there? The bolts hit the pulley and can't be backed out anymore.

Some suggestions on removal would be nice. I am planning on renting an air compressor and impact wrench in the morning, the guy seems to think that an electric one will do the trick. Last time an impact with a compressor was useless and I had to take to saturn. Any words of wisdom would be most appreciative.

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Old 03-19-2002, 10:12 PM   #2
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Unfortunatley for you the pulley does have to come off. The non-impact method of breaking the pulley bolt loose needs two people but we use it when we can't get the bolt free with our impacts. Tools needed---breaker bar [usually 1/2 drive 18-24" long] snipe for same if needed, a piece of wood or metal bar to go through the pulley and up against a part of the timing cover and the right size socket. One body uses the wood/bar through the pulley onto a point on the timing cover area to hold the pulley against rotation. The other body uses the breaker bar and socket on the bolt [snipe if needed] and starts grunting and groaning to break the bolt free. Other body grunts and groans to hold the pulley from turning. If the bodies are big enough the bolt will eventually break free. If not then the bodies wil break.

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Old 03-20-2002, 12:55 AM   #3
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uhhhhhhh, thats what I was afraid of.
thanks ssicarman

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Old 03-20-2002, 05:07 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally posted by ssicarman
If the bodies are big enough the bolt will eventually break free. If not then the bodies wil break.
LOL, exactly why I decided to pass this job up!

94sc2boy, sorry you missed or forgot my thread on this, it may have saved you some trouble. FWIW, here it is:

http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...&threadid=6246

I'm still trying to save up the cash so that I can have Saturn do this. I don't have breaker bars, and don't even know what a snipe is!

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Old 03-20-2002, 12:55 PM   #5
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Idea

Other books suggested to use a Pry-bar and a block of wood as well as socket wrench to do the job. Put the wood piece between pulleys (Crank & Water pump) then poke the pry bar through the Crank pulley slot to against something behind and crank the bolt free with the wrench.....

The wood piece is kinda optional, but it assures the Crank won't give if you don't hold the Pry bar well.....

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Old 03-22-2002, 11:02 AM   #6
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hells ya

the pulley is off, i don't know how but it is off.

I had a friend determined to remove this thing, and i told him it wasn't going to happen, he came over on his way to work and this is how it went.

we used a standard size racket it between the crank the "frame"the (bottom of racket at the 4'oclock mark in the pulley, nestled between that timing chain cover. The top part of the racket should be forced again your wheel well but its steel so it won't bend.)
We snaped a craftson 12 point 13/16 immediately(i guess he is stronger than me, time to take the andro!)

here is the tip, 6 point 13/16 2 extendions and a curl bar. We put the curl bar on there and turned.

I couldn't believe my eyes, that damn thing was turning. I never thouight I would see that day. I am so stoked thanks to everyone who helped out. This car is giving me so many headaches. thanks again.

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Old 03-22-2002, 01:40 PM   #7
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94sc2boy: So the pulley is off, is the oilpan come off easily without the need to touch the exhaust pipe too? I know there's a bracket there to remove, right under the exhaust pipe.

How much trouble to torque the Pulley back in correctly after then, same trick?

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Old 03-22-2002, 02:44 PM   #8
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oh its involved.

take off exhaust. the whole front pipe. then you have to take off tire, to get to the pulley and to loosen front mount on the block. Also after you get all the bolts out it takes a lot of cutting and cussing, because I think its the saturn sealer that holds it on there. That stuff works well. It is hard as hell to get off.

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Old 03-22-2002, 03:28 PM   #9
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Damn Saturn sealer!

I know what you're saying about the sealer--after I pulled my engine, during disassembly, I had a helluva time getting the pan off. Apparently I didn't slit the sealant enough to seperate it. After trying all of the normal "tricks" to get it off, I started prying a little--all the way around. I bent that mounting flange up like a pretzel! Funny thing is, after spending about 2 hours trying to straighten the pan and clean all the old sealant out of the groove, I called the dealership to find out the cost of a new oil pan.

Rob (my parts guy): "$45--in stock."
Me: "I'll be right there."
THUMP (sound of the old oil pan hitting the bottom of my trash can)

What's even more funny is that I didn't apply ENOUGH Saturn sealer to one small part of the pan during the re-assembly. I had a bad feeling when nothing squished out when I was torque the million oil pan bolts. So now it seeps just a bit and it's killing me that I have to get in there and do it again. CRIPES!

-Newt

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Old 03-24-2002, 06:01 AM   #10
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I'm sorry, Newt, but I'm just LMAO! After reading about all your hard work and anal-retentive attention to detail and documentation, an almost-enough, but not enough, dab of sealant on the oil pan is just too funny.

Hey, at least you didn't try to use the bent up one, that would've leaked big time. Lucky the new one was only $45.

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Old 03-24-2002, 09:26 PM   #11
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Roll Eyes

Are you guys having too much trouble to remove the exhaust pipe bolts? (From manifold down.....) I found mine are extremely corroded and how did you take the pipe out indeed?

Got the hoist to lift the whole car up, or just the ramps?! Cool....

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Old 03-25-2002, 09:46 AM   #12
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Jason,
Yeah, I wasn't too happy when I had the car up on the lift and saw the pan was wet on the backside. Like you say, after all that work and now a stupid leak... Well, at least the tranny case is holding--that's be a ton of work to fix that one!

qlara,
My cat bolts were beyond help. 6 years of Minnesota winters really took their toll on the fasteners down there. I got the whole car up on jackstands and then buzzed the nuts off with a Dremel tool. Make sure you have the nice fiber-reinforced cut-off wheels--those small, thin cut-off wheel tend to explode easily if you're not cutting perpendicualr to the axis of rotation. (don't forget your safety glasses!)

When I installed the new system, I replaced all the fasteners with stainless just in case I had to do this again within the next few years. Good thing I did--when I replaced the stock system over a year ago, I installed the SPS stainless cat-back tubing, but recently sold that off in favor of the Thermal R&D system--very nice.

-Newt

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Old 03-25-2002, 10:09 AM   #13
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Newt: Thanks for the nice tips about the exhaust part. So you indeed lift the whole car (front and back) on just Jack-stands and still got enough clearance on ground to do cuttings, wow! :o:

Btw, how did you manage to cut off the tail section in order to get the old stock muffler out? (You know, that section is completed in one piece and cross the rear cross-memeber.....) Did you cut off the front manifold bolts (Down from engine block) too?

Time for some cutting tools shopping....

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Old 03-25-2002, 10:32 AM   #14
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Yup--I was able to jack up the car one side at a time and prop it up with jack stands. I had plenty of room to work--even on the creeper. In fact, during one late evening, I even fell asleep under the car on the creeper! Not too smart on my part, but that's what the jack stands are there for.

As recommended by various exhaust installation instructions, I cut the exhaust tubing in front of the rear suspension. I bought a tool from Sears that made the job a snap--it's specifically for cutting exhaust tubing. It has 4 little cutter wheels and a spring loaded handle. It was pretty cheap too--maybe $15 or so. I've used it about 5 times on various cars so it has paid for it may times over. I've used a Sawzall as well and that's like using a back-hoe to plant gardenias in a rock garden!

When you say the front manifold bolts, you mean the three that go from the cast iron exhaust manifold to the downpipe? If so, I got really lucky--they actually threaded right out. I almost soiled myself! The support brakcet (attached to the underside of the tranny) was pretty tough but eventually came out as well.

On a somewhat related note...if anyone has ever replace the OEM, non-stainless steel muffler hanger strap, you'd love how the Thermal R&D muffler mounts. They've welded a couple of stainless rods to the top of the muffler. Those rods come together and are bent into a 90 degree angle parallel to the underside of the body (or ground). The rods just slide right into the rubber block attached to the underside of the car. Very nice! Add that to the fact that all the tubing fits perfectly (unlike the SPS tubing) and it's held together using 2-bolt flanges with gaskets and you understand why it costs as much as it does--you definitely get what you pay for.

-Newt

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Old 03-25-2002, 04:34 PM   #15
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Newt: Exactly, that's the 3-bolt I'm talking about running down from the front manifold. Guess I should try my luck later......no immediate need to remove pipe yet.

For the Exhaust Pipe cutting tool from Sears you mentioned, can you post the Sears' Mft numbers or model something like that? Guess it's a very nice tool to do DIY pipe swapping at home....thanks again!

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Old 03-26-2002, 10:39 AM   #16
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Craftsman cut-off tool

Sears Item #00947607000
Mfr. Model #47607
$19.99 on-line at www.sears.com

http://www.sears.com/sr/product/summ...id=00947607000

I don't know if that link will work...

The tool is simple to use. Unscrew the screwdriver handle until the jaws just clear the diameter of the tubing, tighten the handle until the cutter wheels make contact, rotate the tool vigorously at least 90 degrees back and forth (we're still talking about exhaust systems, right?), then, tighten the handle to cut deeper and repeat until you're all the way through the wall of the tubing. Very slick. Takes less than a minute to get through the wimpy stock tubing.

Kind of off-topic on the original post (sorry 94sc2boy), but I just got some pics developed from the Thermal R&D exhaust install (on my 1995 SC2). Check out the pic (please excuse the filthy car--it was a couple months ago in the dead of winter...)

-Newt
Attached Images
File Type: jpg thermalexhaust1.jpg (27.8 KB, 32 views)

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Old 03-26-2002, 10:42 AM   #17
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Another pic...
Attached Images
File Type: jpg thermalexhaust7.jpg (24.9 KB, 31 views)

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Old 03-26-2002, 11:13 AM   #18
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Neat, very neat tool.....thanks for all the great info, newt!

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