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Old 04-07-2007, 09:59 AM   #1
JADEDSL2
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1993 SL2
1991 SL2
Default Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

Background: 93 SL TBI Sohc 5spd. Cracked head. 99 SC2 MPFI DOHC 5spd donor car.

I know I need:
Engine
Wiring Harness
PCM
Throttle Cable
Part of the fuel line?
Exhaust downpipe-due to different length

I'm also getting a timing chain setup and new clutch to use with the dohc in my SL.

Is there anything else, and I mean anything that I am overlooking that I will need to swap along with these items for it to work? If so, I have the entire coupe, so getting the parts isn't a problem, I just need to know what all I need for sure before I start here. Thanks in advance to EVERYONE who has any input on the subject. I need to get this swap done as soon as possible, as I am currently driving my dad's 22 1/2 foot GMC Savanna that gets 9-13 mpgs. It's killing me. Post quick please! Thanks again guys, and gals.

~Jaded

Funny, as much as I know about my beloved DOHCs and Saturns in general, and I haven't ever been privy to swapping engines.

...
"1G8ZJ5472MZ134321"-my Jaded, I will never forget.
"1G8ZF5594PZ249184"-Trinity, for three are now one.

Last edited by JADEDSL2; 04-07-2007 at 10:06 AM.. Reason: more details

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Old 04-08-2007, 12:02 AM   #2
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Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

rear oxygen sensor for the exhaust. The PCM will throw a fit if it doesn't see one. Your best bet is to get a wiring harness from a SL2 (obd1) and computer from a OBD1 car. Converting to OBD2 is not easy, and you will have headaches.

...
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2009 BMW 128i -> sold
2003 VW GTI 1.8T -> wrecked
1998 Saturn SL2 -> parted out
1995 Saturn SL2 -> sold
1995 Saturn SL2 -> sold

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Old 04-08-2007, 12:19 AM   #3
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Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

Instrument cluster.

Yeah, I'm thinking your best option is an OBD-I DOHC PCM (M-O-U-S-E....). D'OH, but then you're dealing with the different resistances of the fuel injectors, so you may need an OBD-I DOHC fuel rail. And of course, you'll need to tee in, or drill another hole in the head, for the temp gauge sender.

Maybe just find a donor engine that's a little closer vintage....

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Old 04-08-2007, 04:56 AM   #4
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Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

Quote:
Originally Posted by madpogue View Post
Maybe just find a donor engine that's a little closer vintage....
That's what I was thinking. It seems swapping from OBD-I to OBD-II is a pain in the arse....and not just with Saturns. It so happens that someone in the car club I'm in just did it with another kind of car....I forget what car....but it was an import (it's a mostly import car club)...and I remember them saying that it took like a month.

...
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If you're a car begging for your life, wouldn't you want someone to add fluids?

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Old 04-11-2007, 05:21 PM   #5
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Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JADEDSL2 View Post
Background: 93 SL TBI Sohc 5spd. Cracked head. 99 SC2 MPFI DOHC 5spd donor car.

I know I need:
Engine
Wiring Harness
PCM
Throttle Cable
Part of the fuel line?
Exhaust downpipe-due to different length

I'm also getting a timing chain setup and new clutch to use with the dohc in my SL.

Is there anything else, and I mean anything that I am overlooking that I will need to swap along with these items for it to work? If so, I have the entire coupe, so getting the parts isn't a problem, I just need to know what all I need for sure before I start here. Thanks in advance to EVERYONE who has any input on the subject. I need to get this swap done as soon as possible, as I am currently driving my dad's 22 1/2 foot GMC Savanna that gets 9-13 mpgs. It's killing me. Post quick please! Thanks again guys, and gals.

~Jaded

Funny, as much as I know about my beloved DOHCs and Saturns in general, and I haven't ever been privy to swapping engines.
Ok, the problem is, I don't have the means to come by those things. I have a 99 DOHC at my disposal, and I know the swap is possible. I know I need the entire powertrain/wiring harness/pcm from the DOHC, including all sensors (both of the o2 sensors as well) That's not the problem. Even if I have to swap the instrument clusters, I don't care, because my 93 is pretty barren on the inside. What I'm really wanting to know is can it be done? The PCM doesn't have anything to do with body accessories does it? The body has it's own module, so switching the 99 powertrain into the 93 shouldn't pose a problem with such things as the 99 having power accessories, and the 93 having manual accessories, right?

Basically, what I have to do, would be to swap the entire powertrain, and electrical setup, including the interior side harness and instrument cluster into the 93. Now if I put ALL of the 99's "front end" more or less into the 93, it should run. I don't see why it won't. The reason I'm so adamant about doing this swap is that I own both the 93 SL, and the 99 SC2. I can't get the 99 legal because of title issues with the past owner, but it is a complete vehicle that runs with NO problems. It doesn't even burn oil. Not a drop!

...
"1G8ZJ5472MZ134321"-my Jaded, I will never forget.
"1G8ZF5594PZ249184"-Trinity, for three are now one.

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Old 04-11-2007, 05:40 PM   #6
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1996 SW2
Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

The most obvious thing that won't work is the '99 cluster in the '93 car. A gen-1 DOHC cluster _might_ work, but you'd be cobbling together a one-off wiring harness at the very least.

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Old 04-11-2007, 07:27 PM   #7
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Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

Quote:
Originally Posted by madpogue View Post
The most obvious thing that won't work is the '99 cluster in the '93 car. A gen-1 DOHC cluster _might_ work, but you'd be cobbling together a one-off wiring harness at the very least.
why wouldn't the 99 cluster work if I bring the entire wiring harness (both sides) with the 99 powertrain?

Really, what is going to happen is I'm squeezing a 99 SC2 drivetrain (like, everything) into a 93 SL body. The only thing not 99 will be the 93 body. It's like I'm almost cutting off the front end of the 99 and welding it to the 93, for all intents and purposes. Everything under the hood of the 99 except the MP3, which I am using the MP2 from my car instead. Why won't that work? I'm even considering swapping the dashes (like, as a whole unit). Whatever I have to do to put the functionality of a 99 into a 93 (minus power windows/door locks, and with the older, MP2 trans).

...
"1G8ZJ5472MZ134321"-my Jaded, I will never forget.
"1G8ZF5594PZ249184"-Trinity, for three are now one.

Last edited by JADEDSL2; 04-11-2007 at 07:34 PM..

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Old 04-12-2007, 12:34 AM   #8
madpogue
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1996 SW2
Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

Look at the '99 cluster. Now look at the '93 cluster. Now go back and look at the '99 cluster again, and explain how it's gonna FIT in the '93 car.

And AFAIK, your idea about swapping the whole dash won't work, as the structure underneath is different. I'm sure somebody's done it, but it would be at yet more expense, which, from what you're saying, is an issue.

Look, you've got a car with good body that's worth something, And an engine that's worth something. If money is tight, sell one or the other, and use the proceeds to buy what you need to make one good car. You don't have that right now.

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Old 04-12-2007, 12:34 AM   #9
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Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

So basically...no matter what anyone tells you...you're going to go ahead and try to make this work. Have at it....good luck. Lemme know when you give up and you're ready to scrap both of em.

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Old 04-12-2007, 01:06 AM   #10
madpogue
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1996 SW2
Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

Or, when you've done enough duct-taping, zip-tying and welding, and have spent enough time at (given how much you stand to "save") probably $2.50 an hour, and manage to frankenstein one good car out of this, post some pics.

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Old 04-12-2007, 03:19 PM   #11
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Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

Probably going to need the fuel pump as well to get the right PSI not to mention the returnless style. Might as well move the tank over too.

They stuck a 2nd gen dash in a 1st gen shell in 95. IDK how they did it but you'll figure it out.

Are you subject to any emissions inspections when you're done? It'll probably run but the computer will complain about something stupid missing.

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Old 04-14-2007, 11:40 AM   #12
JADEDSL2
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Default Re: Oooookay. Swap time, and I need input other than what is in the guide...

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljefino View Post
Probably going to need the fuel pump as well to get the right PSI not to mention the returnless style. Might as well move the tank over too.

They stuck a 2nd gen dash in a 1st gen shell in 95. IDK how they did it but you'll figure it out.

Are you subject to any emissions inspections when you're done? It'll probably run but the computer will complain about something stupid missing.

Why would it complain about something missing? I'm transferring everything that has anything to do with the pcm's needs. I've already swapped the tanks/pumps/fuel lines, and am in the process of swapping the powertrain right now. I talked to a couple long-time techs at my area Saturn dealership, and I was reassured that the dashes will interchange completely, well, we'll see about that, but even if they don't, a little custom fabrication never scared me. I've done custom before, I'll do it again. When I'm done, I suppose you'll open the hood and see everything from the 99 under it, except the P/S rack. I'm keeping my manual steering. I've decided to go ahead and use the MP3 with it, so my MP2 will be going to my friend who has a 95 in need of a trans. As far as what's left of the interior (mostly gutted anyway), you'll see the 99 dash/ steering wheel/ center console/ front seats/ and seat belt setup (which should also prove to be interesting). The only things I'll have to remotely worry about so far as compatability issues is lighting (inside and out) and stereo wiring. Both of which I am completely capable of ...ahem...engineering to work. Call me crazy, doubt me, whatever, but I will get this project done, and when I do, I think I'll maybe be able to claim the ONLY OBD2 DOHC first gen SL anywhere. Wouldn't that be sweet. Thanks for the insights, and the criticism. I enjoy both! Take care all, and I'll keep you updated as this "freakshow" begins to take shape.

...
"1G8ZJ5472MZ134321"-my Jaded, I will never forget.
"1G8ZF5594PZ249184"-Trinity, for three are now one.

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