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Old 05-29-2009, 02:40 PM   #1
Frankd1
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1998 SL1
Default I just got a P0507

Yesterday the SES light came on, today I went to the parts store to have it read but the SES went away on my way there. Checked for a stored code and it came up as: P0507, idle air control system RPM higher than expected.

Parts guy cleared the code but it came back on when I arrived home. I'm assuming its the same one. (I can't wait to get my new computer based scanner this weekend!!).

I didn't notice anything funny with the RPM so maybe a cleaning of the IAC for starters?

I throughly cleaned the throttle body including the tip of the IAC about 4 months ago so I can't imagine it is gummed already but its possible I guess.

Anyone here have any experience with this SES?

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Old 05-29-2009, 02:57 PM   #2
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Default Re: I just got a P0507

Maybe try changing out the IAC valve?

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Old 05-29-2009, 04:18 PM   #3
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Default Re: I just got a P0507

A small vacuum leak will do that also.

Its one or the other. The code means that the RPM is higher tahn the PCM command and it will not come down.

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Old 05-30-2009, 12:06 AM   #4
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Default Re: I just got a P0507

I will pop out the IAC and clean if required and check the o-ring.

OldNuc are you refering to a vacuum leak at the IAC o-ring or elsewhere?

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Old 05-30-2009, 12:20 AM   #5
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1998 SC2
Default Re: I just got a P0507

Vacuum leak on anything connected to the intake. Split PCV hose. Purge solenoid line falling off of purge solenoid, its on the back of the block and teh vacuum line connects to the throttle body. Leaking injector o-ring. You can look at some of them and then gently spray brake cleaner along the top and bottom of the intake where it meets the head and at everything connected. EGR gasket. Throttle body gasket. Once you get your scanner you can look at the MAP signal, RPM command, IAC position, and RPM and figure out which is the problem.

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Old 05-30-2009, 01:18 AM   #6
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Default Re: I just got a P0507

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldNuc View Post
gently spray brake cleaner along the top and bottom of the intake where it meets the head
Done.

OP: Post your vitals next time IN the thread. It makes diagnosis MUCH easier. Old Nuc most likely would have told you exactly where to look first instead of listing out possible places to look.

OP's Car: '98 SOHC

Though usually on 3rd gen SOHC, the intake manifold gasket has been known to be bad on a handful of 2nd gen SOHC cars. The above test should prove positive and diagnosis is then confirmed as a bad intake manifold gasket. The steps in my How-to can are very similar however iirc the number of bolts is different. Everything else is the same including torque spec.

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Old 06-01-2009, 04:45 PM   #7
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Default Re: I just got a P0507

Ok thanks guys, I did check all those items that OldNuc mentioned a few months ago but I will check again to see if something new has developed.

The SES light turned itself off today but I checked with my new scanner to see what the PCM had stored. The Scanner is the OBDscan-Apex by Harrison R&D, here is the freeze frame data from when the light came on last time:

-P0507
-fuel system closed loop mode
-calculated load 19%
-coolant temp 185F
-short term FT, B1 -00.8%
-long term FT, B1 -02.3%
-manifold absolute pressure 8.3inhg
-RPM 743
-throttle position 0.4%

Some live data that I was checking:
-at 750rpm idle the ignition advance was jumping around from 14 degrees to 25 to 30 degrees, the numbers on the screen were changing very rapidly.
When I held the RPM steady at 2000 the ignition advance was steady at 25 degrees.
Is it supposed to jump like that when at idle?

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Old 06-02-2009, 07:55 PM   #8
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Default Re: I just got a P0507

OldNuc,
Any thoughts on the freeze frame data that was captured the last time the SES light was set?
I have driven about 135 miles since it last turned itself off (yesterday morning) and it has not come back on.
I will go over all of the possible vacum leak areas again.
This weekend I am also going to look at live data during idle and driving to see what the readings are, the ignition advance fluctuations at idle have me interested - I will start a new thread to keep things separate.

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Old 06-02-2009, 09:47 PM   #9
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1998 SC2
Default Re: I just got a P0507

Looking at the freeze frame can prove enlightening.
Engine is just barely at operating temperature.
MAP is high, lower than expected manifold vacuum.

If you have been reading the cboss P0172 saga thread you will see that his problem was caused by a timing chain that was severely stretched (probably cheap Chinese chain) and installed one tooth off on the exhaust side. major symptoms were a slightly low manifold vacuum and a very jumpy idle RPM. Increased RPM tightens up the chain so the mechanical valve timing stabilizes. Whipping the timing around will cause the engine to not have a stable RPM.

How many miles on the engine?

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Old 06-03-2009, 09:27 PM   #10
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Default Re: I just got a P0507

OldNuc,
When the SES came on the engine had not been running for all that long so that may account for the 185F temp. I know that regular driving in the city has the needle at the 3/8ths mark and on the highway just a very small amount below 3/8ths. I will be replacing the thermostat anyways as it is original and I will be doing the water pump - still haven't got around to it, but thats another story.

I followed the cboss thread! I saw where he corrected the ignition advance fluctuations with the new timing chain.

My idle is steady, there is just the variations in ignition advance.

170,000 miles on this SOHC engine, oil level is never allowed to run below 1/2 way on the hatch marks of the dipstick.

Timing chain is original so there should be no issue of incorrect installation!

If the timing chain is stretched should you hear that diesel engine sound?

I will check again for any vacum leaks this weekend that may be related to the P0507 so that I can conclude this thread.

I am going to take live data with the scanner once the engine is warmed up and I will post in a separate thread so that I can keep the issues separate for clarity, we can analyze my engine performance from there.

Thanks again!

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Old 06-03-2009, 10:33 PM   #11
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Default Re: I just got a P0507

You do not hear anything from the chain until it is very far gone. With 170K on the engine it is entirely possible that the tensioner is all the way out and the chain is a bit loose. A loose chain will let the timing vary with a slight change in engine load. The only way to tell is to pull the cam cover and see if its loose on the slack side when you slowly turn the engine in the clockwise direction. If all is well there will be no slack in the chain. The single row roller chain is real easy to stretch with heat and any lack of oil. Once stretched the stretching continues no matter what you do.

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Old 06-05-2009, 10:16 AM   #12
Frankd1
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Default Re: I just got a P0507

I checked for leaks today with brake cleaner in all of the usual spots as mentioned above and no change in idle so I think I am ok for vacuum leaks.

The SES hasn't come on lately so I think it may have been intermittent, it may also be an early sign that the IAC valve may be starting to show signs of weakness but I will deal with that later if and when it does start to give me trouble.

Off to get some live data now!

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