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Old 11-13-2017, 07:39 AM   #1
IT_Architect
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2006 VUE 3.5L
2006 VUE 3.5L
Default What we learned from the 3, 2006 Vues to make them quiet

We have 3, 06 Vues, with fwd, and 3.5s, one being a Red Line. Some of the big things I want is a good ride, and quiet. SUVs don't have their rear wheels sealed inside of a trunk, and Vues are light-weight with no real sound deadener, so the only way is to stop noise at its source. I thought I would share our experiences since we now have 3 of them.

- Wind Noise is something I hear a lot about. We don't have it anymore. The first one never had any wind noise. The second one we attributed to the roof carrier. The Red Line by 30-35mph sounded like a winter storm on Little House on the Prairie, that we initially attributed to being the different shape of the front end. We heard plenty about air gaps of plastic panels and mirrors, but the first one was dead quiet. It turned out that none of these things had anything to do with what we were hearing. It was air flow and the windshield trim, someplace where it did not sound like where it was coming from. Try running a piece off 2" wide masking tape around the windshield that overlaps the windshield, trim, and body to determine if that is where you need to start looking. We masked the trim and windshield, and trim and paint, and put a very tiny bead of silicone sealer around them, and we did need it between the bezel and paint. No wind noise on any of them now. It has zero to do with gaps between plastic panels.

- For tires, we've learned the Nokian eNTYRE 215/70R16 100H are the the quietest, and the best on snow an ice by test. They are 75K tires, and they generate very little heat. The H is the speed rating of 130 mph. It's not like we drive those speeds but it does indicate the quality of the casing, which affects resistance to heat buildup, which affects gas mileage and the true life of the tire. They say you need to rotate the tires to keep them from getting noisy and vibrating, it is the mark of a poor tire, no matter that it costs. Rotate them for wear reasons. If you run them at 40 PSI all around, you will get a harder ride, but you will get better mileage and even wear. Mileage is checked on every fill-up and they get 20 mpg in the city and 27+ on the highway. With the trip odometer it is easy to track. If I ever see less than 20 mpg at a fill-up, it will always be a soft tire or the oil change place sabotaged you with 28-30 psi in the tires. (get a compressor to maintain the right pressure through the seasonal variations) The Red Line came with 18" wheels, but I bought 16" wheels from a 2008 Vue because their design was the same Red Line's stock 18" wheels, the hub and studs were the right size, and offset was very close. What I saved on tires paid for the wheels, and the 16s are far superior when it comes to ride, and traction in bad weather. We've traded in tires with few miles on them because we wouldn't put up with the noise. We don't listen to the horse pucky anymore about rotating tires every 6,000 miles. Even when you do, it doesn't help when you have junk tires.

- Wheel bearings are a common problem. Without good tires, it is difficult to determine if the noise is a tire noise or bearing noise. One Vue has 120,000 and has never needed a bearing, but the Red Line has about 106,000 and has had 2 replaced at 95,000, and the other Vue has had 4 replaced, two were replaced for noise, one of the two replaced bearings for noise again, and the other replaced again bearing for the ABS. She went cheap the first time on bearings and tires and ended up replacing both within a year. That last 100,000 miles, she hasn't had any issues.

- Brake rotors are another problem. Factory rotors seem to begin pulsating almost from the get-go. AutoZone and NAPA were not the answer. It turned out Advanced Auto Parts were the answer for all three. No pulsing on stops ever again. I don't know who makes their rotors, or even if our scenario is repeatable. All I know is the days of pulsating rotors are over for us.

- Quiet brakes took quite awhile to figure out The answer is not in the rotors, calipers, paying a lot for shoes, proper bedding, or spending a lot of money on "quality" parts. For us, the cure was stock pins with the ribbed rubber ones on the bottom where they are from the factory, OEM clips, and OEM shoes. No more creaking-groan when creeping forward with the brakes on. Also, make sure the the pads are on correctly. The wear indicators belong on the top-inside. When you hear one of them go off, you will find that the pads are evenly worn and down to the "last drop" of lining, and no scored rotors. The lower pins are stiffer than the top ones that way. However, the top of the pads where the rotor first enters while going forward also wears the fastest. The stiffer lower pins evens the wear, and the wear indicators need to be at the point of maximum wear, which is where the rotor first hits the pads in forward motion. They are so quiet now, I hear other noises, like the brake springs in the rear.
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Old 11-14-2017, 01:34 PM   #2
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2008 VUE 3.6L
Default Re: What we learned from the 3, 2006 Vues to make them quiet

IT,
Great write up of things to look at. It, combined with my one some time ago about how to silence a noisey front end, makes it possible for us to have nice quiet cars. I do have one minor disagreement with you on the brakes. I went with the Max Brakes pads and rotors and loved them, and they really helped stopping performance I feel. But I definitely that it is an all around combined effort of all the brake parts and pieces to get real silence from the brakes.
If I have one concern, and I read and understood what you were saying correctly, is that you sealed off all around the windshield and another couple of places. My concern with this is that several of those areas were deliberately left open for proper water drainage. Is this a problem at all now for you?

John
...
aka
Lord_Varon
07 Vue V6 AWD LOADED!!! aka SUPER CRITTER!!! Sadly gone, and definitely missed.
08 Equinox Sport 3.6 6 spd auto, AWD, even more loaded. And the jury is still out on it.
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Old 11-14-2017, 03:23 PM   #3
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2006 VUE 3.5L
2006 VUE 3.5L
Default Re: What we learned from the 3, 2006 Vues to make them quiet

Quote:
Originally Posted by lord_varon View Post
concern with this is that several of those areas were deliberately left open for proper water drainage. Is this a problem at all now for you? John
No. They are still open at the bottom.

I looked up your thread. Some good info there. To add to:
>Check the U-Joint up under the dash in the steering column. Tighten if needed….. DIY<
The problem is usually the intermediate shaft itself. There is a TSB on that issue that I applied to the Red Line. The TSB consists of a new bolt. You push the intermediate shaft up as far as it will go, and the bottom shaft as far down as it will go, and tighten the bolt. Depending on how bad the intermediate shaft is, will depend on how well it works because the real problem is the intermediate shaft needs to be replaced, which is neither cheap nor easy. It did not fix the Red Line completely. Most people don't buy the bolt. If I had it to do over, I wouldn't either.

Other:Red Lines are harder on things than regular Vues anyways because of the 18" wheels and stiffer springs and sway bars, but I learned some things about Red Lines I didn't know, thanks to the previous owner, who thought he was doing it a favor by replacing the factory stuff with "high performance". The aftermarket specs the same shocks for both regular and Red Line. Even the stock components look identical except for the part number on the box. They are also VERY different. You've probably heard of 90/10 uplocks for racing. Red Line shocks are 0/100 downlocks. When they hit a bump, it's all spring and zero shock absorber. During install, they almost fall down when you compress them to get them in. You will need to make up something to pull down hard enough to get the valves to open to extend them so you can bolt them in place after you get them in there. That is a VERY different situation than the other two Vues or any other shock I've ever put in where just steady pressure will extend it. The OEM shocks, which were not easy to find for a RL because they don't make them anymore, made it ride and handle like a dream. The additional hammering that had happened over time made things for me to fix from front to rear to make it quiet. The stock 18" wheels an big sway bars don't help the situation, but makes it more important that the suspension works as designed. The RLs look really nice, especially their interiors. For everything else, I like the regular Vues better, and you can also find body parts inexpensively anywhere. The safest driver in the family drives the RL, and you would be dead man if you put a tiny scratch on her car.
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Old 11-15-2017, 12:31 PM   #4
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2008 VUE 3.6L
Default Re: What we learned from the 3, 2006 Vues to make them quiet

IT,
I know what you mean on the difference in suspensions between the base and the RL. I totalled my 07 Vue Base, and ended up with an 08 Equinox Sport, 08 RL, as the replacement. The lower ride height and 18" wheels have it cornering very well, but the rest of the ride is toast. I am actually looking at determining what parts I need to swap out to get the standard version ride height back, I need the ground clearance where I live. After that I will decide on changing the rims to 17s, or stick with the 18, but either way, go to a taller tire for even more ride height. The added benefit would be taller sidewalls for a slightly more compliant ride.... yes, a little less handling in the curves, but I think that I can live with that.
I am still up in the air on how long I am going to keep the 08 as it has some serious issues that I was not aware of when I got it. If I can get them taken care of first, I may do the rest of it, but I have to get the major issues out of the way.

John.
...
aka
Lord_Varon
07 Vue V6 AWD LOADED!!! aka SUPER CRITTER!!! Sadly gone, and definitely missed.
08 Equinox Sport 3.6 6 spd auto, AWD, even more loaded. And the jury is still out on it.
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Old 11-15-2017, 02:03 PM   #5
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2006 VUE 3.5L
2006 VUE 3.5L
Default Re: What we learned from the 3, 2006 Vues to make them quiet

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Originally Posted by lord_varon View Post
...After that I will decide on changing the rims to 17s, or stick with the 18
It sounds as though you are driving the equivalent of the O8 Vue. The trick with wheels is not just the studs and bolt pattern as many just do, but also the hub diameter and offset. When you go through that, then it narrows the field a lot. The offset changes with the rim width too to maintain center, and thus tire clearance and proper suspension action and alignment, so you will do a little calculating. I won't go into calculating offset because there are places on the web and youtube that will do that better than I can here.

You can get an eye full of what is out there at Detroit Wheel's website and narrow it down by rim size and bolt circle. Then, with the OEM part number, you can find the hub diameter and offset. Then I calculated if the offset maintained the the same or close center of rim. You don't need to calculate offsets if the rims are the same widths as stock, you can just compare them. (Actually, I found a huge table of vehicle and wheel specs with rim sizes, hub diameters, bolt circles, and offsets somewhere to find the possibilities, but I don't know where it is now. Then I went to Detroit Wheel's website to find something I liked.) After I narrowed down what I wanted, I went to the car-part website to find out where they were.

The 08 Vue 16s is what I have on the RL now, PN 19177075. They were used on 2007-2010 Vues, but I've never seen them on anything but 2008 and newer. They look most like the stock 18s, look great in the flesh, and have held up to the salt perfectly (Like the 18s, which means lots better than our standard Vues), for the 2 years I've had the RL. The offset is close, and everything else is the same. I checked to see if the 6mm/.236" offset difference changed the camber compared to stock, and it didn't change at all. (Probably because it takes a lot to move the suspension, LOL!) The stock tire sizes maintain very near the same tire ODs across the 16, 17, and 18 to keep the speedometer the same, but you can calc what you want with the tire size. These are the specs for the Nokians which I included to illustrate how to use the numbers so you can just plug them into an Excel spreadsheet to play around with available tire sizes to get what you want.
Nokian eNTYRE
215/70R16 100H (215mm wide, 70% aspect ratio[Diameter = 406.4 + ((215mm x .7)*2)] or 707mm or 27.85 inches, R type radial / rim size in inches (16" 406.4mm), 100 (1764 lbs) load rating H speed rating(130 mph))
All Season Tread design
Mfg. Tread Life = 75,000 miles
Pressure range 24-44 PSI. (Set at 40 psi)
Uniform Tire Quality Grading Standards (UTQGS)
Tire Load = 100 (1764 lbs.)
Tire Speed = H (130 mph)
Tread Life Rating = 700
Traction Rating = A (above .47G on asphalt and .35G on concrete)
Tread Design = M + S (Mud & Snow All Season Radial)
Temperature Rating = A (resistance to heat generation)
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Old 11-15-2017, 02:40 PM   #6
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2006 VUE 3.5L
2006 VUE 3.5L
Default Re: What we learned from the 3, 2006 Vues to make them quiet

PS: I realize it is common practice to replace wheels only based on the hub diameter clearing the hub and bolt circle being the right size. That's not a good thing. The hub diameter is what should keep things centered and the load centered, not the lugs, and the right offset will not only make the suspension work right, it will be your best guarantee of tire clearance on the inside, and not hanging out past your fenders on the outside when you swap tires around. Also, you will see people even cheat the bolt circle a little to get the wheel they want and say it works fine, and fail to make the connection when they have other issues.

As if you don't already have enough to manage while picking out new wheels and tires, tires have min and max rim widths, which are usually pretty generous, but respecting their design specs, rather than just if they will mount on the rim, eliminates a multitude of issues.

Knowing if you are going to keep it is a big deal because if you are like me, you want to get what you want, and then invest in caring for it. That's where I am with the RL now. Beautiful car, runs perfect, but the whole idea of a Vue is to get away from rust. I've proven I can keep them from rusting underneath if I have a good starting point. If I sell it, it will be to replace it with one from another climate with little or no rust. There are few cars that can get excited about and the Saturn Vue's 2006-2007 with the plastic body panels and the Acura MDX powertrain is one of them. That is more fun for me than buying new every few years.

Last edited by IT_Architect; 11-15-2017 at 02:49 PM.
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