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Old 09-15-2010, 10:29 PM   #1
PB in Clt
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Default AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Hello all,

I just wanted to buy a set of replacement Schrader valves for a '92 SL-1. Cheap and easy, right? Wrong. Far too many options. I don't have access to the car, so maybe you can help me with this:

Port: The low side port is, I believe, a standard " port. The high side is smaller and requires an adapter. What size is the high side port thread?

Size: Are both Schrader valves the same size?

Valve: Should I get GM Standard? Large bore? JRA? High flow?

Material: Here's where I really got lost. I can choose between neoprene, HNBR, Teflon and more. Upgrades. Which is best for an R-12 system?

I know that's a lot of questions at one time, but thanks for any help.

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Old 09-16-2010, 12:02 AM   #2
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Are you converting from R12 to R134a or staying with R12? If I'm not mistaken, every R12 system uses the same 1/4" flare fitting for high and low side. Replacing the valve stems is straight forward; just buy a pair of R12 valve stems to replace the ones on there now. You'll need a valve stem tool for removal/replacement.

If you're converting over to R134a you'll need the adapters that screw onto the R12 fittings; the internal threads remain the same size 1/4" fitting but the exterior will be two different sizes made deliberately get away from mixing low and high side fittings/hoses/gauges from mistakes - the adapters simply screw on to each R12 1/4" flare fitting with an O-ring to seal and some contain threadlock to prevent unscrewing them once they're on. The externally machined quick couplers will be sized differently; the low side will be 13mm in diameter and the high side will be 16mm in diameter. The R134a quick couplers that fit over each fitting will match and be color coded; blue for low side, red for high side. The same for the sealing caps; blue for low side and red for high side. Most auto stores sell the two adapters as a packaged set in aluminum, complete with a valve stem extender to be able to press the R12 valve stems when screwed on. Or sold separately. Other adapters may have you remove the old valve stems from the R12 fittings as the new adapters will have the correct valves in place.

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Old 09-16-2010, 09:24 PM   #3
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Yes, I'm staying with R-12. If I understand your answer correctly, both Schrader valves are "standard" GM even though the Hi/Lo port sizes are different, right? My local AZ doesn't stock them, and they're considered special orders . In other words $$$. Somethings not right about that. I think I used to get these in bags of ten for @ $2.00.

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Old 09-16-2010, 09:28 PM   #4
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

At least for 134a Autozone lists them for $6 with cap...
http://www.autozone.com/autozone/par...mString=search
Could R12 be that much more?

-Robert

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB in Clt View Post
Yes, I'm staying with R-12. If I understand your answer correctly, both Schrader valves are "standard" GM even though the Hi/Lo port sizes are different, right? My local AZ doesn't stock them, and they're considered special orders . In other words $$$. Somethings not right about that. I think I used to get these in bags of ten for @ $2.00.

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Old 09-16-2010, 09:57 PM   #5
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Yes, I've seen that. With postage, tax, and shipping I was looking at @$12-15 for a bunch of unnecessary caps I don't need and valves that should cost , not $$$.

Thanks for the link and reply.

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Old 09-16-2010, 10:04 PM   #6
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

So in the end your goal is to save about $5??

-Robert


Quote:
Originally Posted by PB in Clt View Post
Yes, I've seen that. With postage, tax, and shipping I was looking at @$12-15 for a bunch of unnecessary caps I don't need and valves that should cost , not $$$.

Thanks for the link and reply.

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Old 09-16-2010, 10:17 PM   #7
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertGary1 View Post
So in the end your goal is to save about $5??

-Robert
You're funny. I like that.

My goal is to do the job right, the first time, with the right parts. If you would have have looked at my first post you would understand this. Very specific questions.

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Old 09-16-2010, 10:47 PM   #8
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

IIRC the schrader R-12 fitting uses the same part as your tire. You still need the cap with the o-ring but it is not as critical as it is with the R-134a.

The schrader core for R-134a that the local parts store sells should fit and function. you do not change cores when converting from R-12 to R134a.

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Old 09-17-2010, 05:12 AM   #9
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB in Clt View Post
Yes, I'm staying with R-12. If I understand your answer correctly, both Schrader valves are "standard" GM even though the Hi/Lo port sizes are different, right? My local AZ doesn't stock them, and they're considered special orders . In other words $$$. Somethings not right about that. I think I used to get these in bags of ten for @ $2.00.
Schrader valves for R12 are not GM specific. R12 valve stems are standard HVAC/tire parts that are the exact same size on high and low side. Both service valves are the same 1/4 flare fitting. The high and low side fittings are exactly the same size, meaning anyone can mix hoses from a manifold gauge set onto the wrong fittings.

If you have a set of R12 gauges and hoses with fittings you'll quickly see the fittings are the same size, all are screw-on type.

Did you look at your car's a/c service fittings to be sure you still have R12 fittings as described previously?

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Old 09-17-2010, 07:37 AM   #10
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

If your high side port looks the same as the low side 1/4" flare port, but is a tich smaller you need one of these,

http://www.acsource.com/highsideadapterstraight.aspx



Normaly this is for Ford R12 vehicles but it is possible that yours was changed at some point. A 3/16" high side port is not uncommon but it was not, to my knowledge, stock on a Saturn. And remember, the shrader is NOT the primary seal for any service port, the cap and it's O ring are. If the caps are not in place, you will leak refrigerant.

...
2000 SL1 freebie, my sons DD
1998 SC1 still running, FOR SALE cheap!
1996 SL, GONE but not forgotten
2005 Generic Silver Minivan (Kia Sedona)
2009 Nissan Sentra 2.0S

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Old 09-17-2010, 10:32 PM   #11
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Thank you for your replies,

What we have here is a serious failure to communicate.

Please refer to my first post. I am not upgrading to R-134a. That is not what this thread is about. I am staying with R-12. My question is about Schrader valves.

My low side port accepts the standard 1/4" gauge attachment. I have to use my adapter on the high side. (Thank you mattelderca for identifying the thread as 3/16"). Everyone seems to agree that, despite the different port sizes, the valve cores are identical. My question regards all the new options: HNBR, Teflon, etc. Should I just stay with good old neoprene? Neoprene seems to be the standard. I don't know how mineral oil will react with the others. Any suggestions?

I really miss the days when you could walk up to the counter and ask for a pack of schrader valves, and the guy knew what you were talking about.

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Old 09-17-2010, 11:42 PM   #12
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Well, I stand corrected. Never came across an R12 service valve sized smaller. Leave to GM to do something different.

Here's a link to Schrader. Just read the pdf and select what you need. http://www.schrader-bridgeport.com/i...Id=5&Itemid=59

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Old 09-18-2010, 09:02 AM   #13
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB in Clt View Post
Thank you for your replies,

What we have here is a serious failure to communicate.

Please refer to my first post. I am not upgrading to R-134a. That is not what this thread is about. I am staying with R-12. My question is about Schrader valves.

My low side port accepts the standard 1/4" gauge attachment. I have to use my adapter on the high side. (Thank you mattelderca for identifying the thread as 3/16"). Everyone seems to agree that, despite the different port sizes, the valve cores are identical. My question regards all the new options: HNBR, Teflon, etc. Should I just stay with good old neoprene? Neoprene seems to be the standard. I don't know how mineral oil will react with the others. Any suggestions?

I really miss the days when you could walk up to the counter and ask for a pack of schrader valves, and the guy knew what you were talking about.
This is what you are looking for. There are lots of things tat will work and a few that will not. Both the mineral oil and refrigerant are a consideration. The charts attached are for 2 different applications but the common tire schrader valve does work. The majority are neoprene.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Selection_088.jpg (64.4 KB, 13 views)
File Type: jpg Selection_089.jpg (101.8 KB, 8 views)

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Old 09-18-2010, 08:11 PM   #14
PB in Clt
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Default Re: AC valve cores and ports ? ? ?

Thank you OldNuc,

That is what I was asking about. I wanted to know if improvements in sealing technology had been made over the years, and by looking at the charts you sent, apparently the answer is ... no. Classic case of, "If it ain't broke ... ," I guess.

fdryer, if you read this: I must be getting old. I can't remember the last time I accessed the high side of a GM w/o an adapter. Pretty smart though, if you think about it. Keeps the amateurs from blowing themselves up.

Thank you both for your time and help. I do appreciate it.

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