headliner - can I just rip it down?

[94TwinCam]

Hello,

I have a 94 twin cam. It has an aftermarket moonroof and the headliner shop people said it would be about $700-$800 to replace the sagging headliner. I am fond of this car but can't quite stomach that. I am not handy enough to do it myself.

I have a can of 3M Hi Strength 90, and I may try to spot repair. (I may also try to return it and get the 3M "Headliner" spray - does anyone know, is there much difference? The Hi 90 is supposed to resist heat. This is in SoCal, and it willll be hot. I didn't know the other existed, plus, it may be hard to find.)

Here is my question - if the spray doesn't work, can I just rip down the fabric? (Gently and with great affection, of course.)

Does the headliner do anything? What would you-all do in this situation? Right now, I don't even want to drive it - I can see out the back, but not for much longer.

Thank you for all input.

[Kaervak]

Whatever shop you got that quote from is out of their mind. I had mine redone for $100.

For the time being, you can rip off the sagging fabric without issue instead of trying to repair it. What has happened is the foam backing has deteriorated and the fabric is falling off. While tearing off the fabric it will be a little messy as the foam backing from the old fabric will crumble everywhere. Have a vacuum handy. Getting the headliner board itself out isn't very difficult. Richpin has a video on how to remove it. Once you have the board out, get quotes from a few different shops and specifically mention that the headliner is already out and you just need it recovered.

[jpsuli]

For 800 dollars I could fly down to where you are at, do it myself, and still have additional money over.

I'd do it yourself, if it's too cold to work on it right now you could either tear it off (leaves the crumbly backing, may fall on the seat, and can be sticky) or use a few pins to keep it held for the time being.

Not sure about the 1st gens, but I've done 2 headliners on 2nd gens and it was pretty easy, go to Joann Fabrics and get like 6 feet of their headliner material for a few bucks. The hardest part is to ensure that the sticky headliner stuff is absent when you glue it back on or it won't hold well.

Best of luck!

[94TwinCam]

Thanks!

Believe it or not, I think it is just expensive to do business here. I went to 3 places. A second place said something like $650 "minimum." The guy seemed very nice and may have actually felt bad. He said the issue is that it would take longer than normal.

At the third place, the person was busy and wouldn't even come look at my car. They had a lower price but I don't really trust them.

I will watch that video. Perhaps it will give me confidence. I am not very strong, but I do have a drill. (It sounds like it is common for people to mangle the darned thing, getting it out.)

Anyhow, thanks again.

[94TwinCam]

Wow, count me as a brand new Rich Pin fan!!!!

I will have to see if removal is something I could do. He makes it look doable. I watched the door handle video too. I think I will go back for the dome light one. I have no idea what I might need to do about the moonroof.

Thanks for the heads up about the video! That was fun. It is neat-o to see how things are put together.

[Sid]

You can hold the sagging headliner up with headliner retainers from your FLAPS for a cheap and dirty fix. I did that for a while but eventually replaced the headliner.

[Waiex191]

It's a very easy job. Just make sure you have a generous amount of fabric to overlap around the front and back, to make sure it doesn't peel there. The sides have plastic trim to hold it up.
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...=230898&page=3

[dummo]

If you do do the job you'll be very glad and satisfied that you did. The headliner material is inexpensive and a can of 3M90 spray glue from The Home Depot is probably still under $20.00. Or 3M Spray Headliner Adhesive from Autozone etc.

How To Glue Your Headliner Fabric To the Headliner Shell Unrushed and Hassle Free:

1). Remove the headliner and make note of how the headliner material folds over the edges of the headliner shell by taking pictures or drawing diagrams and notes to use as reference when folding over your new headliner material. Remove the headliner material and use a wire brush to remove the remaining foam from the headliner backing shell.

2) Line the fabric up with a few inches overhang to wrap around the edge of the backing shell and put 2 heavy books down so things don't move.

3). lift up the back half of the liner material (matching up like a perfectly folded sheet of paper so none of the nice fabric of the headliner material is exposed to spraying glue.

4). Spray glue the exposed half of the headliner material's backing AND the exposed half of the cleaned headliner backing shell.

5). Reach under the folded headliner material with flat hands from the front so that you start pressing the headliner material against the shell from the center towards the back edge as the material rolls over your fingertips while you press it down evenly working your way towards the back until the material finally flips all the way over and gets adhered nicely.

6). Remove the books and fold the front half of the headliner material over the back half and apply spray glue to BOTH remaining exposed surfaces. Be sure to get the middle fold area well avoiding a glue free band.

7). Reach under with flat hands and work your way towards the front as the material is pressed evenly and eventually covers the entire headliner shell.

8). Replicate the folds and cuts that wrap around the backside of the headliner shell at the perimeter and through openings for things like overhead lights and sunroof openings and use small neatly cut pieces of duct tape if necessary to keep the edges down.

9). Reinstall your new headliner and enjoy.

[94TwinCam]

Thanks for the pep talks!!!

I am definitely taking notes. I appreciate the input very much!

[94TwinCam]

Well, so I just tried to upload a photo - I don't know if it worked.

Anyhow, so I finally went out there to confront the problem, armed with my can of spray glue ... as it turned out, the foam and fabric were disintegrating so I gave up on that.

Then I tried to use twist pins, but I couldn't get any purchase - and it was ripping the fabric anyway.

Then I decided to just tear it down, because at least then I can drive without having to worry about not being able to see, or getting pulled over, etc. (The drooping was beginning to be a safety issue.)

Come to find, there isn't any board left in the middle - just a big piece of metal (which explains why the pins didn't work ...)

Is this metal plate something that is supposed to be there? Is that just part of the normal roof of the car?

And either way, does it look like I could put another board up in there? Or did they cut it in the first place because with this after-market sunroof, there is no longer any room?

I have a couple more photos. I'll see if this one worked though.

Thanks again, everyone!! Anyhow I can drive it now, so that's good.

[94TwinCam]

I am trying to upload this photo.

[alordofchaos]

I can see one photo, but can't make out what I'm looking at. Is the top of the photo the front of the car, back?

Since your moonroof is aftermarket, not sure what the installer did so far as cutting up your headliner board.

I have s factory sunroof - my headliner board has a cutout for it. There is also a sliding cover if I don't want any sun coming in through the sunroof. Is that what you are seeing?

Here's a fun headliner thread but it also shows a factory SL2 sunroof cutout
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=138064

(BTW - twin-cam (aka DOHC or double overhead cam, as opposed to SOHX or single overhead cam) is your engine style, not the model of your car. If you have a 2 door/coupe, you have a SC2; if you have a sedan, you have an SL2; if you have a wagon, it is an SW2)

A few pics when I did mine 5 years ago, at bottom of thread. Mostly posted to show, while you have it our, you can add things like aluminum foil or Reflectix to help with blocking heat.
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=232430

I'll agree, job is not that difficult for most (we have several female members who have done it, link above is one example). The board is only semi-flexible. If needed, the front and rear seats are pretty easily removable to give more space to prevent mangling the board. Not being strong is actually helpful here as you won't be as likely to force something through and breaking it, lol.

[cujoe_da_man]

I was able to successfully remove my headliner without removing any of the seats. Even Richpin says you have to remove the rear seats. If you're very careful, you can bend the board enough to flex it out through the rear doors. Just put your front seats all the way forward and put the backs down as far as they will go.

I would also be aware that the backer board of the headliner is some kind of hard-pressed fiberglass, so any work on scraping the old gunk and foam off will make you itchy. That also means it's very easy to "burn" through it if you're scraping away at it.

I don't have a ton of pics, but here's the thread for my repair:

http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=268654