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Old 04-26-2009, 10:21 PM   #1
alordofchaos
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Default Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

So I looked under my car, and I see grease on top of the inner CV boot, driver side. No other symptoms, clicks, etc. I didn't check when I bought this car (eBay auction) and have driven about 50-60 miles total. Not sure how long it has been like this - I do know there was body damage on the front driver side.

Searching indicates I should just replace the driveaxle with a new one from NAPA, $70 or so. It looks like something I might be able to handle... but since it looks like I could tear or bend something if i'm not real careful at certain points, I'm thinking about taking to a shop to handle. Comments? Should be Ok to drive about 6 miles into town?

On the plus side, cradle looks pretty good for 11 yrs of salt roads
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File Type: jpg torn CV.JPG (65.2 KB, 397 views)

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Old 04-26-2009, 11:44 PM   #2
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

really check the boot and see if its torn if so go a head and replace it. you can drive it a while with it like that I did with a Civic (about a year) until I drove a cross country and I changed it before I left.

I'm in the same club as you I got mine off ebay too

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Old 04-26-2009, 11:54 PM   #3
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

With that much grease outside the boot, it's damaged. Replacing it would be foolhardy; looking at how much grit is under there, within probably a few miles of the initial damage to the boot, enough grit got into the joint to start grinding at the (excuse this) big balls and races in there. Go with your original idea and replace the shaft. Salvage yard shaft is an option; OldNuc posts frequently about a trick for testing a drive axle shaft at the yard.

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Old 04-26-2009, 11:59 PM   #4
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

Easy job. I take it this is the passenger side if not you will need to drain the trans fluid. Put on jack stand and remove the tire. Remove the driveaxle hub nut (30mm socket) and washer. Put a pry bar in between the wheel studs and give it a crank to remove the nut. Brake loose the control arm balljoint nut from the steering nuckle. Carefull not to brake the coter pin. This is a 13mm nut. the best way to brake it loos is to hit the side of the nuckle. (Do not hammer down on top of it). Make sure when you do this that the nuckle doesnt damage the balljoint boot. Remove the 2 bolts at the bottom of the strut. You will need to have a brass punch or a peice of wood to brake the axle loose from the hub. after you remove the axle from the hub you will need a peice of block wood and tap on the axle to remove it from the intermediate shaft. Installation is just in reverse. With out the hammer though.

Hope this helps. This should only take you an hour max.

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Old 04-27-2009, 12:15 AM   #5
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

Rebuilt axle shafts are about as reliable as rebuilt alternators or starters, they are not.

Your local friendly pick and pull. You do have to disconnect the lower ball joint and tie rod end to get it out though so it is much quicker to just get it from the counter and let someone figure out how to remove it.

Check http://car-part.com/ for the best local price.

To remove the dead axle you need a socket that fits the axle nut. And you have to separate the lower ball joint and the tie rod end. To remove the axle find your small crowbar or large screw driver and pry between the transmission housing and the back of the CV housing. Do not pry against the seal protector, it has a bunch of holes in it. If you can not see it clean the gunk off so you can. You do not want all of that gravel in the transmission. hold the shaft while prying so it does not pop out and have the splines land on the seal. careful remove the dud. Carefully insert new axle and push on the inner CV housing to get it in as far as you can. Now find your hammer and a block of wood. Position the block in the notch behind the boot and smack the end of it while turning the shaft until it goes all the way in. Note the width of the gap between the transmission and th back of th CV joint before removing the old one. It will go back in.

To test the CV joints you hold the axle out in front of yo and flex the joint to be tested at a slight angle. Now rotate the shaft while providing drag with the other hand. If the bearings are bad you will feel them roll through a dip in the motion. Its like driving over a pot hole, can't miss it. Rotate each end in both directions as the wear is only on one side. With the inner CV joint you will have to slightly compress it or it will hit the end of the housing when you roll it. Do not pull or push on the axle so that you stress the boots, they tear.

The hard part is getting the lower ball joint apart.

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Old 04-27-2009, 10:11 AM   #6
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

Thanks for the replys! This is on the driver's side... I'm kind of waffling between paying a garage and trying this myself (my first time with any drive components and I won't have time for about 2-3 weeks - OTOH, this'll give me time to track down some good synthetic fluid like the Torque Drive OldNuc recommends - since I'd draining the old stuff out anyway)

What I'm looking for on car-parts.com is the "front axle shaft", right? I'm getting no hits on: axle shaft, drive shaft front, or front drive shaft. For "front axle shaft," there's a place about two hours away (not too far out of the way for my trip to S. Bend this weekend) with about a dozen parts on the shelf for $14 (will any 2nd Gen fit? from wagon, sedan, coupe?) which is suddenly making used parts look attractive.

Do I need to worry about holding the axle a special way when holding it for testing (the ends don't need their weight supported or anything)?

Since wear tends to be on one side, and I'm replacing the left one, should I try and find one from the right side as it would have less wear in that direction?

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Old 04-27-2009, 11:01 AM   #7
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

Search car-part for AXLE SHAFT, then on the next screen that comes up select left/right and with or without ABS.

As to handling the shaft when its out all that holds the inner joint on the shaft is the boot so do not let it hang down under its own weight. The outer end is held together with a snap ring.

I think the magic number is any 93 or newer will fit and function. If you have ABS then get one with a good ring and if no ABS either one will work.

You just roll the outer joint at an angle. left hand plays differential and right plays tire on road with brake on slightly. If joint is bad you will feel a pothole Inner joint is built differently so you have to compress it slightly and you are feeling for roughness in the bearings in the rollers on the cross arms and also wear in the track they run in. Inner joints blow boots and outers wear potholes.

Left and right are different and not interchangeable. Get a left one. It would be a nice idea to take that car to the quarter car wash with a big bag of quarters and get all the grease and gravel out from under the engine. They are much more fun to work on when they are clean.

Harbor Freight sells a nifty tool for popping ball joints. Highly recommended if you are ever going to do more than one in your lifetime. http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=99849 You can be the proud owner for close to $20.00. It works well. You tighten it down on the stud and then whack the side of the housing with a hammer. If it does not pop, tighten it a bit more, and hit it again.

This is not a hard job if if have the right tools. The biggest hazard is to let the inner CV joint splined end hit the differential seal or bend the seal cover. Once washed you can see what you are doing. After popping the old axle out plug the differential opening with a rag and flush the crud out from underneath the seal cover. the rag will keep the crud out of the works. Wipe a very thin coat of plain chassis grease on the seal surface of the inner CV joint before installing, helps the seal. Dry seal and dry shaft results in a damaged, leaking seal.

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Old 04-27-2009, 01:06 PM   #8
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

Thanks, OldNuc!
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldNuc View Post
Harbor Freight sells a nifty tool for popping ball joints. Highly recommended if you are ever going to do more than one in your lifetime.
Well, I hope to never have to do this again - and don't really want to do it this time, but I think it's worth investing in the proper tools to make this a bit less painful - and I'll be in good shape for the future " if/when."
Quote:
The biggest hazard is to let the inner CV joint splined end hit the differential seal or bend the seal cover.
This is the part that worries me, but at $14 a pop, it wouldn't kill me to screw up once or twice.

Thanks again, I think you've convinced me to give this a whirl and do it myself after I get the car started again.

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Old 04-27-2009, 02:14 PM   #9
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

The seal and cover are in the transaxle and are not much fun to change. There is plenty of smooth shaft before the splines will hit the seal. Its just a bit floppy when pulling it out or installing teh new one. Not a big problem, just be careful. The seal protector is easy to bend if you do not know where it is. thats why a trip to teh car wash with a gallon of Simple Green is in order.

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Old 06-01-2009, 12:19 PM   #10
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

Thought I'd update this and share some lessons learned. Finally got around to it on Saturday.

First, thanks to everyone here for the knowledge on sf. Special thanks to you, OldNuc, for your help on this and other threads. Beers (or other beverage of your choice) are on me if you're ever in this area.

This was on a 98 SL2, in the event I should update my sig in the future. For background, I have never worked on any suspension or drive-train parts before. The whole thing took probably four or five hours, including the break for salsa and chips, putting away tools, extra time spend cussing, etc. A lot of time was spend going over the steps, and trying to figure out what the bits that I was looking at in the car were called - matching up the pictures to the words to the parts on the car.

First, search. I found a thread listing the needed tools, which was helpful to have ahead of time.

The 30mm axle nut was easy for me... followed the suggestion to leave the car on the ground when loosening it, came off easily.

Next - in addition to printing off this thread, the how to guide, and some other threads, I used the Chilton's or Haynes, don't remember which, but they don't do a good job of updating their pics or procedures.

The manual says there are 3 or so pushpins for the inner splash shield. On the 98, there's a front and rear splash shield, held together by a tab. Each shield mounts to the inner fender with tabs and is held by one pin to the engine cradle, toward the bottom of the shield. The rear splash shield on the driver side is hidden and attached to the shield itelf (doesn't have the center pin) and just pops out; picture below has the area circled. Similar location for the passenger side.

Next, the thread and several other sources I found said an 18mm wrench is needed for the castle nuts. This caused me some consternation when I couldn't fit a wrench on. Fortunately, I had a 19mm wrench... for whatever reason, my castle nuts were 19mm.

OldNuc's suggestion to get the balljoint separator was spot on. Best $18 spent on a tool that I hope to never use again I probably spend 30-45 minutes on the pry bar trying to break the joint loose, using the prybar. Then a light bulb went off over my head, and I remembered that i'd bought that tool and it was still in its box. After I figured out how it worked, probably 5-10 minutes with little effort on my part.

measuring the distance between that thick metal doo-hickey that the inner cv boot mounts on, and the transmission case, is a good idea. I eyeballed it, and was pretty sure I had it in all the way, but I would have saved myself a few moments of worry if I had actually measured before and after. Nothing leaked out of the case when I refilled with ATF, and nothing fell off the car when i backed it out the garage, so it must have been in OK.

This is really a two-person job (or three-handed). To pry the axle out, I stuck a short prybar under the metal doo-hicky, held it in place with my right foot. Using my right hand to support the doohicky and my left to pull, I pressed with my foot to lever it out.

The part where I really needed help was getting the stud in the lower control arm back into the steering knuckle. I'm 220 lbs and was standing on the pry bar, full weight, while I got my wife to swing the strut assembly back over it. I couldn't see the hole while I was standing on the bar.

Total cost $45 plus tax: 30mm socket - $13, balljoint separator $18, junkyard axle - $14. I've seen $700 quotes for this (new parts) here for the same work.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg torn%20CV.JPG (66.8 KB, 188 views)

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Old 06-01-2009, 12:37 PM   #11
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

Does disconnecting the ball joint mess with the alignment less then disconnecting the hub from the strut? When I swapped transmissions I was putting new struts and lowering springs on at the same time so it didn't matter, but I left the ball joint(s) alone.

I believe '93-94 (or '95) the ABS axles are larger, going into the hub then the non-abs axles, the larger ones should fit 2nd gens fine as well (abs or non abs, they're the same size for 2nd gen).

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Old 06-01-2009, 12:46 PM   #12
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fetchitfido View Post
Does disconnecting the ball joint mess with the alignment less then disconnecting the hub from the strut?
Yes, by definition. The strut-to-knuckle bolts set the camber. The ball joint stud is a simple pivot, only goes on in one location, so it can't change any alignment geometry.

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Old 03-21-2019, 09:18 PM   #13
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Default Re: Bad CV boot, driveaxle replace?

Bumping an old thread for updates.

So, it has been about a decade since I bought my first Saturn, a 1998 SL2, found and joined Saturnfans, and had to replace the driver side axle (4/2009) in this thread.

After the driver axle in this thread, my passenger axle in the '98 broke a 2 1/2 years later (12/2011).
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...postcount=1087

A couple of years ago, the SL2 had several issues all at once I did not have time for (subframe tweaked and needs replacing, exhaust flex pipe leak, driver window stuck in up position), so I parked it and bought a 2002 SC2, which is my current daily driver.

Monday, the passenger axle on the '02 SC2 snapped. That rubber damper plus road salt strikes again
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...postcount=5816

Two cars with four half-shafts, and I have replaced 3 of the 4.

Attached pics:
  • Looking under the car, you can see shiny metal where the axle twisted.
  • On removal, the rubber balancer fell off and you can see the two parts of the axle, next to the good axle I pulled from the '97
  • The 18mm castle nut, PITA (looks wet due to PB Blaster)

I took the tie rod end off so that I could rotate the wheel assembly. The castle nut on this car was 18mm.

There was only enough room for me to get an open ended wrench on the nut, nothing else would fit. PITA because I could only rotate maybe 1/4 turn at a time.

There was not enough room for me to get the castle nut completely off the stud - it kept hitting the bottom of the axle. So, I only got the castle nut up to just below the top of the stud.

Then I used the ball joint tool to separate it. (kudos and thanks again to OldNuc for recommending the ball joint tool, have used it sooo many times now ). I could then use a crowbar to force it down enough to get the castle nut off. Had to to the same thing to get it on.

Other than that, ShawnV's How to covers everything else
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=157297

This time around, did it all myself, using a kneepad covered knee to hold the crowbar down while I maneuvered the stud back into the steering knuckle
Attached Images
File Type: jpg busted axle.jpg (105.3 KB, 8 views)
File Type: jpg axles good and bad.jpg (105.7 KB, 10 views)
File Type: jpg ball joint 1.jpg (168.4 KB, 7 views)

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Last edited by alordofchaos; 03-21-2019 at 09:23 PM..

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