SaturnFans.com
saturnfans.com - classifieds - forums - webmail


Go Back   SaturnFans.com Forums > Models > Saturn S-Series > S-Series General

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-15-2005, 04:43 PM   #1
sat95sl1
Junior Member
sat95sl1 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 13
Question Timing chain replacement - when?

I have 150,000 miles on my 95 sl1. At what point should the timing chain be replaced. Should I do this soon? Or wait a little while longer? At how many miles should a timing chain be replaced?

Thanks.

Last edited by sat95sl1; 03-15-2005 at 04:50 PM.
sat95sl1 is offline  
SaturnFans.com Sponsored Links
Old 03-15-2005, 06:50 PM   #2
dieseljack
Advanced Member
dieseljack is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 567
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

With regular oil changes, the chain should last indefinitely. The one on my '95 SW1 is original at 357,000.
dieseljack is offline  
Old 03-16-2005, 04:40 PM   #3
sat95sl1
Junior Member
sat95sl1 is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 13
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

Thanks for your reply.

So there isn't any precautionary time to replace it before it snaps on the highway going 70mph?

Thanks again.
sat95sl1 is offline  
Old 03-16-2005, 04:48 PM   #4
SL2Dreams
Member
SL2Dreams is on a distinguished road
 
SL2Dreams's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Central PA
Posts: 405
 

2004 ION-2 Sedan
1995 SW2
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

technically you could check by removing the timing chain cover and measuring how far out the chain tensioner comes out. I believe the service limit is 1/2" This is no easy feat though
SL2Dreams is offline  
Old 03-16-2005, 04:49 PM   #5
Kevin94SL
Senior Member
Kevin94SL is on a distinguished road
 
Kevin94SL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,602
 

2006 ION-3 Sedan
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sat95sl1
Thanks for your reply.

So there isn't any precautionary time to replace it before it snaps on the highway going 70mph?

Thanks again.

It's a chain - not a belt. If the car gets regular oil changes, the chain should theoretically outlast the engine.


Contrasting this, belts last for usually about 100,000 miles (recommended change interval anywyas... cheaper to get it done then to make pistons meet valves...)..
...
Kevin
Kevin94SL is offline  
Old 03-16-2005, 05:20 PM   #6
RedLimeVued
Member
RedLimeVued is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Central NY
Posts: 54
 

2004 VUE Red Line
1995 SC2
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

Replacement of the chain due to elongation (wear of the pins and the chain link apertures) is dependent on a lot of factors, of which milage is one of them. All timing systems have a resonance point where chain tensile loads are much higher and typically pretty dynamic. If the car is driven at an RPM where system resonance is occuring, then you may see the chain wear faster. The main component of chain wear is soot in the oil. The soot is abrasive and actually increases wear of the pins and link apertures, and as these wear, the chain elongates (pins become smaller diameter and apertures become larger diameter or oblong). So, per the post below, having clean oil will prolong the life of the chain for sure. Also, consider runtime on the engine. We see alot of "early" timing system failures in terms of milage (under 20K miles) but the application is a police car or a taxi cab. The vehicles only show 20K miles but the were running 24/7 for a couple years sitting in traffic, running radar, etc.

It never hurts to replace the chain, but 150K miles is a better interval since that is the design requirements for most engines. The 8mm roller chain in the Saturns should last quite a while, they wear less than silent (inverted tooth) type timing chains. Also, per the post below, if you remove the timing cover take a look at the tensioner. If it is almost out of stroke then it's a good idea to replace the timing chain. Most tensioners are designed to take up 0.7% worn chain.

I have a picture of the DOHC timing system in my members gallery.
RedLimeVued is offline  
Old 03-16-2005, 07:22 PM   #7
BlackBirdRacing
Advanced Member
BlackBirdRacing is on a distinguished road
 
BlackBirdRacing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: sycamore, IL
Posts: 939
 

1995 SC2
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

When they make noise.

I have yet to hear of one breaking...
BlackBirdRacing is offline  
Old 03-16-2005, 07:31 PM   #8
geckobuddy
New Member
geckobuddy is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: colorado
Posts: 2

1999 SL2
1994 SL1
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

I read in my saturns' manual to check the chain at 100k and certainly when it starts to make noise (you'll know the noise when you hear it)
Personally, My 1994 just flipped 100k and I'm taking it in tomorrow to get a new chain. Of course, mine is a bit noisy so I'd rather spend a few-hundred now then worry about an engine re-build later.

BTW - well put explanation by REDLIMEVUED -
geckobuddy
geckobuddy is offline  
Old 03-16-2005, 10:47 PM   #9
Low Saturn
Super Member
Low Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to behold
 
Low Saturn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 15,306
 

2007 AURA XR
2001 SC2
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

I generally change them myself at around 100,000 miles. I pick up a LOT of used Saturns and don't know how well they're maintained. So a $140 timimg chain kit is cheap insurance.
Low Saturn is offline  
Old 03-17-2005, 11:59 AM   #10
geartooth94
Master Member
geartooth94 will become famous soon enough
 
geartooth94's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Allentown, PA
Posts: 3,879
 
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

I'd say 175K at the most for a timing chain change interval.

The '95 SOHC engine I rebuilt had its tensioner extended to the max at 196K miles.
...
1996 Dodge Avenger ES: 2.5L V6
geartooth94 is offline  
Old 03-17-2005, 02:24 PM   #11
blimey
Junior Member
blimey is on a distinguished road
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 22
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackBirdRacing
When they make noise.

I have yet to hear of one breaking...

Would the noise from a worn timing chain be constant or ocassional? My '95 SL1 has a little bit of clacking noise only when under load up a hill. 128k on orig chain.
blimey is offline  
Old 03-17-2005, 03:54 PM   #12
Razorbak
Master Member
Razorbak is on a distinguished road
 
Razorbak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 2,860
 

1996 SL2
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blimey
Would the noise from a worn timing chain be constant or ocassional? My '95 SL1 has a little bit of clacking noise only when under load up a hill. 128k on orig chain.
Noise from a worn timing chain set is very noticeable at idle speed.
Razorbak is offline  
Old 04-12-2005, 11:59 AM   #13
Tom92SCm
Master Member
Tom92SCm has a spectacular aura aboutTom92SCm has a spectacular aura about
 
Tom92SCm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4,960
 

2004 VUE 2.2L
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

I also have a rather loud engine while idling. I'm guessing it's the timing chain. Is there a way to check the stretch of the chain or definite numbers when you measure it? On a bike, if you place a ruler along the chain and line up one rivet on the 0" mark then the corresponding rivet should line up with the 12" mark. Depending on how much it falls before the 12" mark will dictate when you should replace your chain.

I'm without my manual right now, is there a similar way to measure this with the valve cover removed?

--Tom
...
Not a Saturn.
Tom92SCm is offline  
Old 04-12-2005, 12:28 PM   #14
Low Saturn
Super Member
Low Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to behold
 
Low Saturn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 15,306
 

2007 AURA XR
2001 SC2
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom92SCm
I'm without my manual right now, is there a similar way to measure this with the valve cover removed?

--Tom
Yes. Remove the cam cover and spark plugs, then using a socket and breaker bar, turn the crank. You'll want the two silver links at the crank gears 6:00 position (you wont be able to see this) and one silver link at each of the cam gears 12:00 positions. The center of these links should line up with litte divits on the cam gear. If one of the link lines up and the other is a little off, the chain has stretched.
Low Saturn is offline  
Old 04-12-2005, 12:37 PM   #15
Tom92SCm
Master Member
Tom92SCm has a spectacular aura aboutTom92SCm has a spectacular aura about
 
Tom92SCm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4,960
 

2004 VUE 2.2L
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

AWESOME reply! That's the first time I've ever seen a definitive way of telling if the timing chain needs to be replaced or not. I've got a leaky valve cover gasket so the cover is going to be coming off soon anyway. Now I'll know if I'll need to set a weekend aside to replace the chain.

THANKS!
--Tom
...
Not a Saturn.
Tom92SCm is offline  
Old 04-12-2005, 05:30 PM   #16
Low Saturn
Super Member
Low Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to beholdLow Saturn is a splendid one to behold
 
Low Saturn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 15,306
 

2007 AURA XR
2001 SC2
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

Also if I remember correctly while the links on the cahin are in the correct positions, the word "UP" should be right side up on the right side of the gear with the bottom of the letters alligned with the top of the front cover.
Low Saturn is offline  
Old 04-12-2005, 05:46 PM   #17
Razorbak
Master Member
Razorbak is on a distinguished road
 
Razorbak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 2,860
 

1996 SL2
Default Re: Timing chain replacement - when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Low Saturn
The center of these links should line up with litte divits on the cam gear. If one of the link lines up and the other is a little off, the chain has stretched.
The center of the links will always line up with the pip marks on the cam sprockets, even if the chain has stretched, unless the chain was not aligned properly when installed or it has physically skipped a tooth. However, if the chain has stretched, one of the pip marks will not be at the 12:00 position. Some stretch is inevitable unless the chain is brand new, which is why the timing chain set design incorporated a ratcheting chain tensioner in the first place. There is a specified service limit in the FSM for the length of an outstretched chain laying flat with both sides touching. If you know the number of links in the chain, I suppose you can calculate the equivalent service limit measurement between the two pip marks.
Razorbak is offline  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
timing chain replacement? Mike88 L-Series General 9 08-16-2007 09:54 PM
Timing Chain Replacement DonP S-Series Tech 5 07-06-2007 12:09 PM
Timing Chain replacement trimjb S-Series Tech 3 03-26-2007 04:40 PM
timing chain replacement mkosem Miscellaneous Tech 1 10-13-2003 04:25 PM
timing chain replacement SIYAM S-Series Tech 2 02-10-2001 11:17 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:12 PM.

Advanced Forum Search | Advanced Photo Search


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
SaturnFans.com. The Saturn Enthusiasts Site.