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Old 04-29-2019, 11:49 PM   #1
ErikTande
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Default AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

The air conditioning in my 1998 SW2 isn't great. It's cold, but not quite cold enough. When it's 90 degrees out I have to have it on full blast with all vents pointing at me to keep me cool, and even then it's just barely enough. The AC has been serviced and charged recently.

I noticed that when I get on the highway (65+ mph) the AC gets noticeably colder. This leads me to believe the AC condenser may be dirty, clogged or bent up. So I popped the bumper off and found this:

Yep, that would do it. That's pretty mangled. I'd say about 50% efficiency.





I don't have the cash to replace it, so I went with the cheap route, which is try my best to get some airflow back. I tried a few different tools, tweezers, small screwdriver, but what I found worked best for me was a cheap pick from harbor freight.



After a few hours I got it back to what I think is a functional state. It's not pretty, but at least air should be able to get through it now. The amount of rocks I picked out was crazy! And last time I checked air doesn't go through rocks. It's science.








Here's a close up of the left side before and after:



That should be a huge improvement. But I'm not done yet. I watched a video by Ericthecarguy where he cleans the AC condenser, so I did that next. (https://youtu.be/r_em9lm69HQ) I started by hosing it off with just water. Then I used the cleaner he recommended. The directions on the can said let it soak for 5 minutes, or 10 minutes if it's really dirty. I did 20 minutes.



soaking:



After that I rinsed it out really well and put the car back together.




Did it work? I have no idea. It was only 50 degrees here today so I couldn't test it out. But I'm guessing it should help a lot considering how much air flow was being blocked. I'll update this thread when it gets warm again.
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Last edited by ErikTande; 04-30-2019 at 12:02 AM..

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Old 04-30-2019, 01:51 AM   #2
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Last summer I remember mine "working" but not being all that great. Never thought of checking the condenser. I'll definitely have to do this when ever it stops raining.

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Old 04-30-2019, 07:41 AM   #3
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

You've done a great service returning a partially blocked condenser coil back to efficient refrigerant cooling by straightening out bent fins. Hvac distributors sell combs for straightening fins. I wonder if a screen can help catch road rash while not interfering with air flow. Metal screens for screen doors or plastic screens. Spacers placed into fins to keep the screen away while capturing debris. This might help with occasional inspection at oil change time to hose or brush off collected debris.

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Old 04-30-2019, 01:15 PM   #4
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

It gets all bent up like that from being pressure washed.

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Old 05-01-2019, 03:08 PM   #5
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

HF to the rescue once again!
Would a zip tie of appropriate width, poked through the gaps, work also? Just an idea. Zip tie has a tapered end.

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Old 05-01-2019, 06:18 PM   #6
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Nah, too soft. The Hf set of hook and pin set is fine. Takes forever but works. The hvac combs straightens several rows at a time but there are several gauges - widths between fins vary.
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Old 05-02-2019, 10:45 AM   #7
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Yeah, I watched videos on those combs. They only work well for fins that are very slightly bent. With something as mangled as mine was the combs are pretty worthless unfortunately.

Here's a real close up of the damage I was dealing with.

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Old 05-14-2019, 02:03 PM   #8
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

The weather finally warmed up again. Fixing the fins helped, the AC is cooler. But not enough.

Before fixing the fins it was 70 degrees, and the AC was barely keeping up on full blast.
After fixing the fins when it's 70, the AC is doing ok at 3/4s blower.


Unfortunately, now it's 80 degrees and it's still barely keeping up again on full blast.

So did it improve? Yes. Enough for 90+ degree weather? I doubt it.


I'm thinking it will probably be best to replace both the condenser and the compressor.

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Old 05-14-2019, 02:33 PM   #9
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Before making repairs you might regret (cost wise with little to no benefit), did you inspect the evaporator coil for blockage? Access is thru the blower and a mirror, small camera or cellphone. Years of ac use may result in the evaporator coils collecting debris and slowly blocking cold airflow.

Unless you're prepared, ac repairs can be unforgiving of mistakes if not done correctly. The next time ac is used, record outside and inside vent temps and post here. Was this system ever serviced, topped off (with or without sealer)?

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Old 05-14-2019, 03:18 PM   #10
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

^ ^ ^
Yep

http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...ighlight=rinse

I would also double-check the charge.

You may have a small leak at the Schrader valve(s) that is not picked up during testing because the gauges are usually left on when vacuum is pulled - effectively sealing the leak at the valves.

In 90 degree weather, I had to turn the AC down after a bit because it was getting too cold

may also want to check that the blend door has full range of motion

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Old 05-15-2019, 09:37 AM   #11
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdryer View Post
Before making repairs you might regret (cost wise with little to no benefit), did you inspect the evaporator coil for blockage? Access is thru the blower and a mirror, small camera or cellphone. Years of ac use may result in the evaporator coils collecting debris and slowly blocking cold airflow.

Unless you're prepared, ac repairs can be unforgiving of mistakes if not done correctly. The next time ac is used, record outside and inside vent temps and post here. Was this system ever serviced, topped off (with or without sealer)?
Cool, I didn't think of that. I know where the drain is under car, where do I access the blower? Pop the dash pad off? Through the glove box?

Thanks!
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Old 05-15-2019, 09:41 AM   #12
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

see link in my post above for blower access

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Old 05-15-2019, 10:08 AM   #13
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Yeah I saw the diagram but where is the access? Does the whole dash have to come out? Thanks!


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Old 05-15-2019, 10:09 AM   #14
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Yes, you come close to dismantling the dash to get it all apart. There are other ways but it requires precision surgery on the case. For a look you remove the blower motor/wheel and use a mirror etc.

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Old 05-15-2019, 11:29 AM   #15
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Ah gotcha, I found richpins blower motor video, I understand where it's at now. I'll open it up and take a look this week. Thanks!

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Old 05-15-2019, 02:39 PM   #16
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

As i mentioned in my previous post, can you take outside and inside temperatures with ac on while driving? The center vents measuring inside ac temperatures along with outside air temps can be compared to service manual charts to gauge ac operation. If you can measure temperatures, I can post a chart or two from service manuals. The less invasive actions are wiser than to make assumptions and disassemble a working ac system. Once anyone opens ac systems, they automatically become ac techs with our without the requisite knowledge of refrigeration fundamentals and correct repairs. Ac can be similar to turbocharging - no one messes with turbocharging unless thoroughly familiar otherwise all risks are on the shoulder of the person assuming they know everything.

While not suggested to any diyer unless very familiar with refrigeration and the effects of needlessly connecting gauges to low and high side (single gauges on store refill cans are useless here) service ports, gauge pressures at 2k rpm (parked vehicle) are also used to compare against charts to determine normal or unusual operation. Please do not attempt any pressure measurements at idle rpm - they're useless values. No one drives at idle rpm and ac systems vary pressures and are expected to work best while driving - 2k rpm while parked is minimum recommended rpm to measure operating pressures. As you can readily understand, measuring ac operating pressures with an engine running at 2k rpm is not a small task with several hazards if not performed in a safe manner.

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Old 05-15-2019, 03:37 PM   #17
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

^^ yeah I'm checking the evaporator coil for blockage first. Gonna clean that and see how it goes. If that doesn't work I'll find a thermometer and take temps.

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Old 05-16-2019, 07:09 AM   #18
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Can you see that there is nothing blocking between condenser and radiator?

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Old 05-17-2019, 11:15 AM   #19
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

OK, got the evaporator coil cleaned.

First I popped off the blower motor, it had a bit of crud and a few rocks in it.




Next I snuck my cell phone up the hole and took a pic. I could see some leaves and other debris.




Next I stuck a flexible vacuum hose in and vacuumed up some of the leaves. I could hear it getting quite a few, but when I took a picture afterwards, I noticed I really didn't get any leaves out from whatever corner my camera was taking a picture of.

You'll also notice I managed to bend some fins in the vacuuming process. The flexible hose had a hard plastic end on it, and obviously bent a few fins as I was wiggling it around.

Keep in mind you can't see anything you're doing, it's all by feel from up under the dash.




Next I got out some compressed air and gave it a good blow. I managed to get out a LOT more leaves and debris with the compressed air.






For the last step I made sure the drain wasn't plugged (richpin pen method) then parked the car facing downward on the driveway to make sure it would drain more easily. Then I got out the garden hose and gave it a few rinses. I snaked the hose up inside, then would spray for 3 or 4 seconds (low pressure "shower" setting as to not bend any more fins) and then let it drain. Then spray again, drain, etc. I did that about 10 times.




After that I took my final pic, and it looks pretty clean now.



I'll report back again when it gets hot again to see if it made any difference. . Hopefully it will be ice cold like that other guy posted here.
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Old 05-17-2019, 12:27 PM   #20
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Default Re: AC Condenser fix (bent fins)

Great snapshots, especially inside the hvac box to see the evap coils. You may be the first to poke a cellphone in and take snapshots to show typical debris buildup. The leaves don't seem to block off airflow much (<15%?). The brown coloring to fins may be all the 'fresh clean' airflow intake over the years.

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