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Old 01-09-2019, 03:09 AM   #1
kewlpop
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1995 SL
Default Fuel injector location / cylinder association

Hello,

I am trying to figure out which injector fuels the #2 cylinder on a 1995 Saturn SL sohc.

Thanks!

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Old 01-09-2019, 09:31 AM   #2
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1998 SC2
Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

From the right hand side of the car they run 1-2-3-4 for the cylinders. Right hand side is the passenger side.

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Old 01-09-2019, 11:05 AM   #3
kewlpop
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Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

thanks!

one other quick question.

is it fairly easy to temporarily disable an injector via a wiring harness disconnect?

or are there other steps involved?

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Old 01-09-2019, 12:12 PM   #4
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Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

Unplug it and it's disabled. Might possibly set a code but doubtful with OBD-1, even if it does it'll reset itself when you plug it back in.

The nice thing about these car's is they're old enough that you can do stuff like this without some idiot computer disabling it at the PCM end for all eternity like newer cars do.

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Old 01-09-2019, 01:21 PM   #5
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Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

one of my only complaints against the saturn obd1 coding is that it won't tell you if the vehicle has a simple cylinder misfire. or does it?

i have yet to see it in my vehicle.

it will throw a code for the EGR...

but the cylinder misfire code would have saved me a bit of trouble when trying to diagnose an engine hesitation symptom that developed a few years ago.

and right now, i've go an enormous misfire on cylinder #2, with no code.

leaning towards a piston soak. is there a way to isolate only one cylinder using this technique?

as of now, i have to change out that plug almost every week.

i've got enough plugs now that i'd rather just clean them up and reuse them, but don't really know the best process to accomplish this.

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Old 01-09-2019, 02:13 PM   #6
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Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

I think you are correct, there is no misfire detection in OBD1.

Have you taken compression readings? My oil-burners (DOHC) don't foul plugs.

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Old 01-09-2019, 03:48 PM   #7
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Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

All OBD I codes here, nothing that I saw for misfires:

http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44420

Not sure what is going on, but if the injector is suspect, swap and see if the fouling moves to another cylinder?

I'd suspect an ignition issue but that's just a guess with little info - maybe swap ICMs and see if the problem moves

Are you talking piston soak out of concern that there is a lot of carbon in the cylinder?

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Old 01-09-2019, 07:17 PM   #8
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Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

oh no, i'm not worried about the injector.

i know for certainty there is a cake of carbon in the #2 cylinder. those piston rings are shot for sure. it is quite obvious without any tear down or compression testing.

i was thinking of running the engine for a few minutes without the #2 plug, and letting whatever escape out of there (if at all possible) that might be sludging it up. i just didn't want gas from the injector to leak into the chamber.

which leads me to another question.

dumb idea?

another option is a 'steam clean', with hydrolock potential.

in the end, at this point, there is nothing that will probably help that cylinder recover other than a rebuild.

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Old 01-09-2019, 10:24 PM   #9
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Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

Do the "steam clean", trickling water in as fast as the engine, running about 2000 rpm, can take it. Even if you overdo the water feed, the engine will die long before there is enough water in there to get a real hydraulic lock. Of course, stop feeding water as soon as the engine is on the verge of stalling.

You might also find that one of the "piston soak" procedures will help get carbon out of the combustion chamber, but that is harder to do than just the water, so go for the water first.

Don't be so quick to dismiss the compression test! These engines suffer from problems with the oil rings, but that results in the compression rings/pistons/bores being well-lubricated and those parts seem to last quite well. If you do find poor compression, it is more likely from a bad valve, which you can further pin down with a leak-down type test. Point is, if compression is very poor, for whatever reason, you might as well not bother with any of the methods to remove carbon or free up the oil rings; that hole is never going to work satisfactorily until the cause of low compression is fixed.

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Old 01-09-2019, 11:49 PM   #10
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Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

A heavily fouled plug sounds like a leaky head gasket for that cylinder. It may still run fine (considering the fouling ).
Compression test should tell .

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Old 01-10-2019, 01:22 AM   #11
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Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

A compression test won't tell where the issue with the cylinder is, it'll just say "Yup, there's a problem here".

When you want to know where the problem is without a full tear down rotate the engine around so the suspect cylinder has all valves closed and plug your handy dandy air compressor into it (20psi minimum, don't really need the full 100+psi for this test).
  • If the air comes out the intake, it's intake valve related.
  • If it's out the exhaust, it's exhaust valve related.
  • If it comes out the oil fill tube, it's piston related.
  • If it comes out an adjoining cylinder or the cooling system it's the head gasket.

I tried the disabling the injector trick on a '96 SC2 with a badly burned exhaust valve. Ran smoother with hill power with it plugged in but MPG was horrible while unplugged it idled horribly and hills were avoided at all costs but MPG was reasonable.

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Old 01-10-2019, 01:45 AM   #12
kewlpop
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1995 SL
Default Re: Fuel injector location / cylinder association

all good advice.

many thanks.

i ran the car today and tonight, and it seemed to hit on all 4 (with a plug swap starting out the morning).

and when that happens, mostly highway driving (5 speed manual) i still get well over 30mpg.

not so enthralling when gas prices in my area have dropped to $1.90.

but when they were topping out at $4/gallon a few years ago, this car was nothing but sweetness.

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