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Old 12-16-2017, 08:40 PM   #1
davemanuel
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Default 2002 SL1 -engine misses - no codes showing

Hi , My daughter's SL1 , SOHC engine started losing power , and missing. Changed spark plugs and wires , and replaced ign coils. Still has same problem.
No trouble codes showing on scanner , and check engine light did not come on.
I unhooked the oxygen sensor in the exh manifold , and started the engine - check engine light did not come on. Also, disconnected the MAP sensor with same result - no check engine light . The only code on the scanner is a pending code U1300 multiple misfires. Any suggestions ? Thanks.

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Old 12-17-2017, 05:40 PM   #2
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Default Re: 2002 SL1 -engine misses - no codes showing

When you state "unhook the O2 sensor" do you mean disconnected wiring or removed the sensor? Disconnecting wiring and removing the sensor are two different descriptions and can mislead anyone if not clear on descriptions.

Mileage, maintenance done, parts replaced?

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Old 12-17-2017, 06:40 PM   #3
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Default Re: 2002 SL1 -engine misses - no codes showing

Hi,
I disconnected the wiring connectors first on the primary oxygen sensor . and started the engine and let it run for 5 minutes , CEL did not come on - checked for codes with scanner - but only had a pending code U1300 showing multiple engine misfires. Next I removed the MAP sensor wiring connector , then started the engine , and waited a few minutes and as before the CEL light did not come on . Normal maintenance done on this car at recommended intervals by myself for the past 10 years( my daughter purchased this car new 15 years ago ) Replaced spark plugs , ign wires , and the two ign coils - still have same problem - the engine starts and idles fine. - Dave.

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Old 12-17-2017, 06:45 PM   #4
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Default Re: 2002 SL1 -engine misses - no codes showing

Mileage is 250,000 kilometers. New rings , exhaust valves , and timing chain & guides at 193,000 kilometers. The car has always had good power and burns/leaks about a liter of oil every 1500 to 2000 kilometers. - Dave.

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Old 12-18-2017, 01:04 AM   #5
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Default Re: 2002 SL1 -engine misses - no codes showing

Just a guess but with 250k kms/155k miles, a rebuilt engine with zero problems after rebuilding until 53k kms later, there may be a possibility of a damage catalytic converter (if it wasn't replaced). Disconnecting the O2 sensor may help with one problem but not help if trying to determine a catcon problem. Fuel pump, fuel filter, compression and catcon are long term issues sometimes not easily diagnosed when problems occur. Diagnosing and troubleshooting each one requires some thought and sometimes tools.

Fuel filter and pump issues can be checked using a fuel pressure gauge connected to the fuel test valve. Expect 40-55 psi at ignition on time and with engine idling. Fuel filter should be replaced every 100k miles/160k kms. An engine compression check is suggested to determine mechanical state of health. Next would be for a damaged catcon that may block exhaust flow, choking off engine power. The easiest way to test for damaged catcons; remove the front O2 sensor on the exhaust manifold and use a soup can diverter if necessary to redirect hot exhaust gases away from nearby plastic. Startup and drive around. While LOUD, if engine power suddenly returns and misfiring disappears, the catcon is the problem and should be replaced. If the engine continues to misfire, the problem is elsewhere. Removing the O2 front sensor allows an alternate exhaust path before the catcon.

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Old 12-18-2017, 06:33 PM   #6
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Default Re: 2002 SL1 -engine misses - no codes showing

Hi,
The fuel filter/regulator was replaced a few days ago ,and today I checked the fuel pump pressure at the engine - it was 60psi at idle and 60 psi when engine was revved up and the same driving under load when misfiring. Replaced the primary oxygen sensor in exhaust manifold - but it did not make any difference in the misfiring. Disconnected the eng temp sensor wiring from the eng , and connected a used eng temp sensor( from another 2002 Saturn 1.9 SOHC eng )to the wiring harness and tied it up to a wiring loom - took car for a test drive and it appeared to have good power and did not misfire when eng was cold and also after the engine warmed up . Plan to put this sensor in engine and re-test it . Also, during test drive the primary oxygen sensor wiring was left disconnected from the sensor - and the CEL light did not come on as it did in the past when the wiring was disconnected from the primary oxygen sensor.
Thanks. - Dave.

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Old 12-28-2017, 02:24 PM   #7
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Default Re: 2002 SL1 -engine misses - no codes showing

After more testing a code showing engine is running rich came on. Then we removed the primary oxygen sensor from the exh manifold , and installed a fitting , hose and connected to a pressure gauge. Gauge showed 7 psi , indicating a plugged exh system. After more testing we found that the secondary cat converter was plugged with material that had fallen way from the primary cat converter. Replaced the secondary converter and engine works ok now. Thankyou for the information and suggestions - great site for Saturn users !

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Old 12-29-2017, 03:03 AM   #8
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Default Re: 2002 SL1 -engine misses - no codes showing

When you determined the downstream catcon became blocked by catguts in the upstream precat, did you consider the upstream precat may continue to disintegrate and block the new catcon?

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Old 12-29-2017, 02:13 PM   #9
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Default Re: 2002 SL1 -engine misses - no codes showing

Hi,
Yes , that possibility certainly exists - but the cost of a new exh manifold with primary cat converter is much more than my budget will allow . If the same condition happens again in the near future I will likely remove the remainder of the primary cat con material , and install another new or good used secondary cat con - I have another new one and a good used one that will fit the car.
Thanks for the great site and the diagnosis information . - Dave.

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