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Old 09-11-2016, 04:18 PM   #1
deanmerc
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Default 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Hello everyone! I'm new here and read the other related posts, but none are quite like my issue. I just purchased a 2001 Saturn L300 with the V6. It has 75k miles and is in great shape (like new). It originally had the Service Engine Soon, Service wrench and security lights on solid. I hooked up my OBD2 tool and showed an O2 sensor and MAF sensor fault. After some testing and Live Data streaming, I replaced an O2 and MAF sensor with great results. The Service Engine Soon light cleared and car runs better than before - steadier idle, better performance.

The key would sometimes be difficult to turn in the ignition, so I replaced the lock cylinder and matched up the tumblers with the old lock cylinder. I made new key copies and reinstalled the lock cylinder. The key turns perfectly now - nice and smooth. It didn't clear the Security or Service wrench lights.

I noticed that when I unplugged the Passlock sensor from the lock cylinder housing, the Security and Service wrench light remained on solid, and the car still started and ran fine. Naturally, the OBD2 tool does not show any faults.

I'm afraid to try the re-learn procedure because the car is running fine and I don't want to end up with the Security light flashing and car not starting ... but I do want to clear those lights for peace of mind (and I'm OCD like that).

Would replacing the entire lock cylinder housing which includes the new Passlock sensor eliminate the problem? I know Saturns and GM in general have had lots of issues with bad ignition cylinders, etc.

Any help and expertise would be Greatly APPRECIATED! I'm just a basic DIY'er with a little bit of mechanical knowledge, and even less Electrical knowledge LOL...

I appreciate anyone's help and opinion!

Gabe in South Florida

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Old 09-11-2016, 06:52 PM   #2
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

your best bet would be to take it and have the wrench code read so you know what you are dealing with...no need in spending money when it is not needed...

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Old 09-11-2016, 07:16 PM   #3
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Got it.... you're right. I will call my local Chevy dealer tomorrow and see how much they charge to diagnose the service wrench and security lights.

I can't think of anything other than the ignition lock housing with Passlock sensor that would cause both of those lights to stay on all the time.

It looks relatively simple to replace, but I will wait to hear what Lou Bachrodt Chevy has to say

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Old 09-11-2016, 07:59 PM   #4
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Gabe, you've done more to isolate and repair what can be done than most are capable of doing when dealing with multiple issues. Wading thru a worn ignition lock repair to return to normal ignition key use and replacing one O2 sensor eliminates two issues with error codes going away. Unfortunately, Passlock and the service wrench light may be tied together as one problem or two. Without a high end scantool or latest reader that can decode wrench errors, the majority of wrench codes seem to be about blown bulbs or faulty switches; non emissions related error codes. Wrench codes may be considered 'manufacturer specific' codes unique to each company so there are cases where dedicated scantools like GM's Tech II may be the only readers to read wrench codes. You can try Autozone as they seem to have a good turnover; abs error codes couldn't be read a few years ago but newer readers are now decoding them. I wouldn't count on it but it may be worth a try. Passlock is disabled when the security light stays ON, indicating the body control module detected a fault somewhere and instead of interfering (preventing engine running), disables itself and turns on security to alert owners that Passlock needs service.

Passlock (similar factory theft deterrent systems in other brands) is basically GM's way to use software in EFI systems by adding a theft deterrent program in the body control module (BCM) to disable injector operation. Disable injectors and the engine cannot run. In your car, flashing security (one of several modes) indicates Passlock activated, disabling injector operation. The starter will work but the engine will never fire up. The three wire sensor detects ignition lock cylinder rotation with several magnetic sensors. Lock cylinder repairs, when done correctly shouldn't cause problems unless the Passlock sensors were damaged in the ignition switch module.

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Old 09-11-2016, 10:48 PM   #5
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Hi fdryer! Thanks for the response. Now that you mention it ... I have noticed that the daytime running lamp (DRL) dash indicator occasionally doesn't come on. If I tap the upper left of the dashboard a few times, it'll light up and stay on while I drive like normal. When I restart the car, it may or may not be working again.

I have no problem getting my hands dirty working on cars, and I enjoy it. I would rather do it than pay a dealer or someone else to do it. SO, there may be more than 1 error code for the dealer to inform me (such as the Passlock issue and defective dash light bulb...).

If anyone here works/worked at a dealer, is it "rude" for a customer to simply request a printout of why the service wrench light is on? I would imagine a dealer would normally charge, but about how much? I just don't want to walk away feeling duped by the dealer. How about a local mechanic? Should I ask if they have a TechII scan tool?

Thanks again!

Gabe

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Old 09-12-2016, 07:59 AM   #6
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

There is no harm in asking for a printout from the dealer. Some staff at dealers are really helpful others are not. The GM Dealer I use here in central Florida is Starling Chevrolet. The technican on reception I normally speak with is is a Saturn trained Technician so is a mine of information and helpful to boot.

The way to differentiate between the 2 lights is that the Service Engine Soon light is emissions related and the Wrench light is NON emissions related. The latter could be anything from a a bulb gone to an acting up transmission.

One thing I would mention on the dash cluster and lamps is that not all the warning lights are replaceable bulbs. My sons L300 low fuel warning light wasn't lighting up, so I pulled the dash cluster to replace it. Couldn't as this 'bulb' is an led soldered to the printed circuit board. You will find that all the warning lights on the lower left and right are all pcb installed led's. That is not to say you cannot replace a faulty one, but you have to be good at soldering. If not you can leave it as is and live with it or find someone local or on the internet that offers this service.

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Old 09-12-2016, 11:42 AM   #7
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Quote:
Originally Posted by deanmerc View Post

If anyone here works/worked at a dealer, is it "rude" for a customer to simply request a printout of why the service wrench light is on? I would imagine a dealer would normally charge, but about how much? I just don't want to walk away feeling duped by the dealer.
I worked for a dealership many years ago, but not in the service department. Nevertheless, any service writer/advisor worth his salt knows that new customers are not easy to come by and should want to be as accommodating to you as possible with regard to information you're seeking and for which you are paying.

As far as a diagnostic cost is concerned, I would generally expect it to be around one to one and a half hours of labor time, but no more than two hours. Hourly rates vary regionally. Please remember, this is a generality as well as an "educated guess" and nothing more. It's possible the the rate could be less than I believe it might be.

Diagnosis is also part of the time required for a repair. Whatever diagnostic time is used that sime time should be applied forward into any repair cost so that you're not paying for that labor twice. Make sure that such is the case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by deanmerc View Post
How about a local mechanic? Should I ask if they have a TechII scan tool?
Due to the cost of a Tech II Scan Tool, or its equivalent, most independent repair shops won't have one. I would seek out a shop that bills itself as a GM specialist, or one of the busiest shops I knew of, and contact them regarding their having that scanner.

...
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Gov't's grown bigger, but a chance exists that it will be reduced. I'm cautiously hopeful.

Last edited by pierrot; 09-12-2016 at 11:54 AM..

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Old 09-12-2016, 03:35 PM   #8
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Hi Pierrot,

Thanks for replying. I located a local AC Delco specialist repair shop that specializes in GM cars, including Saturn. They told me they had a TechII scanner and would scan it for free. Sounded professional and made an appointment for Thurs 8am.

I will post my results in the interest of information sharing.

Thanks for everyone's input.

Gabe

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Old 09-15-2016, 09:07 AM   #9
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Good morning everyone! UPDATE: I would appreciate everyone's help again in fixing this code.

I just got home from the mechanic shop. He said he was able to read the computer and gave the following code:

B2965 - KEY IN IGNITION FAULT

This makes sense since the ignition lock cylinder was sticking, and I just replaced the lock cylinder. I think it's a common GM problem.

He mentioned that there were several other codes stored (in memory perhaps?), BUT told me that B2965 was the current reason why the service wrench and security lights are on.

These other codes were more than likely stored in memory, and are not the current reason the lights are on:

B0005 - IN PARK SWITCH CIRCUIT
B2623 - DISPLAY DIMMING PWM INPUT CIRCUIT HIGH
B2600 - DRL ERROR
B2662 - PARK LAM SWITCH CIRCUIT MALFUNCTION
B0936 - COOLANT LEVEL SENSOR CIRCUIT
B2958 - DATA OPEN/SHORT TO BATTERY
B1327 - DEVICE POWER CIRCUIT LOW
B1328 - DEVICE POWER CIRCUIT HIGH

So, he mentioned that the lights should clear once I address the B2965 - KEY IN IGNITION FAULT. He took a while to read it free of charge, so I asked them to do an oil change for $25 (great deal)!

Gabe
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Old 09-15-2016, 03:34 PM   #10
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

As a side note, I tried doing the relearn procedure with no results. The Security light, service wrench and service engine soon lights stay on, even after 20 minutes of waiting.

The first time I tried, I just turned the ignition to Run and waited. I noticed that the SES and security lights were on steady, and never went off even after 20 mins.

Then I tried again but this time I quickly cranked the engine amd let the key go. This time I noticed that the SES, security AND service wrench light were on steady for 20 minutes.

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Old 09-15-2016, 05:07 PM   #11
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

1-As long as security is ON all the time, along with the wrench light and the car starts and runs without the check engine light on, Passlock is disabled and does not interfere with vehicle operation. Obviously there is no theft protection and anyone with a duplicate key can turn the ignition switch and drive away. As long as no one knows this and security remains on, it can serve as a theft deterrent to thieves not knowing the difference of security flashing, blinking or just on.

2-Below are reprints of DTC 2965. Its describing the ignition key reminder ground circuit telling the bcm a key is inserted in the ignition switch. This fault may be the reason for security (passlock) staying disabled.
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File Type: jpg DTC B2965-1.jpg (139.3 KB, 13 views)
File Type: jpg DTC B2965-2.jpg (152.9 KB, 9 views)

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Old 09-17-2016, 07:09 PM   #12
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

fdryer,

Thank you for the reply and diagrams! Very much appreciated. I will try doing some electronics testing using my new voltmeter. I've never used one so it will be a learning experience for me.

I truly appreciate everyone's help.

Gabe

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Old 09-17-2016, 07:16 PM   #13
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

If it helps, Google youtube videos on how to use a multimeter. Try searching the ones giving basic instructions that don't dwell on technicalities and shows the meat and potatoes of measuring voltages and resistance. If you're a rocket scientist, disregard suggestions.

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Old 09-23-2016, 06:42 PM   #14
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Could this be my problem? I checked the BCM and it's a different number than what every other resource I've seen for my 2001 Saturn L300. The BCM part number in my car is 22672020. I think I'm supposed to have 19116647.

My car runs fine, I just can't seem to clear the Service wrench and Security lights on solid. If the previous owner had it replaced by the dealer and they flash it (or program it or whatever), would the car run just fine as if it was the correct one? Or would those lights stay on no matter what they did....???

Thanks!

Gabe
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Old 09-23-2016, 08:37 PM   #15
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

You may have found the problem but without definite proof, its almost impossible to confirm an incorrect bcm unless you have GM verify it. I do not know part numbers but one way to find out is to use GM parts online as a resource for part numbers, trying several GM parts sites to verify bcm part number. While its speculating whether or not bcm part number is a clue to and incorrect bcm used here, I don't know for fact whether or not one OEM part number is used for the L-series. Aside from this, you may be able to search for used bcm's with the matching part number you feel is correct and consider buying it for use. Beware that odometer mileage is permanent to used bcm's and cannot be altered (due to mileage tampering laws) so a used bcm may have mileage higher than the car its going to. Some members aren't concerned. Another issue is remotes are married to bcm's so using your remotes on another bcm requires GM to program them to the replacement bcm.

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Old 09-23-2016, 11:40 PM   #16
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

deanmerc, you are correct about the replacement part number of the BCM for your car, it is 19116647. Here is the succession of OE cataloged replacement BCMs for the L Series vehicles with a V6:

M.Y. 2000) p/n 19116645; M.Y. 2001) p/n 19116647; M.Y. 2003) p/n 19116649; M.Ys. 2004 and '05) p/n 22732680.

The p/n in your attached picture of 22672020 is a puzzlement in this situation. It suggests to me that the BCM was replaced at some point. Now, it is not uncommon for replacement catalog p/n's to differ from what's inside of their box or other type of container. So the p/n seen on your BCM doesn't necessarily mean that it's the wrong one for your car.

I've been looking through other GM product lines in an online catatlog and, not surprisingly, none of them share the same BCM part numbers with Saturn. Further, the first four digits of the part number (which I refer to as the "prefix"), 2267 in your case, is one which doesn't appear at all in Saturn or any other GM product line for replacement BCMs. (Perhaps the p/n you're seeing tells GM that it's one of their remanunfactured BCMs...?)

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Old 09-24-2016, 12:19 PM   #17
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Thanks for the replies. I checked the part numbers and have seen some parts sites which indicate that my BCM is correct also... maybe some programming updates were made during the model year. My remote does work with this BCM.

I see rockauto has BCMs for sale (reman). Not sure if that means those BCms are used with another car's mileage, or if they are cleared with 0 miles. Can a dealer program my current car's mileage to a replacement BCM? Or is the mileage not programmable due to mileage tampering like fdryer mentioned?

Man, I'm starting to think I should've bought a '66 Chevy... sans onboard computers.

Cheers,
Gabe

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Old 09-24-2016, 01:47 PM   #18
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Default Re: 2001 Saturn L300 security and service wrench light on steady

Yes, a GM dealership, or qualified mechanic with a Tech II Scan Tool, can transfer your car's current mileage to a new BCM. Used units from wrecking yards retain the odometer information from the car in which they were originally installed.

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