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-   -   All Sorts of Problems!... i think (http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=194225)

ndifrischia 08-27-2013 09:10 PM

All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
I recently bought a 97 SL1 1.9 SOHC (although im finding that appropriate parts are for a 98) with 209k miles about two months ago or so
Old owner said it ran good with high milage oil and a bottle of injector cleaner in the tank. He said it would throw an EGR engine code (no P0# given) now and then and had some idle oddities and such i would expect of a car of this high milage.
Bought it and ran it solid for two months, changed oil and bypassed the injector cleaner.
Engine light came on for me and i took it to AZ, Codes thrown
P0327
P0404
P0303
Cleaned EGR... with seafoam.. hope that wasnt a mistake
And it was.. mediocre, still ran, shot seafoam smoke out the back
Changed plug wires, still had a miss, still ran it
Then One instance i was stopped on a hill (i typically put the car in neutral at a stop, it seemed to idle better) and i when i took off, complete lack of power, engine light flashing at me and horrible shudder. Limped Home with multiple stops (thought i was about to overheat or destroy the transmission or something bad!) and took it to a local shop and read the codes. Sadly i didnt get the numbers but it had about 17 codes in it and possibly also in the history.
#4 Cylinder has very weak spark and when pulling the plug wire while running it barely affects the engine. Cylinder 1 almost kills it if pulled. Cylinder 2 makes it about half power when pulled. Cylinder four spark plug is DOUSED in fuel when removed, Cylinder four injector has been replaced and doesnt match, it has three ports on the injector tip while the other three look to have a screen on the tip (difference between 97 & 98 i believe). Swapped #4 injector with #1 and now when #4 plug wire is pulled it affects the engine more than with the odd injector. valve lifters seem to be in working order when the cover is pulled. Pulled o2 sensor and took it down the road and it runs rough. I dont know why i keep thinking this but i feel like its over fueling and ... ugh i dont know
Things i have done that havent really helped..
ECTS
02 Sensor
Plugs (NGK)
Wires
Fuel Filt
Cleaned throttle body and IAC
Both coil packs spark while cranking with the boots off the towers
Fuel pressure is reading good
Wires(I tried AC Delco but they were crap and the insulator boot pulled off so i put on an expensive set from a VW that seem to work pretty darn good)
Compression Test - 1=190 2=85 3=210 4=220
now i know the #2 cylinder is running low but the symptoms are very odd. When the odd ball injector was changed to cylinder 1, engine mounting surface, grounding bolts and ICM. I am pulling my hair out... and there wasnt much there to begin with. After most of that i get this string of codes.. under what conditions im not quite sure.. changed a bunch of things around and getting it out to erase the codes is a bit troublesome... so there could be some old/odd data here

P0351
P0405
P0352
P0202
P1599
P0117
P0122
P0304
P0327
P0134
P0300
P0201
P0204
P0341
P0351
P1133

ndifrischia 08-28-2013 12:09 AM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
Im sorry i started a thought there and trailed off...
I With odd ball injector swapped with #1 Cyl, Old ICM/Coils back on (cleaned up a bit), it seems to run good cold... or more like once i decelerate and then try and take off again... feels rather powerless, jerky and misses...

Highmile 08-28-2013 07:05 AM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
No matter what you throw at it, until the 85 psi compression on #2 is resolved noting is really going to make it run decently.

It does seem like it has a ton of issues besides and maybe someone else will chime in and help but it really sounds like an electrical/ecm issue to me with the number of codes you have.

Highmile
'95 SL1 526k and counting

ndifrischia 08-28-2013 10:25 AM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
Will be working on compression issues very soon..
Also will clear codes for a fresh start to see what pops up
Drove into work today and it actually ran okayish

ndifrischia 08-29-2013 11:35 AM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
RPMs raise to 2k at start up and then drop to 800 after 7 seconds... im thnking TPS.. but would love a second opinion. Will be checking compression wet soon

ndifrischia 09-02-2013 02:11 PM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
Current DTCs
P0303
P1133

Will be checking Wet Compression Today

ndifrischia 09-05-2013 10:17 AM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
#2 Cylinder
105 @ 7 cranks dry
110 @ 7 cranks wet

LabRat 09-05-2013 10:24 AM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
valve bad, crack or head gasket leak on #2 :tear:
-LR

ndifrischia 08-02-2014 09:13 PM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
Well time sure does fly! FINALLY took the head off (burnt exhaust valves). replaced head gasket, intake/exhaust manifold gasket, new wires, plugs, thermostat, radiator and oil cooler line (blew out on the test drive... may have jacked the engine up too high)....


present trouble codes

P0112 (forgot to connect it while putting back together
P0404 (pulled one from an old pontiac... probably a terrible idea)
P0327 ???? cant find listing knock sensor maybe?????
P1620 (when trany line blew out)
P1404 (pretty sure the "1" just means its in the history)

all and all it seems to have breathed new life into this car with 216XXX on the dash but i want to go the distance here...

any recommendations on brand of EGR to buy to replace??
any clue on the P0327??

the IAT code should disappear seeing how its connected now

Thanks guys! This forum is the best!

SL19302 08-02-2014 09:22 PM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
Delphi is a good brand for an EGR valve, Make sure the EGR passages are clean and not blocked.

ndifrischia 08-02-2014 09:51 PM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
... probably should have done that during tear down(!@#$)


any good way to get it done without taking off the manidold/head again?? it was a bit of a process..


THANKS!

Signmaster 08-03-2014 01:26 AM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
Get the car/oil up to operating temp, then remove the EGR and start the car. It will bounce off the rev limiter due to the vacuum leak and blow the carbon out of system. Warming the car is just so the oil is up to temp and you have good lubrication at the rev limiter bounce.

DawnR 08-03-2014 03:19 PM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
[QUOTE=Signmaster;2083737]Get the car/oil up to operating temp, then remove the EGR and start the car. It will bounce off the rev limiter due to the vacuum leak and blow the carbon out of system. Warming the car is just so the oil is up to temp and you have good lubrication at the rev limiter bounce.[/QUOTE]

Where does the carbon blow out to...
I picture ashes everywhere or a huge mess.
:xeye:

Steve44 08-03-2014 04:55 PM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
Yes it does! There really isn't so much that it could hurt you, unless you're under the hood. (You should be starting it from the drivers seat:D) Don't let your kids or anyone else you like witness this event. :)

ndifrischia 08-05-2014 12:34 PM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
Got it up to temp and took EGR off and started it twice, not too much shot out except white smoke from exhaust and EGR passageway

ndifrischia 08-05-2014 01:15 PM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
definitely have a valve cover leak, gonna take care of that today. P0300 i suspect from oil leaking down to the ICM. Hope the Timing cover isnt leaking also. Any culprit for the knock sensor code? Ive been running a higher octane than i should right now (done with that noise! back to the cheap stuff) and figured that may have been causing the sensor code... not sure though

ndifrischia 08-05-2014 05:02 PM

Re: All Sorts of Problems!... i think
 
Compression at 200/215/200/195
New EGR still throws P0404 code even after blowing out passages (didnt seem like a lot came out though)
Still have
P0327
P0300

and I think one more... possibly P0112

This engine ran AMAZINGLY yesterday till in the evening when it started missfiring, thats when i noticed the valve cover leak, think i fixed that, havent driven enough to see if ive fixed it properly... so confused on how well this car was going and then it just feels like crap now.

Compression test = good
Cleaned Grounds
Cleaned ICM/Coil Contacts/Backing Plate

... ive been thinking that the oil that was thrown all over the engine compartment might have leaked down to the CPS... could that be giving me multiple misfires?? It feels like the only thing i havent replaced on this car yet


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