Would You Buy a Saturn Built Without Polymer Body Panels?

[Charlie]

Rumors have indicated for quite some time that future Saturns, especially those built outside of Saturn's Spring Hill plant, would be built without polymer body side panels. Now some are saying that the next generation ION and VUE due out in 2008-09 will have steel bodies as well.

Would you buy a Saturn built without polymer body panels?

Please explain your position.

Thanks!
Charlie

[SL2GUY]

That's the main reason I bought it so it won't rust and dent. Without that its just another car I'd probably buy a VW.

[THX712517]

The only Saturn I'd buy without polymer would have to have some seriously insane power, AWD, six speed manual transmission, and styling that would make Pininfarina cry with joy. Add to that awesome build quality, beautiful fit, finish, and interior materials, and oh yeah, it'll have to cost three dollars.

[WKDave3]

that's the one defining characteristic in Saturn's that's left. I don't think besides the VUE that the vehicles are unique anymore except for the body panels. that's the main reason why i bought my '94 SL2...it looks like nothing else and has plastic panels

[piney]

I like a ding free car & the safety that the subframe offers as well. If I wanted a steel car, I'd have one.

The polymer is Saturn's main competitive edge over the dealership experience. The car lasts for years the dealership experience is only an afternoon here and again. Absent the polymer, there would be no reason to buy one.

[ProDarwin]

I like Saturns because they are light. At 2450lbs, I have one of the lightest wagons you can buy. I think that way too many cars these days are getting fat (a 2700lb ION disgusts me). Polymer panels make the Saturn weigh less, plus they did save me about $2k in bodywork when I turned my wagon on its side ($60 damage). Not only that, but if you switch to metal panels, then Saturn will stray from the spaceframe construction, and more toward a normal unibody where there is not nearly as much strength, and crashworthyness (that a word?).

[swoker183]

i have to say just abbout the same thing as THX712517. if it didint, it better make up for it in the power of the car

[waugie]

i think the polymer is one of the best ideas going...it's lightweight, hence the better gas mileage and better weight to hp ratio that makes us kick ass, they're dent resistant, easy to remove and replace for body work, and not to mention that the steel business hates us b/c if all cars were to switch to this breakthrough ideal that it would run them practically broke...just a few thoughts

[DesertPuma]

No.

It's what make's Saturn, well Saturn. :cry:

[Xanatos]

The car would definately have to make it up in power if it went to steal. I love the looks of saturns, and I love the polymer. And I know I don't have the most powerful car out there.

But if you take away my polymer, you better give me content somewhere else for me to spend money on the car.

I really home high GM execs read this. But not that they would care.

[wei_]

In the end, history will remember Saturn as the experiment that FAILED if polymer and no haggle go away. Even the unique UAW-Saturn labor agreement is gone.
Wei

[thatjerryguy]

I'm also with THX712517 -- the only way I'd buy a Saturn without polymer is if it's the exact car I want, and world-class to boot. If the next generation L-Series is going to be steel bodied, it had better put class leaders like the Accord, Camry and Passat to such complete and utter shame that the head honchos of those companies run up the white flag and commit mass suicide, and have Car magazines crawling on their hands and knees to Spring Hill (and the homes of every Saturn owner) to beg forgiveness for every single bad thing they ever wrote about Saturn. If not, no deal.

:flag:

[haypops]

I'm the first one to vote yes to buying a saturn without polymer panels. It wouldn't be as agood a car, but I still would consider it. I didn't buy my Saturn to be different myself (I already am), or to buy from a different kind of company. I want the best car. Sometimes that means subtle differences like picking the best parts from the parts bin of the largest manufacturer in the world.

Does any one know how much extra polymer costs/car or for that matter how much extra the 30 day warranty costs? Just interested

[eRic 02sc2]

a saturn without plastic body panels is not a saturn. no thanks. it's bad enough the ion is 300 lbs heavier than the s-series that it replaced, has no rear discs available and it doesn't have a fully independant rear suspension. gm would be stupid to drop the polymer panels. what's next? pushrods? carburetors? leaf springs?

[haypops]

Originally posted by eRic 96sc2
a saturn without plastic body panels is not a saturn. nwhat's next? pushrods? ?

There was an engineering report out of the Detroit auto show that said GM was deffinetly going away from OHC engines.

[VTHokie00SL2]

I pretty much agree with most of what's been said here. If the polymer panels disappear, it's just another sign that Saturn is dead. How can anyone argue otherwise? Like Saturnmeister said in another thread, there are no real Saturns anymore, just typical GM crap dragging Saturn's good name through the mud.

[VTHokie00SL2]

Originally posted by ProDarwin
Not only that, but if you switch to metal panels, then Saturn will stray from the spaceframe construction, and more toward a normal unibody where there is not nearly as much strength, and crashworthyness (that a word?).

Yep, that's a word, spelled crashworthiness, though! :yes:

[WHITE98SL2]

Polymer, its a must. I have seen people in parking lots bang my doors and even one guy got his drivers door stuck on my passenger door when he opened his door from inside his car with extreme force causing it bind, but zero damage I just had to buff off his paint left behind on my door. Not to mention the runaway shoping cart in parking lots.

[DesertPuma]

Let's hope GM is paying attention...:hmpf:

[GR898SL2]

Polymer is the last thing Saturn has going for it right now. If GM does away with the polymer panels, they might as well put a Chevy bowtie on the car instead. A steel-bodied Saturn would have to exceed Japanese and European benchmarks in quality (especially with relation to price) to be worthy of consideration.

:flag:

[100KSW2]

Originally posted by GR898SL2
Polymer is the last thing Saturn has going for it right now. If GM does away with the polymer panels, they might as well put a Chevy bowtie on the car instead. A steel-bodied Saturn would have to exceed Japanese and European benchmarks in quality (especially with relation to price) to be worthy of consideration.

:flag:

Well said! There are a number of Saturn owners on here that owned Japanese cars before they moved to a Saturn because they'd had the experience of owning a car with a still perfect engine but the body looked like H*** from rust and dings.

My ten year old 110K mile SW2 looks like new, as do many other 1st Generation Saturns I see on a daily basis. The (steel bodied) 1993 Corollas and CIVICS and Escorts and Cavaliers I see around generally don't.

[XtremeGrandAm]

I wouldnt buy an ION that was steel bodied. The car doesnt offer enough vs other cars out there. Polymer is one of the key selling points of saturns. Now I understand the limitations of polymer in larger vehicles and know all saturns cant all be polymer because of that. but I would not ever by a steel bodied ION or VUE

[RustyJCNC]

I have posted, save polymer = save saturn. However, the more I read, the more I disagree with myself.

Saturn will still be part of GM, polymer or no polymer. So, I think it's a harsh reality that the good will come with the bad. I'd rather focus on improvment rather then harking on the things we just simply know will never change.

I'd love to see polymer stay, but I didn't buy the car simply for what it was made from in concerns to body panels. I bought the vehicle from an above excellent sales experience as well as the best American made quality in it's class.

-j

[Tenchi Masaki]

Once they go steel panel, I will be buying a Z06 and CTS-V and be done with Saturn with no more customizations to my cars. That's what got me started on Saturn in the first place. It's the most distinctive feature for them and it's why, after having this, I'd never want to buy a steel-bodied car. Z06 keeps me up with that but the CTS-V won't but oh well. But if I had to choose between an ION, Focus, Sunfire, or Cavalier, yeah I'd still go with the ION. If I had to go with the Taurus, Malibu, Bonneville or Grand Am, or Saturn L or V, well, I'd have to see what the Saturn V offers but I'd probably go with the Pontiac. It's those panels that keep me coming back for the car. But it is still how the retailer treats me that keeps me coming back to Saturn. Times are changing and many in the automotive industry will continue to make the wrong decisions. I guess we'll see how this one plays out....

[benpatient]

i'm confused by your Z06 reference. you just jumped 30,000 dollars there...

and which pontiac of that list? because a bonneville is clearly a better car, but a grand am is 10K cheaper. so confused.

oh a question for everyone complaining about the ION weight. aside from the S series, what other cars in class weigh under 2600lbs? apparently light isn't cool anymore. not with all he excursions and tahoes on the road that we have to protect ourselves against...that's 300 pounds extra that will keep me from rolling one more time after an excursion blows a tire and comes across 3 lanes of traffic going 70 mph and smashes into my rear quarter.

i have this video clip of a 911 GT1 coming fast over a hill and at the apex, a gust gets under the front of the car, which proceeds to fly, literally, 20 feet up into the air, flipping no less than 4 times end over end, and then smashing down front first and exploding in a shower of flame. this car weighs less than 2000 lbs and was going probably 95 at the top of that hill. the only reason the driver wasn't dead is because A.) it's a porsche and B.) a considerable amount of it's 1.2 million dollar price tag went towards safety. lighter is faster. but not necessarily better.

[L300Boy]

Yes, I would...it really wouldnt be a CON for me.

But this also means that Saturn would no longer have such a plastic panel PRO, and be like yet any other car on the road. And in such a competitive market, one less advantage may direct me towards another line of cars.....i like saturn but im not afraid to "defect"

[corympak]

This kind of reminds me of my old poll!!!

http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/showthread.php3?threadid=13592&highlight=boing

[FL ION BY]

I would not buy a Saturn made of steel. I like the rust free dent free look Saturns maintain after years of service. Living in the city it is a most important feature to keep the car looking great. This is not a thing that Saturn should change.

[SaturnSdn]

With the death of the Saturn S-car I don't see me buying another new Saturn ever. I have my two 2001 SL2's and anything Saturn I buy from now on will have to be used. The ION is just an "UGLY" "UGLY" car. Guess Saturn has lost an eight time Saturn buyer.

[skijay]

Without the polymer, it would be just another car company.

[FL ION BY]

SaturnSdn, it is too bad they did not keep the S but update it along the way. I disagree with the ION being ugly, I love the ION and just ordered one. I do think they should have kept the S series as well and would have done well to create an updated version of the original sedan. The ION does appeal to a lot of people and perhaps will bring onboard new owners. I think the key to Saturn's future is a bit more variety to appeal to all types of buyers. The VUE is great, my companion bought one, but they should have had that out three years earlier. I am so glad that the VUE did come out, we needed an SUV and wanted to stick with Saturn products. We waited for the VUE and it was worth the wait anyway. It is interesting how certain models grab some people and not others. I am thrilled with the ION design. This is why I think they need to offer a few more products.:cool:

[SaturnSdn]

I to like the VUE but do not want or need a SUV. I also like the updated L-Car but I don't want a large car. The ION is also larger then I want. The 91-95 and 2000-2002 S-cars were done just right. 96-99 S-Cars are good looking cars. But there is no-way I can ever see me in an ION Sedan and the QC so far does nothing for me. I will say the ION with a 5 speed is a very nice road car. I drove one from Vegas to Phx and on two lane blacktop it did outstanding when wanting to pass.

[JanCan]

The polymer panels have always been the knit to pick by low-rent car critics. I can't count the number of these hacks cut-and-pasted "large gaps" comments into their write-ups. Unfortunately, I think some of the higher-ups in GM pay them more attention than people like you and me, who put the polymer high in our top-ten reasons why we bought a Saturn in the first place.

A Saturn is not a stand-out in the crowd for it's styling (OK, OK, maybe excluding the SC2 from that). A Saturn stands out because, well... I don't have to preach to the choir..., so if they axe one of the main selling features, they might as well call them Chevy's, watch them blend into the ocean of cookie cutter sedans, and we'll all try to guess how much they sell for at the dealership.

[piney]

Originally posted by JanCan
The polymer panels have always been the knit to pick by low-rent car critics

True - and it will be interesting to see how the Cadillac XLR (or whatever they are calling the new drop-top) is put together. That will be Saturnlike polymer as well. I wonder what the gaps will be like on that & what the pundits will say as the press loves that Caddy so far.

[Dr. Bob]

My first response was "Heck no!", absolutely, positively must have the plastic panels.

Especially here in Minnesota and because I drive on gravel roads.

There are two distinctives for Saturn: one is the plastic panels and the second is the retailer business conduct.

Lose either and Saturn is likely gone.

[Qlara]

Simply ask:
What makes Saturn cars 'Different' without polymer anymore?

GM is lame.....without Saturn, I'll buy Ford as domestic.

[saturnrings]

Originally posted by THX712517
The only Saturn I'd buy without polymer would have to have some seriously insane power, AWD, six speed manual transmission, and styling that would make Pininfarina cry with joy. Add to that awesome build quality, beautiful fit, finish, and interior materials, and oh yeah, it'll have to cost three dollars.

So that's a no? :D

[hoperlw1]

It's too bad. Each Saturn generation gets worse, imo.

:fish:

:no:

[haypops]

For those of you who wouldn't buy a Saturn without polymer panels; Since their are no popular priced vehicles with polymers, does that mean you consider Saturn considerably inferior to most other cars with respect to every thing else?

[Dr. Bob]

Not "considerably inferior", maybe not "inferior". How about "mediocre" or "middle of the pack"?

For me, much (but not all) of the "value proposition" of a Saturn goes away if the plastic panels disappear.

I really don't like having to repaint the rocker panels every year of a metal bodied car just ot keep the rust away.

[piney]

Someone posted elsewhere that the Transports and Silhouette (dustbuster) vans were polymer. If that is the case, is the Aztek polymer as well? Even if it is, it is still ugly & I would not buy it, but all this talk about polymer vs. metal brings up the issue of "is polymer a selling feature?"

I'd think that Pontiac and vicariously, the Rondevous, would be made from the same materials as they are cousins with the dustbuster vans.

If any car were polymer, would you be more inclined, as I am, to want it?

[ProDarwin]

Originally posted by eRic 96sc2
a saturn without plastic body panels is not a saturn. no thanks. it's bad enough the ion is 300 lbs heavier than the s-series that it replaced, has no rear discs available and it doesn't have a fully independant rear suspension. gm would be stupid to drop the polymer panels. what's next?

An Air Cooled Engine.

[ProDarwin]

I'm suprised that no one has mentioned that Saturn is still the only car company with recycleable body panels...

[Dr. Bob]

As for the recycling, steel bodies have been crushed and reprocessed for many years.

[Dr. Bob]

Many cars have plastic body parts - my father-in-law's 94 Buick Le Sabre's front fenders were plastic.

[ProDarwin]

Dr. Bob - Saturn uses thermoplastics, which are recycleable, in order to meet Tenesee production laws. The rest of GM uses thermosets (normally glass reinforced) insted of thermoplastics, which are not recycleable.

[piney]

Originally posted by ProDarwin
Dr. Bob - Saturn uses thermoplastics, which are recycleable, in order to meet Tenesee production laws. The rest of GM uses thermosets (normally glass reinforced) insted of thermoplastics, which are not recycleable.

That makes more sense to me. I had thought that the dustbuster vans were made of some composite, similar to what the Vettes are made from and less similar to the Saturn polymer.

[Sunnzi]

One of the major reasons I bought a Saturn was because of the polymer panels. I looked at the Kia,. Sephia, Chev, Cavalier. Honda, Civic and others. Even though the power was greater in most of these other cars the styling and polymer where the major factors in my decision. (I have an SL 1 2001). If Saturn decides to go with a steel body I would have to really think about getting another one, I would be more likely to buy a Honda. I live in Canada and the salt on our roads is crazy, my friend has a Kia, Sephia 3 yrs old and the fenders around his wheel wells have rust that’s starting to break though the paint and its dented to s#!t . I hope Saturn stays with the polymer.

[VTHokie00SL2]

If Saturn moves away from polymer panels, perhaps they can offer some sort of dent resistant feature to at least partially compensate. Is that possible? Maybe just use thicker sheet metal - I don't know. In any case, it still won't match the polymer, but something is better than nothing.

Maybe they could at least give away one of those ding repair kits you see advertised on tv with the sale of each car! :D

I have had concerns about the polymer panels, as much as I like them. I always wondered about long term durability. I wondered if they would become brittle with age. Also, I always wondered how much temperature is a factor in their shatter resistance.

[maficke]

Plastic please. I like being able to say my car is made from recycled milk jugs.

--m.

[GregoriusM]

I have a 94 SL2 that looks like the day it was bought!

On the other hand, there are cars in the parking lot of my apartment complex that are 6 months old and have one, two, three of more dings on the side!

I have no rust, no dings!

And as far as the "shatter proof" in the cold part, we have up to -40C weather here in Winnipeg, and I can hit the fenders with my knee as hard as I can and there is no problem whatsoever. No paint crackling, no denting.... nothing.

If they take away polymer from Saturn, I'm gone. The new ION looks good from the outside, but for the price, the interior and features aren't good enough for me to buy the car unless it had polymer panels.

I just heard about the new mini-van. If it has polymer panels, put me first on the list. If it doesn't, then I've got a multitude of vans to choose from. I'd forego a far bit in terms of looks and features to get polymer all the way around the vehicle.

'Nuff said!

... Greg

[IONicSaturn]

I think I would definetly buy another Saturn if it didn't have polymer. When my family and I got our SL1, we didn't know what it was made of (mainly because we bought it from a Chrysler dealer), so that had nothing to do with why we bought the car. We liked the looks of it, we knew people who swore by them, it was comfortable, drove nicely, and the price was right. I do think that the polymer has a lot to do with why people buy Saturns, I don't think it's the only reason. Now that I know what the car is made of (the polymer was brought to my attention by a friend of my mom's the day before we took delivery back in October of '98), I don't know what I would do without it. I've recieved tons of compliments on how great the car looks for it's age ('96, it's not THAT old), one of my neighbors thought it was brand new about a year ago, and it has come out unscathed from many brushes with grocery store shopping carts and bohemath SUV doors. In fact, just the other day, it was parked in the Stop & Shop parking lot with my sister and nephew in the back seat while I was in the store. An older woman driving an Oldsmobile or something hit a shopping cart going about 15mph, and it slammed right into the left rear quarter panel of my Saturn. I came out and my sister was almost in tears, and she said "Oh my God, someone just hit the car!" She couldn't get out and say something, because the woman ran off, and because her 7 month old son was there and she couldn't leave him. I got out of the car, inspected the area, and to no suprise, NO DAMAGE, not even a scratch. I got back in the car, and my sister was really upset, so I said "Don't worry, Stacey, it's polymer. It doesn't dent. There isn't even a scratch!" (she somehow thought it was her fault, because she didn't say something to the woman).

So while I love the polymer panels on my car, as they really keep it looking good, I would definetly buy another Saturn even if it was made of steel.

[mod96sl2]

No plastic no buy, i love my DENT RESISTANT side palels, i just hit my car the other day with my shop truck door and i loved the fact i didnt do any damage to my car door, except the yellow paint from my shop truck that is.

[sc288203]

Unless Saturn comes out the a car that will run 12's in a quarter mile (stock), AND you can add performance parts to make it go faster, AND has an awesome sound system, AND comes with kick-ass rims and tires, AND doesn't cost an arm and a leg.... I might buy it.

[Craig]

My old '92 SL2 got smacked in the nose by a Dodge Dynasty that ran a red light...took out the fender, grille, headlight, fender, and trim on the passenger side of the Dynasty, just left a scuff mark on the nose of the Saturn. The cop couldn't believe it, the insurance company wouldn't believe it, and the State asked me to elaborate more on my vehicle damage. Any other car would've had a smashed-in fender. I didn't even file a claim, just had my neighbor buff it out.

[KoolVue]

The main thing that steer me away from the L was the non-polymer rear quarter pannel. I beleive the area surrounding the trunk is the hardest to repair in the event of an accident. My first car an 1988 Nissan Sentra was hit in the rear quarter pannel to me purshasing it and the trunk leaked all the time. If it had polymer pannels it would have been replaced by a new pannel and probably would have never leaked.

[cary]

Every time a door slams into my L-300’s side panels, I wipe away the damage with a little rubbing compound, and consider a thin steel car. I critically look at the way the body panels match — you know that extra couple of thousands-of-an-inch difference CR and other auto “experts” disapprove of. I laugh and laugh.

My Saturn's medium red paint is two years old and looks great. The car has not had a problem the dealer couldn’t fix during a regular oil change. Saturn and its dealer network have delivered on their part of the contract since I bought the car — plastic body and all.

In November we plan on buying our eighth Saturn. Haven’t been disappointed yet. Paul Newman, the actor and race car driver, might have said it best, “When you’ve offered steak, why would you choose hamburger?”

[MydnightMyst]

No way would I buy one without the polymer panels.. It's sort of their trademark. If I wanted a car without them, I would buy one without them. I don't really care for all this metal to metal stuff. Metal dings really easily. I should know. I own a mini-van that is bigger than my Saturn, and has ended up with a few scratches and dings of it's own due to me not knowing where the ends of it are when I first bought it.
It's a shame that the General has to dig deeper into Saturns roots and have such desire to make it like a normal every day GM car.
It was founded and designed on being "different". Saturn can't be different with metal panels, shared chassis', and shared engines.
While I look at the sharing of chassis and engines as a small gain for Saturn, the polymer panels are there to remind us of Saturn's unique and different origin.
The reason I look at one change as a positive and the other as a negative is because I am performance oriented. For Saturn to share the same engine with other GM compacts means more performance parts and better prices from my favorite Saturn aftermarket parts place because THEY will get their parts cheaper from the manufacturer (mass production).
Sharing a chassis, from a GM employee's POV, means GM will save money using the same platform for several different cars. Which means that some of that money will be rolled back into the factories that build GM products.
And while certainly the same is true should GM take Saturn's unique polymer panels out and replace them with metal ones, I think that would be going too far and would remove what is left of Saturn's origin..
GM should bite the big one and just keep the polymer panels. The resist dings and are easy enough to replace or repair. They hold on to a vital part of Saturn's history and keep it a step or two away from doom (remember Oldsmobile and the F-bodies? Guess where Buick is going too!).
As long as Saturn remains innovation AND different, they have a chance in this sea of metal sharks with their wonderful style.
GM has made some, IMHO, just horrid mistakes with Saturn, but they can redeem themselves by leaving the polymer alone. A TRUCK with a V8 wouldn't hurt either.
In front of every good race car on a trailer is an AWESOME truck of the same make towing it.
Although my Ford does a damn fine job thank you. I would prefer a Saturn truck.. HINT HINT to Saturn Corp.

[zborgerd]

Heck. I'd buy a Saturn truck if I was looking for a truck, as long as it didn't look like a Chevy Avalanche.

I'd never get rid of plastic on a Saturn! One of the benefits to buying it is the plastic. I look on the road and see 10 year old SL1s that look brand new. Can't say that about metal cars. Every steel body car that I've had has been banged all up over time as a result of *other people's* negligence. I can't say how peeved I was when my Dodge Neon was banged up by a truck that tried to park in a SUBCOMPACT spot at school. There was a scrape down my driver's side door. It buffed out, for the most part, but left a dent that was noticable by me. There were all sorts of other dents and dings on the car. Worst damage that I've ever seen on a Saturn was only one instance where a front fender was cracked and not replaced.

If Saturn goes to steel, I'll go to Honda, Nissan, or Mitsubishi. I don't mind the Delta platform and Ecotec plan- and I actually encourage it to save costs (assuming that it is as reliable as the S series). But the spaceframe and polymer makes a Saturn a Saturn. Otherwise, a metal Ion would just be a future Cavelier with a center IP.

[1993SC2]

I like my '93s killer power/weight ratio (I'll show ya how I smoked a Civic EX with a (eek!) Saturn) If it were steel, I'd rather have a Metro or a Fiesta with a "I race Golf Carts" bumper sticker.

I plan to keep my SC, and save up for either the maybe-to-be Sky or a new GTO... I love pushrod v8 power with the scent of burnt rubber.

[BradJK]

Polymer is a definate plus when purchasing a Saturn... But......
If Saturn designed an awesome car that happened to be steel and fit all my requirements. My dealership would still be my deciding factor to stay with Saturn.

I have never been so comfortable spending so much money so many times.

I do hope Saturn always has Plastic doors... They save so much money in body shop bills!!!!

[Scotto]

No way! When I bought my 2001 SL2, I was looking at the VW Jetta and the Toyota Corolla. The Corolla was cheaper and more nicely appointed than the SL2. While the Jetta was a bit more expensive, it was a nicer package (mechanically and otherwise).

The ONLY reason that tipped the scales for me to buy the SL2 was the polymer panels. It was proven to me when some careless douchebag threw her door into my SL2's door--a scant few hours after I bought the car! The damage? A small paint scrape (which I was able to rub out).

I also live in Minnesota, where the winter salting of roads wreaks havoc on car bodies. With my SL2, I can use the automatic car wash in colder temperatures than if I had a metal-mobile...and I don't have to worry about the car looking like a rusty pile of junk before the mechanicals wear out.

GM/Saturn should worry more about good engineering and quality of assembly. It wouldn't hurt if they stayed away from weird styling trends too (ION dashboard and other Saturn interior fabric choices--YUCK).

I really am drooling to buy a 2004/2005 Vue with the 3.5L Honda motor! Then, I'd have the best of both worlds: polymer panels and a smooth, reliable motor! Too bad the Honda Odyssey doesn't have polymer panels (hint hint Saturn)!

[silverplum]

The polymer is one reason that Saturns are so special. I consider polymer a selling feature, especially if you are going to keep your car a long time.

[walt]

WHEN Saturn does away polymer side panals they will need to do somthing to make it stand out from the rest of the cookie cutter cars out there.Since it appears from other post GM is bent on rebadgeing future Saturns out of other GM products they will need to give Saturn something that makes it unique. Maybe super wide moldings to give the owner anti ding protection like the polymer panels now give.

[kknobl]

I don't know what I would do. I will say, though, that it may give me reason to actually consider some other GM cars. Right now, I would never consider anything other than a Saturn. But if polymer goes away, why not look at a Pontiac or Chevy, since they will be similar anyway.

If, after the long day of history looks back on Saturn and judges it a failure, it will be GM's fault. As I've said before, I'm a loyal GM person, but I think they do have an uncanny ability to screw up even the best things.

Everytime I look at an early Saturn, it reminds me of the boundless optimisim surrounding Saturn when it began selling cars. Saturn was GM's answer to the Japanese - and Saturn was going to show the Japanese a thing or two. It was going to show that through innovative labor agreements, an old dog could indeed learn new tricks - and even beat the competition at their own game. Saturn was going to draw import buyers back into the GM fold - which it was (and to an extent, still is for now) very successful at doing. Saturn was going to show its parent that if Americans can build a good, quality car, Americans would buy an American product. Saturn was going to revolutionize the auto industry - from they way the cars were constructed to the way they were sold - Saturn was different.

The sad truth of the matter is this: GM politics let Saturn decay to the point it's at right now. Saturn was a pet project of Roger Smith. Most people know that Roger Smith shoulders a lot of blame for GMs problems of the 80s and 90s. GM executives knew this too, and wanted to see Saturn fail, after all, if it was successful Roger Smith would get all of the credit for it. GM couldn't have it, so they starved Saturn (more of less out of spite) so when it decayed, GM could go in and "rescue" it. Had GM pumped more models into Saturn's pipeline sooner, things might be different today. Saturn had all the potential in the world and now its future seems to be that of simply being another GM division.

In a recent article in a trade magazine, Jack Smith (no relation to Roger) was interviewed because he's retiring from GM. He was asked about various executives he had worked with and under. He was asked about Tom Murphy, Pete Estes, Robert Stempel, Rick Wagoner, and Roger Smith, among others. In it, he give Smith a lot of credit for his EDS and Hughes acquisitions, but does not say a word about Saturn...Interesting and sad. Saturn, had GM done things as they should have, would have proven to be a stroke of genius and a brilliant success for GM and Roger Smith. Alas, it was not to be...

Kevin

[LynnF]

Originally posted by piney
I like a ding free car & the safety that the subframe offers as well. If I wanted a steel car, I'd have one.

The polymer is Saturn's main competitive edge over the dealership experience. The car lasts for years the dealership experience is only an afternoon here and again. Absent the polymer, there would be no reason to buy one.

What he said! :redjump: I love having a car in Buffalo that doesn't get eaten to pieces by winter road salt! And the polymer panels withstand bumps and dings that would send a metal car to the body shop. Tell GM to quit messing with a good thing and concentrate on coming up with more diverse models!

[TommyH]

Dear General Motors and Saturn,

I recieve many astonished looks and comments from people who are not familiar with Saturns that my SC2 is a '97 and, at the point that I'm writing this, is five and a half years old! This is due in part to the styling of the SC2, but mostly to the near indestructable polymer body panels. I'm saddened to learn that the rear quarter panels of the L's are not "Rubbermaid" and will show wear so very much sooner than the "Tupperware" doors and front quarter panels. If this thread has not made is plain to you yet, you have created a large number of customers with letting Saturn be Saturn and using the now trademark polymer panels. Thank you very much for creating "A different kind of car, a different kind of company", please let that different kind of company keep useing it's "different kind of body panels". This may seem like a small thing to outsiders of this "Saturn Cult" (as some auto reviews call us), but it is one of the, now very, few things that make Saturn "A different kind of company". It is one of the things that has set this car appart from the others in its class. If Pontiac lost it's "edgy" shapes, and "performance" minded "tuning" then the only thing to do would be to call it a Chevy (or Toyota in the Matrix's case). I believe that I speak for most if not all loyal Saturn owners, when pleading to you to never do away with the trademark polymer panels (Improve upon them, please, if you can; or make even more parts of the car out of it like the hood and roof.).
So, please pay no heed to the nay-saying automotive journalists who can only find "body panel gap width" and the automatic transmission (in "D") 1/4 mile times to harp on and flaunt as "major defficiancies" of the Saturn line of auto's. Instead embrace the fact that the polymer panels are the differant to the otherwise stagnent pool of steel paneled normality. You have built a very loyal customer base with this different body cladding, please do not loose us to other "normal" car corperations. Please do not ever make Saturns without polymer panels.

Respectfully Submitted,
Thomas J. Huebner
owner of a 1997 Saturn SC2



(Referances to Rubbermaid and Tupperware are registered trademarks and were used without permission - please don't sue me.)

(You know after reading this I think I'm going to repost this in the suggestions forum as a new thread...)

:flag:

[Spazie]

Originally posted by TommyH
Saturn corperation says that the front of every Saturn is designed to look like it's smiling at you as it comes down the highway.....I don't know about you but the '97 SC2 has always looked like a shark to me....and that makes me smile....

You know... I think mine looks like it's sleeping... but anyways..


One of my favorite things about my saturn is the dent resistent side panels. Right after I got my SL, my friend opened the door of her Buick into the side of my car pretty hard and slammed my car pretty good. She freaked and thought she would have dented my door and I was like "gotta love that polymer!" She didn't know Saturns were made of plastic!

I don't think I would buy a Saturn if it wasn't polymer. That's what makes a Saturn.. well.. a Saturn! I don't like the new Saturns that much anyway... they don't look like Saturns, except for the VUE. GM needs to realize that they had a good thing going for them and stick with something that works!

[IndyVUE]

We just returned a leased 2000 Toyota Solara....guess what happened 2 weeks after delivery in '00? A DOOR DING :x

Polymer is what defines and refines Saturn from the others.

GM, see what happens to 'vette sales when you want to make them from denting, rusting steel.........

(oh rats!, maybe that is the plan, return to the GM of OLD) :sleep:

[ChrisION]

i would. the dent-resistant panels are nice, but i would still buy a saturn without them. thats like not buying a mercedes just because it doesnt have standard leather :-P

[SaturnVLN]

I would have to say maybe. The polymer panels were also the selling point for me. And, as much as I don't like it, it seems that the polymer panels will be phased out now that GM is intent on putting Saturn under their complete control (perhaps into Oldsmobile's empty slot?). Let's see what all of these changes will lead to. I just hope the way the retailers do business does not change. I rather enjoyed that experience. I actually enjoy taking my Saturns in for their routine check ups.

[jzatofl]

NO! Thats why I bought a Saturn for the Polymer panels. I hate dings from rude other drivers...I think I have paid the dentless ding guy in St. Petersburg enought money to buy a house on the Gulf of Mexico from my other two cars.

Plus the Saturns still look good when they get older. Not like the other used cars with dings and dents all over the panels and fenders. If Saturns drops the polymer panels I will not purchase a new Saturn, but stick with the older models.

98-SC2
04-Rodeo
02-XK8

[rerunjas]

One of the reasons I bought a Saturn was its Polymer Side Panels. If they switch to metal, then thats one less reason to buy a Saturn. Also, If they start building them in Mexico, then thats another reason not to buy a Saturn. If all of that does happens, then I probably wont buy another Saturn. GM needs to wise up and stop sending our USA Jobs to Canada and Mexico. Those are America's Jobs. Thats another reason not to buy a GM car made outside the US. :) James :us:

[Nessuno]

The Only Reason Left For Me To Buy A Saturn Are The Polymer Body Panels! The Vue Is Noisy, Not Very Well Built, And The Paint Job Stinks!

[Elsongs]

I owned an SL2 for a month shy of 13 years. I must have been rear-ended about 6 times. Five of those times, there was no damage at all, and in all those instances, the other driver and I both shrugged said, "Eh..." and left before we even considered whipping out the insurance info.

The sixth time, though, I was rear-ended at a slight angle and the other car (a Chevy Lumina sedan) smashed the right rear end in. My SL2 was considered todaled, and a settlement check later I bought myself a 2005 ION2 sedan.

It already had features I would consider "different" like the center instrument panel, the trunk battery and the electric power steering. But the polymer is what a good old Saturn is and what it should be. Those panel "gaps" can only be measured in milimeters, but the value of a dent-resistant car body is immeasurable.

I already know that after '06, Saturns will no longer offer polymer panels.
I really hope and pray that the steel-panel Saturns (and the rebadged Opel models of '07) will just be a "phase" and that they'll return to classic Saturn bodies and styles in the future.

[Scott]

I vote for more polymer, not less. I have a dent on my (steel) hood where some drunk jumped on the car. I have a dent on the (steel) roof where a big branch fell in a storm. I have a dent in the (steel) trunk lid from closing it on some firewood that didn't quite fit in there. It bugs me to no end that I have all these dents in a "plastic" car.

No dents in the sides, of course.

[AltF4]

Nope, and I was pretty jazzed up about the sky too till I realized its coming out as steel.
My 96 SC2 looks great (except for the black window trim paint), and runs pretty dang good too (103000 miles). I have been shopping for a new car - looked at the RX8, Mitsubishi, Ford's pony car, and a couple of other coupes, but can't find one that really yanks my chain. If Saturn had the polymer on the new Sky, it would be hands down, an easy choice. too bad, no polymer, no thanks.

Maybe I'll go test drive a charger.....

[01SC1blue]

im about 70% in favor 30% not, yes panels dont rust, dent, are very lightweight (helps mileage speed and makes up for unfortunately a lil lack in pwr of the SOHC engine 100hp. which with polymer panels i can rape a escort ZX2 which has 130hp) and are very strong in the summer, but in the winter i live in winnipeg we get -50celcius, the shatter like glass and a new panel for my car is 700$ unpainted and another 200$ to get fitted and finished way more than a steel panel
they dont dent but man if something rubs aginst them makes a huge gouge which cant be fixed the panel has to be replaced as for a big dent can be pulled out. but i think the pros outweigh the cons due to no rust and lil dings which are not worth the money to fix id rather not spend 2k yr just on rust checks

[Tysonjw]

How about the saturn Quiet metal?

[VEGAS_SATURN]

Plastic doesn't dent, IT CRACKS! They don't show that on the commercials. It also scratches very easily. I have a cracked fender (no clue how it happened) and the gold paint popular on the S-series that once it fades a little is impossible to match.

I WOULD BUY A STEEL SATURN (if I was buying another Saturn). Actually, to be honest I would not buy one. If I had the cash for a new car I'd be picking up an 05 Mustang GT.

[DP49657]

NO! plain and simple. I have to drive 70 miles to get a Vue which if it wern't polymer I would opt for somthing else. We should own one in january. I believe it's the 08's going to steel, so if we like this one we may buy another 07 BUT not if it's steel

[rswsc]

That's one of the reasons why I decided to get one. I figure with a new driver in the house and parking in school parking lots the car won't pickup nasty door dings.