02 Vue V6 - Electrical Problems

[vhayduk]

I'm seriously considering purchasing a 02 Vue 3.0l that has some unique electrical gremlins. The vehicle has a nice option set, AWD, low mileage and is in good shape which is why I'm considering it. The P/O had the vehicle at Saturn and it was diagnosed as needing a new ECM/ECU as it wasn't sending a PWM signal to the throttle body. Their diagnosis also included a sentence about the ECM not commanding the engine to reduce torque (retard timing) when shifting. As a matter of fact, it seemed like the ECM wasn't really "in control" of the timing as there also notes about running rough and backfiring at higher RPMs. Codes included P0123, P0222, P0638, P2100. They wanted $1700+ to replace the ECM which scared the P/O who had it towed home. It's been sitting several months and he now wants it out of his yard.

I inspected the vehicle and found that it is now responding to pedal input (so the TB / ECM isn't totally fried), although it runs rough, the SES light is on (obviously!) and in reduced power mode. I pulled the following memory codes: P0102, P0113, P0638, P0700, P1779, P1780, P1781, P2100, P2101, P2119

I cleared the codes, re-started it and the SES and RP lights were on and it ran the same as before, but I couldn't pull any codes with my generic scanner.

Here are my questions:

a) Does the dealer have to reprogram a replacement (used) ECM/BCM/TCM or do I simply have to do the Passlock relearn procedure to get them living happily together?

b) There seem to be several people on this board with very good "insider" info. Does anyone have a COMPLETE code list including the P2xxx codes?

c) I need a good scan-tool. I've been thinking about getting one for a while and if I purchase this vehicle, then I'll most certainly buy one. Is anyone aware of a scan-tool that can read all the codes from the Vue and has features similar to the Tech 2 (diagnostic tests, streaming data, data capture) that GM uses?

note: "Take it to the dealer" is NOT AN OPTION! If that's my only option in fixing this, then I won't buy it. I'm willing to take it to the dealer for something very specific (like programming a key code into the ECM), but not for repairs. I'm electrically proficient, have excellent troubleshooting skills and experience dealing with ECUs etc.

Thanks in advance!

Vince

[IMkenNY]

a) passlock relearn will work with a used ecm, dealership programming only required for a new ECM
b) i have a factory service manual if you need specific info
c) I picked up a tech2 off Ebay a few years ago, works great :)

[1saxman]

The Emissions Control Module is covered under the mandated 8 year/80,000 mile extended emissions warranty. Sounds like your VUE is still covered.

[vhayduk]

Thanks for the replys.

I'd love to get a tech2, but they seem to be a little more $ than I have to spend :D

As for warranty: unfortunately not an option. Yes I'm within 8 years and 80k miles but I'm in Canada. No extended warranty here :mad:

Vince

[vhayduk]

I've read several differing opinions on what OBDII interface is used on this vehicle. Some say VPW, some CAN and some KWP2000. Note that this is the 3.0L (supposedly different than the 2.2L).

Please confirm?

Thanks!

Vince

[fdryer]

Here's one link for updated OBD II codes; http://www.myscantool.com/dtc/.

And you can use the Forum Jump below to find the How-to library on page 5 titled OBD II Powertrain Codes for a similar list.

I don't have my FSM in front of me but I think we're using can (controller area network) bus and kwp2000 (keyword protocol). CAN communications is over a two-wire link among the ECM, TCM, and BCM. I think kwp2000, if I'm not mistaken, along with pwm (pulse width modulation) and vpw (variable pulse width) are three different ways to talk to the reader/scanner plugged into the DLC, the comm port under the steering wheel.

For added confusion; http://www.obd-codes.com/faq/obd-ii-protocols.php

[vhayduk]

I decided to go ahead with it and picked up the Vue yesterday. Spent some time working on it last night. Looking after some maint. items and easy stuff first, then we'll dive deeper into the electrical problem.

I wanted to clean and re-seat the ECM connectors etc. Call me dumb, but where is the ECM? The module behind the battery on a plastic bracket looks suspiciously like the ECM, but it doesn't match up with the replacement one I've got (different physical size / different connector type and size).

Thanks!

Vince

[vhayduk]

Did some more looking around and found the ECM. Dumb me missed it the first go round :dizzy: I still want to know though: what is the other (silver metal unit with two large black connectors) device behind the battery?

For the record, since I couldn't find this info posted anywhere: 2002 / 2003 Vue V6 ECM / ECU / PCM is located on the drivers side of the engine about 1/2 way down. It's fastened to the engine by a metal bracket and obscured by the battery box. You need an e-torx socket or wrench to remove it.

Vince

[3RedLines]

Transmission control Module

[vhayduk]

Thanks 3redlines.

Got the computer out. The info off it is:

190152
26SA8423
0 261 206 773
19027
6929
55 350 683
LW

I have a computer the wrecker says fits:

287171
1039S00986
0 261 206 773
28725
3844
12 579 321
WA

Does anyone have information from a parts interchange system or happen to understand the part numbering to know if these really do interchange? A lot of numbers seem to be different.

Physically they are the same, but that means very little.

Thanks!

Vince