Major VUE VTi Problems

[c77man]

I had ordered a FWD 4 VTi on 10/19/02... Just picked it Thursday night 11/14/02 @ about 8pm. And by Friday @ 8:30pm was taking it back to the dealer due to MAJOR problems.....


I was turning into traffic and the VUE started to putter... I would have moments of control and then nothing, almost like it didn’t have any gas left in the tank (and it still was half full). This would continue for about 1 mile and then everything would seem fine.

I then needed to get onto the highway, same puttering and a little bucking… But once on the highway the real interesting stuff began to happen.

While trying to accelerate, all of the other problems came back again, then the RPMs flew up to 5000-5500 from maybe 2500-3000 I immediately began to decelerate and the speedometer began to zip around from 0-130 mph. As my dealer later stated, it was as if the car was possessed.

I got it to the dealer, which is handling this great by the way. They set me up with a loaner VUE (not as nice) and worked on it all day today 11/16/02 to try and find the problem.

They looked into all the mechanical possibilities and found nothing…..

Then they thought maybe it could be a loose ground to one of the computers… Nope


Then they tried to run a complete diagnostic on the computer and lost communication with it, telling me they may have to call Tennessee to get some help on this one.

So my question is…. Am I the only one to have this type of problem on a VUE?

Does this sound computer related? (does to me)

This thing had less than 200 miles on it when this happened, and less than 30 hours of my ownership…. I waited longer to get this vehicle then I have owned it, and then to have this happen….

This is my 3rd Saturn, and my second one purchased this year…. All of the other ones are running GREAT even the 93SL with 187,000 plus miles on it runs like new (I’ve only replaced the the battery!!!) Within my family we own 5 Saturns….. 4 just from purchases this year (waiting for our thank you gift from Saturn… I wish)

Sounds selfish, but I don’t want to have to wait for a replacement…. Most of the options I put on are hard to get and if I’m buying new…. I want what I want, I’m not willing to SETTLE for something on hand…


Your thoughts are appreciated on this (my first post to this GREAT forum and site)…

Thanks all,

Curren

[spencerb]

Although the techs don't know what the problem is at this time, it still could be something simple. Replacing the computer could do the trick.

You have lots of time left on your 30 day moneyback gaurantee. You may want to consider ordering a new one now (w/ no obligation) just in case this problem isn't easily resolved. That way you'll have this VUE or at least a loaner almost until your new one comes in. Just tell them you want another one ordered just in case your VUE's problems are major and could lead to more problems down the road. But still give the techs the benefit of the doubt to fix the problem correctly the first time.

[OhioVueBoy]

Hrm, sounds like a TCM and/or BCM issue to me. This is the first time I have ever heard of any problem with the VTi so far.
~D.J.~

[woowoo]

Refuse the car and get another one period.

There is no excuse.

[c77man]

Just to give all of you an update....

I got the VUE back after two full days in the shop… and was told nothing was wrong with the vehicle… That it was operating as designed, according to the paperwork.
They told me that the reason they couldn’t fix it was they couldn’t recreate the problem… said they even called Tennessee, they didn’t provide any help.

Well not two full days into having it again, same crap happened all over. This time I was about a mile from the dealer… had one hop in with me and they were able to experience the entire episode. We head back to let someone else give it a try, and nothing. The thing drove fine.

I have another loaner…. And will be looking at another VUE today. Thank God for 30 day return policy!!!

Thanks for the opinions all…

[mr weather]

DEFINITELY get a new one!! This could be just the beginning of a whole host of potential problems.:dizzy:

Even if you have to wait on the new one it'll more than make up for all those days you'll wait while your original VUE is in the shop for the umpteenth time.

Good luck!

[ARECCE]

Do you suppose that you can let the technicians try and find out what the concern with the vehicle is before you go down the path of the 30 day buyback? Nearly every post with a with a vehicle concern immediately recommends to turn the vehicle back in.

In the back of your mind you have to remember, "what if I get a vehicle with a bigger concern." Pretty hard to go buy-back when you have already used up your opportunity.

The 30 day guarantee is a great tool. But, with as with anything else, people abuse it. Oh, the car is too small, I don't like the color, etc, etc.

There are reasons to get a different vehicle and there are reasons not to.

Think before you jump.

[Tatusmi]

Originally posted by ARECCE
The 30 day guarantee is a great tool. But, with as with anything else, people abuse it. Oh, the car is too small, I don't like the color, etc, etc.I agree that the 30 day money back is a great tool.... and I also agree that people abuse it... but I REALLY think this would not be abuse of the policy... this is a serious issue... not simply a disliking to the color.

- Tatusmi

[ricksLS1]

Originally posted by ARECCE
Do you suppose that you can let the technicians try and find out what the concern with the vehicle is before you go down the path of the 30 day buyback? Nearly every post with a with a vehicle concern immediately recommends to turn the vehicle back in.

In the back of your mind you have to remember, "what if I get a vehicle with a bigger concern." Pretty hard to go buy-back when you have already used up your opportunity.

The 30 day guarantee is a great tool. But, with as with anything else, people abuse it. Oh, the car is too small, I don't like the color, etc, etc.

There are reasons to get a different vehicle and there are reasons not to.

Think before you jump.

The techs said "Operating as designed". That was there chance. Up to the customer to give one more chance or a new one.

[ARECCE]

There are times when a vehicle comes in with a customer complaint that can not be duplicated. This could be due to any number of reasons. It could be the tech's fault. Perhaps the customer did not describe the concern in full. This could cause the tech to go on a wild goose chase. We are talking about a piece of machinery with many moving parts. Perhaps the Saturn Facility should have kept the vehicle and drove it. But, how long do they drive it. And, we might not know the whole story concerning the description of the fault, the conversation between the customer and the service consultant and anyone else that was involved.

What if the VTI was at fault. Should the customer get a new vehicle or should the tech install a new transmission? The only difference is that the customer now will probably have to wait for a vehicle to be located. Pretty sure that transmissions are in stock somewhere in the system.

Now, if the concern was a major safety issue and the customer did not feel comfortable in the vehicle, then by all means they should get out of the vehicle and into another one. The vehicle do come with a 3yr/36K wty. That is to cover parts that fail prematurely. The quality control on the parts made is good, but not foolproof. Parts fail either due to normal use or abuse. There usually isn't another reason for the failure.

Hopefully c77man will let us know what was wrong with the vehicle.

[hugh]

...............but note that someone from service dept did in fact ride in vehicle on second go around when problem reared its ugly head again.:redjump:

[ARECCE]

Sure, due to the vehicle acting up again down the road from the facility. My thought was that, perhaps the facility could have kept the vehicle after the first go-round.

The question was and still is "should c77man get another vehicle or have the vehicle that he has be repaired?" Personally I would vote for the repair. I believe that the techs working on these vehicle are competent and will obtain help from Saturn Corp. There are extensive avenues that technicians can use for the diag and repair of the vehicles.

Let's wait and see what the concern is and what the repair is before we (and do we matter) go and give advice to the owner of the vehicle.

[c77man]

All I'll say is that I have owned that VUE for 8 days... and it has been at the dealership for 6 of those 8 days....

They called me today about the problem, and still don't know what it is, and they have been calling everyone they can.

I drive 150 miles a day for work.... I need a car I can trust. And this one is not it!


Keep in mind... this is my second new saturn this year (3rd total)... I don't return things because of the color. I have never even had a problem remotely close to this.

They had one chance and nothing.... a few other little things that I was scheduled to have fixed before the crap hit the fan again, put me in the place of "if one more thing goes wrong with this car..." And this is one BIG wrong thing. I ordered what I wanted... Now I'm settling for what they have. I found out if I ordered a new one I would be unable to get it before the end of January 03!!!!
I, unfortuantely have to drive to work.... so I need a car ASAP, I'm not going to wait for them to hopefully fix the problem.

Just venting.... this entire mess has put me in a very bad mood.....
:x

[ARECCE]

What makes you think that any vehicle out there is going to live up to your expectations? Give they guy's a chance. You havn't had to pay for the rental car have you? Maybe you should get another vehicle. That doesn't guarantee that you won't have a problem with the new one. It doesn't matter what vehicle you purchase, you might still have a problem.

I would venture to say that the Saturn Facility will be going out of their way to get you back your vehicle. They don't want a buy-back on their lot. They would rather you keep the one that you have. But, they will take it back if you want them to. You need to weigh all of your options.

One word of advice. The loud customers are usually helped to quiet them down, but they are remembered for what they do and not who they are, "customers". Treat the Saturn people with respect and they will do whatever they can to get your VUE experience back to the positive side of the spectrum.

[BobL]

Wouldn't hesitate a moment in returning it. Electrical gremlins like this can be really ugly.

Do remember that you can only use the moneyback policy once per model year. If you take another Saturn of the same year and it's a dog (very remote chance), you'll have to either let them fix it or go lemon law.

If you totally distrust the VUE now, might be better to just get your money back.

Great Saturn has thios policy.

[c77man]

They went over the lemon law with me when we were discussing the 30 day policy... I would need it to be in three times in one year, and I already have two (in one week).

We both agreed (dealer and myself) that 30 day was best way.

Oh and by the way... I have not been loud about this... the dealer has even thanked me for my understanding, and I have been very apologetic. They have gone out of their way for me to be happy. But keep in mind I have had a relationship with this dealer for 8 years... They still get my vote for the BEST dealership I have ever delt with. And my dealer Mike.... wouldn't want anyone else.

I'm aware of the conditions of the 30 day return, as I didn't decide to do this until after the problem came back a second time... and I took a long night of thought to come to the decision. Out of the 6 people I asked about the return... all said sounds like the best option.

I'll be going from a 4 cyl. VTi to a V6 with the 5 speed auto. It was a dealer demo with about 450 miles on it... so it is over the 196 mile problem mark that cursed me....

[baskerj]

Originally posted by c77man
I drive 150 miles a day for work.... I need a car I can trust. And this one is not it!


Then you should probably go with a technology that is tried and true right? If I were you and you "really" wanted a VUE, I'd either go with the V6 auto...or the manual if you can't afford the V6.

I will say, I do really like my VUE (V6), however, mine was in the shop almost weekly the first two months (March when they just came out).

[baskerj]

Originally posted by ARECCE
One word of advice. The loud customers are usually helped to quiet them down, but they are remembered for what they do and not who they are, "customers". Treat the Saturn people with respect and they will do whatever they can to get your VUE experience back to the positive side of the spectrum.

Sad but true. I got upset, voiced my concern, and dealt with the Service Manager directly. He now greets me every single time I'm in there...and he knows my name and won't forget me. I really don't care if he remembers me for who I am...OR what I did. The fact is...he remembers me...and he puts his best guy on the job every time ;)

John

[Galileo]

Originally posted by c77man
Oh and by the way... I have not been loud about this... the dealer has even thanked me for my understanding, and I have been very apologetic. They have gone out of their way for me to be happy. But keep in mind I have had a relationship with this dealer for 8 years... They still get my vote for the BEST dealership I have ever delt with. And my dealer Mike.... wouldn't want anyone else.
The biggest compliment you can give to this facility and sales consultant is to stop calling them a "dealer" and refer to them as the "retailer" that they are. ;)

[c77man]

My apologies for the wrong titles…

Just to give all an update, from what I was told by the retailer, they are shipping my vehicle back to Tennessee upon request by Saturn.

The techs at my retailer couldn’t fix the problem and tech support at Saturn wants to take a close look at it.

I will say this, knowing that a manufacturer is this proactive makes me feel very good to be a Saturn owner…

Just picked up my V6 AWD SE Yellow VUE....
:p

Thanks ALL

[RojoVue]

We own a V6 AWD Vue and some time back had an experience with the drivability of our Vue that took a little over a week to resolve. We were headed home from a trip on a Sunday afternoon, about 30 miles from home, driving along about 75 MPH with the cruise control engaged when suddenly the engine stumbled bigtime, just like the ignition had been switched off. I thought the cruise had developed a problem and switched it off. A couple of miles later the engine stumbled again. Gas gauge was reading about 1/2 tank, but I pulled over to see if the gas cap was lose, but it was snug. While sitting at the edge of the road, the tranny in park, the engine idle began to occasionally fluctuate about 500 RPMs.

Being Sunday we decided we'd finish the trip home and call the 'dealer' Monday morning. While driving along the Service Engine Soon light then came on. We were getting near town now and realized that our car would accelerate pretty much as normal from a traffic light but if I had to slow from 55 MPH down to maybe 25 MPH because of slowing traffic, the transmission was not kicking down into a lower gear, and getting back up to speed was taking place in 5th gear. As we turned onto the suburb street we live on, the car began to accelerate from about 15 MPH without my foot on the gas, and I had to nail the brakes while the engine RPMs came back down and it quit accelerating on it's own.

When the service department got a hold of our Vue, a whole bunch of codes showed up, they cleared the Service Engine Soon light, but of course could not duplicate the problem. They fiddled with this and that, checking connections, etc. When I picked up the car after work I got about 1/2 mile from the 'dealership' when it began acting up again. Back at the service department they checked for codes again, got the same ones again. But none of it made sense to them as to the drivability issue. And of course after they shut the engine off and restarted it, it ran fine. They kept our car and gave us a new L300.

The service manager called a factory service tech who came up from Tennessee within a couple of days and took our Vue for a couple of days. He and the service manager went thru all sorts of gyrations trying to get our Vue to act up. Eventually it was determined the butterfly valve in the throttle body was sticking. A new throttle body was overnighted from the factory, installed the next day. The service manager kept our car for a couple more days to make sure things were okay. So after almost 300 miles and a week of chasing what they thought was going to be an electronic issue, it was a mechanical problem. Haven't had any related drivability problems since.

We were disappointed that our Vue was having problems but did not put on a display of rage and shouting about the problem. I've never seen an instance where yelling or berating the service writer, service manager and the techs ever gets you outstanding, competent service. During the time our Vue was with the service department and the problem being diagosed, the service manager would call me late every afternoon to let me know what had transpired with our car during the day, even if they'd made no real progress at finding a specific cause.

Yes, the service writer and manager know me by name now, but I feel in a good way. We stopped by the service department the other morning as we were headed out on a 200 mile trip. It was kinda misting out, the chance of a trace of snow was predicted at our destinantion and the 8 month old wiper blades where chattering and squeaking. I got new blades installed immediately by the service writer himself, and sent on our way, no charge, all within 15 minutes.

[baskerj]

Originally posted by RojoVue
We were disappointed that our Vue was having problems but did not put on a display of rage and shouting about the problem. I've never seen an instance where yelling or berating the service writer, service manager and the techs ever gets you outstanding, competent service.

Yes, the service writer and manager know me by name now, but I feel in a good way.

Being loud is not "yelling or berating" people...well okay, it can be...but you can be loud politically...without even having to raise your voice.

[Dr. Bob]

How about being firm and insistent.

[MyPointofVUE]

I posted this on the general thread, but it looks like it fits here.
"Possessed Vue" sounds very familiar to what I was trying to describe...

Saturn of Greenville hadn't heard of the problem, I guess I should point this thread out to them when/if it happens again.

Here's what I posted earlier:

VUE with a mind of it's own?

I've owned my VUE for less than a month and everything has been working fine until coming back from VA after thanksgiving. After stopping for lunch, we were pulling back onto the interstate when the vehicle lurched, the speedometer and tach went crazy (speedometer was racing between 30 and 80 mph when the weren't moving more than 20 mph). Thank goodness we were in a traffic jam or I would have had to pull completely off the road!

Well it sounded like the engine was in I or a lower gear, because if you pressed the gas, the speedometer would go crazy again, but the engine sounded like is was braking. I checked to see if I had inadvertantly put it into I instead of D but that wasn't the case. We tried moving putting in in I and moving it back to D. That didn't work. The only "fix" we could find was coming to a complete stop and putting the car in park and then moving it back to drive.

Since then, the same episode has a occurred 2 more times on seperate days. All other times it runs just fine. I just got back from Saturn and they couldn't find anything wrong with it. The Service manager took it for a drive and I went out with the mgr. We couldn't replicate it.

Anyone got any thoughts? It's a 4cyl. VTi AWD automatic
:whoa:

[c77man]

Sounds exactly like what happened to me.... the service manager at my retailer couldn't figure it out either.... they have a few ideas but didn't or couldn't try them after I returned it for a V6


No problems with that one...

Best of luck and if you find out what it is please let me know....

[purplesuit]

I had a similar problem with my Vue 4 cyl. VTI. One day after driving about 80 miles over the mountains I was driving up a hill and the speedometer went crazy. I was going about 40 but the speedo fluctuated as high as 90. I thought maybe wheel slippage but the road was just a little wet, no snow. My friend saw it happen too. I think the engine may have coughed a little but that could have been me letting up on the gas.

About 1/2 hour later I started up from a stop sign and the speedo fluctuated from 20 to 30 a couple of times. I was driving carefully at that point, not stepping on the gas very much.

Took it to the dealer a few days later and they found nothing. Hasn't happened since.

[MyPointofVUE]

Hi Purplesuit,

Is your VTI AWD or FWD?

I reported my problem back in December and haven't had a problem since, so hopefully it was something that won't occur again.

It's definitely a wierd feeling when it happens though!

My brother is a service writer and when I describe the symptoms he said it sounded like a glitch in the speedometer sensor. So basically the VTI didn't know how to adjust the rpms because it was temporarily unable to get an accurate speed reading.

However since the problem hasn't occured again, I haven't gotten a chance to bring this theory up with the service dept.

[purplesuit]

Hi, it's an AWD.

My service dept suggested speedometer sensor when I talked to them on the phone. I presume they checked that when I brought it in.

FWIW, they found no error codes in the computer. Like I said before, it happened twice on one trip (without a restart of the car) and has not happened since. I am not concerned about it at all.

My bigger concern right now is getting the right fluid back into my transfer case (aka "power take off") that I accidentally emptied out.

[sscianis]

OKay, this sounds like a similar problem I have. My 4 Cyc FWD VUE 2003 is acting like I have a 5th wheel attached to it. I step on the gas, the RPMS zoom, but the car creeps along. This has been going on for about 2 weeks. Took it back to the dealer Friday and they said they would need to keep it. They called Spring Hills, they had no clue. So here I am almost a week later, no rental car (I still have my VUE) and the car still has problems. It is a real treat when you step on the gas making a left and nothing happens.

I am at 4500 miles. Frankly, I think Saturn should buy the car back and figure out the problem on their own time. I spent 20gs on the car. If I wanted to me a test dummy, I would have asked to be.

The dealership is being great about the whole thing, as far as being nice (which I am keeping my cool as well). But so far their actions, or lack of, speak louder than words.

If this had happned under 1500/30 days, they would own it!

[purplesuit]

sscianis:
It sounds like you have the VTI transmission. If so, I have noticed some occassions where the transmission "doesn't engage". Mostly when I was fooling with it (e.g. putting it in neutral and then back into drive). Fortunately on my commute I don't have to make a lot of left turns!